WeeHectorPar Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Please don't boycott Stenhousemuir. It will cause social unrest. Does anyone even bother to go to Stenny matches? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Don of the South Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 At first I was afraid, I was petrifiedKept believing all the shite about if Rangers diedBut then I spent so many nights thinking how you did me wrongand I grew strong and I said F*** the Old Firm 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HTG Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Here's a test of logic. The SPL refused Newco entry to their league on grounds of sporting integrity. The SFA (and SPL) are determined to ensure that Newco appear (as if by magic) in SFL1. Where is the fuckin integrity in that??? You can't have it both ways. Either integrity doesn't matter a fvck - in which case they go straight into the SPL and a lot of people find something else to do or integrity does matter and you need to treat them the same as you would Spartans or Clydebank. Those running the game cannot claim sporting integrity and set it alongside financial necessity to the point where they desperately shoehorn a NEW FUCKIN TEAM into a league without them having to compete in the bottom 50% of that structure. In terms of outcomes this is the worst of all. Because they are made to look like spiteful b*****ds in the first instance and greedy fuckers in the second. In fact, they become everything the Rangers Media Orcs have said they are. If Newco get into SFL1 then the game is even more fucked under the current ruling authority than anyone could have imagined possible. I said about 30 pages ago that the outcome of all of this no longer matters. Because it is no longer a question of SFL clubs doing the right thing. Even if they do, every single person on the planet now knows that Doncaster, Regan, Ogilvie and others have no comprehension of what "doing the right thing" means. Unless everyone of them is hunted from Hampden then there is no hope for our game. What they seek to protect will be rotten to the core. They'd be as well not bothering because a lot of clubs are going to go anyway once their supporters see what a complete fuckin stitch up is taking place in Hampden. To repeat - even if Rangers are in the 3rd by the end of July the game is finished because those running it are utterly corrupt. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoonsLad Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 I have just mailed this to the Stenny director. It won't do much good I am sure, but I was raging and needed to do something. Dear Mr Darroch,I am writing to express my extreme disappointment in your short-sighted and frankly disgraceful decision to vote to allow the new Rangers football club direct entry into the Scottish first division next season. By your and your fellow directors' decision, you have killed any idea that football in this country remains a sport played out between member clubs on a level playing field. What is the point in continuing with this game, one that I have no doubt you love as much as myself. The scaremongering, lies, deceit and bullying that SFL clubs have been placed under by the footballing authorities in the country, in collusion with the mainstream media, has been nothing short of a disgrace and I am extremely saddened you have allowed your club to be persuaded by this parcel of rogues. On the final day of last season, my son and I enjoyed an excellent day out at your club as we supported our team, Forfar Athletic. The result that day obviously suited us but your club too benefited from our combined entrance money, the souvenirs and the refreshments we purchased before and during the match. This was not the first time we have made the trip together and for myself in particular, there have been numerous visits throughout the years I have supported Forfar. These trips will mow be a thing of the past. Neither myself nor my son will ever visit your ground again in light of your decision to throw all notion of sporting integrity in Scotland out the window. I am sure you will not lose much sleep at the thought of missing out on £19 admission money, twice a season, plus a few more pounds on souvenirs and refreshments. However, you will also be missing out on this for the rest of my days I am able to continue supporting Forfar = hopefully another 40 years or so, 60 for my son. It starts to add up then, Mr Darroch. And the real point is I am just one person. my son a second. There will be a third and fourth and dozens others from Forfar Athletic alone. And more from supporters of Brechin City, Arbroath, Queen of the South, East Fife, Dumbarton and the other teams in our division. This season, next season and many, many more after. Supporters have long memories; fans from teams in other divisions will also boycott your club if they draw you in cup competitions. How would you feel as a supporter of Stenhousemuir if the SFA or the SFL came to you and told you on day one of the season: "It doesn't really matter what the score is today, because we have already decided that at the end of the campaign, Queen of the South are going to be promoted. They are a bigger club than yours, they have more fans so they are more important". Because that is what the powers that be in Scottish football are attempting to do at the moment and they will succeed with your support. But it is not too late. Fans of every other team in Scotland are pledging to stand by teams that stand strong themselves. I will make the return to Ochilview twice this season, I will spend extra in your shops. But only if you reverse this morally wrong and unjust decision and vote against a new Rangers being allowed to circumvent all the rules that your club and my club would have to live by. Thank you for taking the time to read this and I hope, I truly hope, that you do the right thing for the good of the game in Scotland. Allowing a new Rangers to start in the first division is the real "slow, lingering death" of Scottish football. Yours, LoonsLad <br class="Apple-interchange-newline"> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rustyarabnuts Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 As have I. and me and Ive mailed ArbroathFC asking what their position is (Their former manager/player, John McGlashan is the wifes cousin) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45 Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 @Martin1Williams: #Rangers AllyMcCoist on newco LeedsU getting 15pt deduction in Div1 "I know it's a different FA some might say a more understanding one" McCoist is now as bad a Lennon. It will be another great day in Scottish football when he is punted, especially if he is turned on by the Sevco fans. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 To the tune of 'the referrees a wanka" "You aren't even rangers" or "why don't you go home, why don't you go home Your'e not the rangers, why don't you go home" "You're not Rangers any more" would seem to be the most obvious one. "Won f**k all and never will" will be a good one as well. Ironically, from most diddy clubs, is good enough, but Queens Park / Dumbarton / East Fife fans can bring cardboard cups with them to wave about. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share Posted July 5, 2012 @Martin1Williams: #Rangers AllyMcCoist on newco LeedsU getting 15pt deduction in Div1 "I know it's a different FA some might say a more understanding one" McCoist is now as bad a Lennon. It will be another great day in Scottish football when he is punted, especially if he is turned on by the Sevco fans. McCoist, Jardine, Brown, and Traynor are sounding increasingly desperate. I can understand McCoist feeling hurt, tired, and drained by it all. In my mind, I picture all of them as Harrison Ford in Blade Runner, hanging onto that ledge by their fingers, and are spitting defiantly up into the face of their enemies before..... some daft cnut grabs them and hauls them up into Division 1. Fcuk you Ridley Scott, you BASTURT. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
P45 Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 I have just mailed this to the Stenny director. It won't do much good I am sure, but I was raging and needed to do something. Dear Mr Darroch,I am writing to express my extreme disappointment in your short-sighted and frankly disgraceful decision to vote to allow the new Rangers football club direct entry into the Scottish first division next season. By your and your fellow directors' decision, you have killed any idea that football in this country remains a sport played out between member clubs on a level playing field. What is the point in continuing with this game, one that I have no doubt you love as much as myself. The scaremongering, lies, deceit and bullying that SFL clubs have been placed under by the footballing authorities in the country, in collusion with the mainstream media, has been nothing short of a disgrace and I am extremely saddened you have allowed your club to be persuaded by this parcel of rogues. On the final day of last season, my son and I enjoyed an excellent day out at your club as we supported our team, Forfar Athletic. The result that day obviously suited us but your club too benefited from our combined entrance money, the souvenirs and the refreshments we purchased before and during the match. This was not the first time we have made the trip together and for myself in particular, there have been numerous visits throughout the years I have supported Forfar. These trips will mow be a thing of the past. Neither myself nor my son will ever visit your ground again in light of your decision to throw all notion of sporting integrity in Scotland out the window. I am sure you will not lose much sleep at the thought of missing out on £19 admission money, twice a season, plus a few more pounds on souvenirs and refreshments. However, you will also be missing out on this for the rest of my days I am able to continue supporting Forfar = hopefully another 40 years or so, 60 for my son. It starts to add up then, Mr Darroch. And the real point is I am just one person. my son a second. There will be a third and fourth and dozens others from Forfar Athletic alone. And more from supporters of Brechin City, Arbroath, Queen of the South, East Fife, Dumbarton and the other teams in our division. This season, next season and many, many more after. Supporters have long memories; fans from teams in other divisions will also boycott your club if they draw you in cup competitions. How would you feel as a supporter of Stenhousemuir if the SFA or the SFL came to you and told you on day one of the season: "It doesn't really matter what the score is today, because we have already decided that at the end of the campaign, Queen of the South are going to be promoted. They are a bigger club than yours, they have more fans so they are more important". Because that is what the powers that be in Scottish football are attempting to do at the moment and they will succeed with your support. But it is not too late. Fans of every other team in Scotland are pledging to stand by teams that stand strong themselves. I will make the return to Ochilview twice this season, I will spend extra in your shops. But only if you reverse this morally wrong and unjust decision and vote against a new Rangers being allowed to circumvent all the rules that your club and my club would have to live by. Thank you for taking the time to read this and I hope, I truly hope, that you do the right thing for the good of the game in Scotland. Allowing a new Rangers to start in the first division is the real "slow, lingering death" of Scottish football. Yours, LoonsLad Good mail. The guy sounds like a Bomber Brown type heavy duty Currant. He'll get to it when he finishes signing the Sash. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wokcomble Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 My son is a Stenny fan so the fact there are no forseeable trips to Ochilview if they vote yes is a complete pisser. The fact their chairman has the ability, which is sadly lacking in Scottish football, to string together more than two relatively articulate and correctly punctuated sentences (or perhaps their secretary is just very competent) should not detract from the craven nature of their statement. Firstly, their statement takes no account of the financial impact of any supporter boycott, probably relatively minimal though unfortunately, or the additional financial advantage they could have from Rangers visiting twice in 2013/14 both in increased crowds and sponsorship opportunities. Admittedly, it would be relatively shortsighted to assume 100% that this would happen (as Stenny could be relegated to Div 3 the same season Rangers got promoted) but could have been taken into account. Secondly, and miles more importantly, the talk of needing to look after Stenny's interests and not "punishing" Rangers is complete rubbish. Even ignoring the point about "punishing" Rangers (which has been made many times) effectively they are making clear that they believe in enforcing rules and precedents or not solely on the basis that it leads to benefit for their squalid entity. Thirdly, Stenny talk repeatedly about the financial difficulties they will be under and I believe these are probably relatively accurate (although the initial point in this point still stands). However, their argument is effectively a) we will be in trouble for year one, b) they will need to make severe cuts to manage in the short-term. I recognise this is a difficult situation but there are other teams who would be in even more trouble who have not cravenly backed down in this way. Nowhere at all in this statement does it say the club will be in severe danger of administration if Rangers go into Division Three, something I'm sure they'd have made clear if it was the case, merely that things will be tough for them for a while. Their statement that Rangers being in Division Three means that "Dependent on the success of hiring the pitch we would potentially reduce the playing budget in year 2" even suggests that they might only "potentially" (not even "probably") have to make savings to the playing budget! IF ANY 1ST DIVISION CLUB VOTE YES, THEY SHOULD BE BOYCOTTED Fourthly, not a single mention whatsoever about the view of Stenny supporters. They mention that they had been contacted frequently for their views but do not state at all that (unless I'm completely wrong) the majority of Stenny fans would be against this. Not one mention whatsoever - instead mealy mouthed words about the board being asked their opinion. This statement manages to be very honest (supposedly) about the financial situation but not a single word about the supporters they should be listening to. Shocking. Sixth, it has been known for a long time that Rangers going into Division Three was an option - Stenny were willingly signing players at the start of last month so if they ended up lumbered with unpayable wages through Rangers going into Division Three it is partly their own fault. Trying to be fair, they'd be completely hamstringing themselves if they didn't sign anyone at all as it would make them relegation favourites but a) no mention of this in the statement about their wage bill and b) other clubs who have signed players have still come out with strong "no" statements. Seventh, there is not a huge amount of clarity around what exactly they are asking for in terms of a "stronger and more equitable league structure". However, given that their entire statement reeks of "we have no option financially but to allow this" they've effectively reduced any leverage they might have. Points 8-139 deleted in the interests of retaining some semblance of brevity Again, trying to be fair to Stenny, it is in many ways a relatively honest and articulate statement, but that doesn't make it any less disgusting. At least a few typos and grammatical errors would have added some humour... Edited to state that I was so pissed off I left out point number 5. Rest assured that it was damn good though... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeGeeOneHamer Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Queen of the South's statement. My link Seems they will let the fans know after they decide what to do. I have a very very bad feeling what our Chairman will say. I know for 100% fact that even before this all kicked off in February that the rumours were enough to have senior QOS figures saying Scottish football needed Rangers at all costs. I do hope that stance has waned. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 If we're going to compare FA's etc... Fiorentina were entered to 5th division after liquidation I believe. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Highland Dogma Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 In an earlier post, someone outlined the massive running costs that any new Sevco XI would still have, but with 3rd Div crowds / prices / sponsorship - etc... Got me thinking. With a threadbare squad, I think they would still be a lot better than their Div 3 rivals - but this same squad parachuted into a bloody hard league with steet-wise outfits like Falkirk, Dunfermline/Dundee, Partick... and more... they could struggle. From a financial POV, the argument from nappy-clarting prophets of doom is that they want Rangers back in the SPL as quickly as humanly possible, so having them start in Div 3 is a killer. As I have suggested, Div 1 will be a helluva' lot harder to crack. Not so sure that a newco parachuted into Div 1 would guarantee that quick return that the suits crave. Just a thought. Was me...getting pished of with people saying they would walk the league system when they clearly have no concept of what it takes to operate an entity like rfc / newco commercially. I said earlier that had H&D punted all but utterly non essential staff at day 1 of admin they would have a better chance, but realistically costs in sfl3 would kill them. I stand by that entirely. Without access to an accurate p&l from oldo ( and lets be fair NO ONE incl hmrc has one of those ) i would speculate that even in sfl1 they would struggle hugely. They could charge more for season tickets but will still have the associated fixed costs that come from their facilities and TUPE workforce. If they were to struggle then it is likely that the crowds would flatline as they used to pre sdm...and given that newco must be sustainable (ie cannot just spend what it doesnt have like oldco did ) this would be a difficult cycle to break. From what i can gather even a basic banking facility as been difficult to obtain let alone one which allows credit.Question is would regan and doncaster (if still in position which is hard to see...pleeeeease ) fix the league system again? My personal belief is that the drip down revenue system that the suits are punting as an excuse to send newco as high as possible... is already a busted flush ( and they know this). Newco cannot pay what it cannot afford so cannot afford to pay players who will guarantee trophies..which guarantee full houses which attract sponsors / sky. Regan and doncaster for me arent trying to save anything or anyone but newco. What if for instance...they went through all this pain to push newco up even to spl...and they were playing in front of empty houses trying to avoid relegation? Regan and doncaster have talked down our game so much that it gives sky and sponsors and excuse to leave and new ones to negotiate piss poor terms. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
veteran Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 (edited) Listening to David Longmuir aka Quisling , it would appear that he is pressuring SFL clubs into a yes for Newco in Div 1 by offering the carrot of league re-construction. Maybe I've missed something but The SFL can still demand re-construction for admitting Newco to Div 3 if enough clubs have the balls to do it. Edited July 5, 2012 by veteran 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pozbaird Posted July 5, 2012 Author Share Posted July 5, 2012 (edited) Was me...getting pished of with people saying they would walk the league system when they clearly have no concept of what it takes to operate an entity like rfc / newco commercially. I said earlier that had H&D punted all but utterly non essential staff at day 1 of admin they would have a better chance, but realistically costs in sfl3 would kill them. I stand by that entirely. Without access to an accurate p&l from oldo ( and lets be fair NO ONE incl hmrc has one of those ) i would speculate that even in sfl1 they would struggle hugely. They could charge more for season tickets but will still have the associated fixed costs that come from their facilities and TUPE workforce. If they were to struggle then it is likely that the crowds would flatline as they used to pre sdm...and given that newco must be sustainable (ie cannot just spend what it doesnt have like oldco did ) this would be a difficult cycle to break. From what i can gather even a basic banking facility as been difficult to obtain let alone one which allows credit.Question is would regan and doncaster (if still in position which is hard to see...pleeeeease ) fix the league system again? My personal belief is that the drip down revenue system that the suits are punting as an excuse to send newco as high as possible... is already a busted flush ( and they know this). Newco cannot pay what it cannot afford so cannot afford to pay players who will guarantee trophies..which guarantee full houses which attract sponsors / sky. Regan and doncaster for me arent trying to save anything or anyone but newco. What if for instance...they went through all this pain to push newco up even to spl...and they were playing in front of empty houses trying to avoid relegation? Regan and doncaster have talked down our game so much that it gives sky and sponsors and excuse to leave and new ones to negotiate piss poor terms. Agree - Doncaster & Regan are surely dead men walking. The question is - will they wreak more havoc before we get rid? Their motives at present are highly questionable - and anything I've heard from my own club suggests that they are on borrowed time. Edited July 5, 2012 by pozbaird 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 Maybe I've missed something but The SFL can still demand re-construction for admitting Newco to Div 3 if enough clubs have the balls to do it. If the newco end up in SFL3 you'll quite possibly find that they'll be the ones agitating for reconstruction, if indeed they can even fulfil their first season's fixtures. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhiteRoseKillie Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 All that stuff is not about the end of the world. It's about change, and we are most certainly seeing a massive upheaval in Scottish football. The key point is not to fear change, accept it, welcome it, someting good comes out of it, however long that takes. When a hurricane is coming, you can build a windbreak or build a windmill - Confucius* *or mibbes I just made it up! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Remo Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 (edited) If we're going to compare FA's etc... Fiorentina were entered to 5th division after liquidation I believe. 4th division - then allowed to "skip" leagues on their way back to Serie A in a couple of seasons... Edited July 5, 2012 by Johnny Remo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thelegendthatis Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 (edited) From what has been said about the agreement they don't need to consult lawyers, it is an empty threat. It is never too soon to get your lawyers on the case. Kills all the fud and grandstanding nonsense from people like Doncaster. The SFL is there to do the best for their member clubs, not to try to defend the SPL nor protect Doncaster's job from the imminent P45. Time the SFL put him on the back foot and back to where he belongs, shuffling reports and Powerpoint presentations in a glass walled corner office at Hampden. Edited July 5, 2012 by thelegendthatis 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WBR Posted July 5, 2012 Share Posted July 5, 2012 @Martin1Williams: #Rangers AllyMcCoist on newco LeedsU getting 15pt deduction in Div1 "I know it's a different FA some might say a more understanding one" McCoist is now as bad a Lennon. It will be another great day in Scottish football when he is punted, especially if he is turned on by the Sevco fans. He'll be the only one aroused by them! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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