printer Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 (edited) 10 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said: ...............£120k plus any losses in the current year. Unless I'm missing something the loss of £190k in 2023 is actually an improvement on the loss of £240k for 2022. Although there was a large profit in 2021 which presumably at least mainly as a result of the extensive Covid grants in that year. Looks like these extra shares were issued in July 2023 and that Andrew Allan took on shares at that point also. Mulraney Holdings now own 57.38% whilst Andrew Allan owns 38.25% Thanks for this. Where can you see this information - companies house (not somewhere I'm familiar with). Edited March 4 by printer 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 (edited) 26 minutes ago, printer said: Both good points. Second one is key of course. I imagine Alloa Athletic's financial position is similar to a lot of smaller clubs in Scotland and better than quite a number too. I actually had a look across our division to see what the general position was as I expected to see losses pretty much across the board. I wasn't far wrong. Hamilton and Kelty use a June year end and haven't yet filed June 2023 accounts as they have to the end of March to do that. I had to look at June 2022 which isn't ideal. And Cove use an October year end bizarrely so their last filed accounts are mostly from their previous League One Championship season and partly from the first few months of the Championship one. Annan are a Community Benefit Society, not a company and don't publish accounts. Suffice to say however that as a members club they are pretty much condemned to trading more or less at a breakeven cash level year on year. Of the other 9, Hamilton lost more than £850k in their last published accounts! In a year where they would have received Premiership Parachute Payments. I don't know if they had asset impairments or something to lead to that. Edinburgh City made a profit in the year to May 2023 but they (and Kelty) file Micro accounts which are even more vague than Alloa's! I imagine they may have benefited from significant sponsorship from Forth Capital in that year. Everyone else made losses of somewhere between £60k (Kelty) and £190k (Queen of the South & Alloa). Falkirk, Cove, Montrose and Stirling all lost in excess of £100k also. You'd assume Cove's current figures are worse than they were in a season they won the league and played in the Championship. Edited March 4 by Skyline Drifter 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 2 minutes ago, printer said: Thanks for this. Where can you see this information - companies house (not somewhere I'm familiar with). The Confirmation Statement on Companies House as at the end of December 2023 has their current shareholdings out of 30,000 issued shares. Mike Mulraney has 15 in his own name as well as the controlling interest in Mulraney Holdings. Comparing retained profits between the 2023 and 2022 accounts and 2022 and 2021 accounts give the reported loss for the year. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeodhasXD Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 5 minutes ago, BFTD said: How long until the Indodrill sponsorship ends? Think it's next season. Was it not first year in the Championship for 10 years? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 2 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said: The Confirmation Statement on Companies House as at the end of December 2023 has their current shareholdings out of 30,000 issued shares. Mike Mulraney has 15 in his own name as well as the controlling interest in Mulraney Holdings. Comparing retained profits between the 2023 and 2022 accounts and 2022 and 2021 accounts give the reported loss for the year. Thanks m8, I'll have a look. Haven't really used Companies House for about thirty-five years! It certainly has changed, much easier to get information. Does that make your life easier? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 9 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said: I actually had a look across our division to see what the general position was as I expected to see losses pretty much across the board. I wasn't far wrong. Hamilton and Kelty use a June year end and haven't yet filed June 2023 accounts as they have to the end of March to do that. I had to look at June 2022 which isn't ideal. And Cove use an October year end bizarrely so their last filed accounts are mostly from their previous League One Championship season and partly from the first few months of the Championship one. Annan are a Community Benefit Society, not a company and don't publish accounts. Suffice to say however that as a members club they are pretty much condemned to trading more or less at a breakeven cash level year on year. Of the other 9, Hamilton lost more than £850k in their last published accounts! In a year where they would have received Premiership Parachute Payments. I don't know if they had asset impairments or something to lead to that. Edniburgh City made a profit in the year to May 2023 but they (and Kelty) file Micro accounts which are even more vague than Alloa's! I imagine they may have benefited from significant sponsorship from Forth Capital in that year. Everyone else made losses of somewhere between £60k (Kelty) and £190k (Queen of the South & Alloa). Falkirk, Cove, Montrose and Stirling all lost in excess of £100k also. You'd assume Cove's current figures are worse than they were in a season they won the league and played in the Championship. Good grief! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skyline Drifter Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Just now, printer said: Good grief! The irony of the one club in ten who reported a profit last season being the one who has subsequently had an insolvency event is not lost on me! It's pretty clear that clubs at this level are generally spending money they can't afford. Most of them have had money left over from Covid that they've been able to use over the last couple of years but I'd imagine that's largely run out now. I wonder if there will be a reset of wage levels at this level of football in the next few months? With our Board announcing that they are leaving at the end of the season last week after basically being in charge for about 15 years, it remains to be seen if someone else with wealth will step in or if we'll have to factor back our budget significantly. Hamilton, Alloa, Cove, Kelty and Edinburgh were being supported by businessmen also, though Kelty aren't now unless they've got someone else in, not sure? Falkirk are big enough to support their spending in practice although they've still apparently managed to lose a fortune over the last few years. I don't know enough about Stirling to know where the funding came from that let them overspend to that degree. I assume it's not a bottomless pit since as far as I know they are run by their Supporter's Trust. Also not sure if anyone bankrolls Montrose or if it's just run with the commercial income / gate receipts they get? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoganAAFC Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 3 hours ago, LeodhasXD said: I'm after goal of the season contenders. My short longlist for this season below. Kurtis Roberts vs Hamilton Taylor Steven vs Cove Taylor Steven vs Stirling Ally Roy vs Queen of the South Ally Roy vs Montrose Cammy O'Donnell vs Kelty Any others that I've forgotten? Rodden v Kelty? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 31 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said: The irony of the one club in ten who reported a profit last season being the one who has subsequently had an insolvency event is not lost on me! It's pretty clear that clubs at this level are generally spending money they can't afford. Most of them have had money left over from Covid that they've been able to use over the last couple of years but I'd imagine that's largely run out now. I wonder if there will be a reset of wage levels at this level of football in the next few months? With our Board announcing that they are leaving at the end of the season last week after basically being in charge for about 15 years, it remains to be seen if someone else with wealth will step in or if we'll have to factor back our budget significantly. Hamilton, Alloa, Cove, Kelty and Edinburgh were being supported by businessmen also, though Kelty aren't now unless they've got someone else in, not sure? Falkirk are big enough to support their spending in practice although they've still apparently managed to lose a fortune over the last few years. I don't know enough about Stirling to know where the funding came from that let them overspend to that degree. I assume it's not a bottomless pit since as far as I know they are run by their Supporter's Trust. Also not sure if anyone bankrolls Montrose or if it's just run with the commercial income / gate receipts they get? Fascinating stuff. Scottish football, eh? I've had a look at the Confirmation Statement you referenced. Expected to see three, maybe a couple more, separate shareholders, not SEVENTY-FIVE! There's quite a few names I recognise, some surprising some less so, but the vast majority I don't. Presumably they are historic. I know Mulraney tried to buy all existing shareholders out and when a couple of the larger ones at that time refused, he simply increased the share capital to make their holdings meaninless/worthless. They should have taken his generous offer IMO. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LeodhasXD Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 1 hour ago, Skyline Drifter said: It's pretty clear that clubs at this level are generally spending money they can't afford. I'd disagree that they can afford it... but only with investment from outside the footballing business. Football's surely a hobby for most of us that we won't get much return on investment. Most wealthy businessman can probably say the same about owning a football club. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BFTD Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 4 hours ago, LeodhasXD said: Think it's next season. Was it not first year in the Championship for 10 years? Sounds about right. Just checking as people are talking about money - the club obviously won't get as much if the naming rights are sold again in League One, but it's always something. There's a thread idea - most embarrassing sponsorships your club's ground could have. Not great if we got one of those wasp-killing pest control firms who stick adverts up at roundabouts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 53 minutes ago, BFTD said: There's a thread idea - most embarrassing sponsorships your club's ground could have. Not great if we got one of those wasp-killing pest control firms who stick adverts up at roundabouts. Could end up being sponsored by a popular kids comic and play our home games at the Beano Stadium. Only saving grace would be the different spellings 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigMartyn86 Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 6 hours ago, BFTD said: How long until the Indodrill sponsorship ends? Did we not announce it just before Rangers were due to start plastering Sports Direct all over Ibrox for a pound to wind them up prior to playing them? Sure there was a bit of fanfare over it and we also got some rubbish player from the Philippines who looked like Neymar or similar? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Father Barrys Sign (Top Half) Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 (edited) That timeline sounds about right- March 2015 so we are just at the end of year 9. I wonder what became of Levi Fernández. I'd be amazed if it still involves playing football. Edited March 4 by Father Barrys Sign (Top Half) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
printer Posted March 4 Share Posted March 4 Up to Andy Allan to top Mike's £100k deal plus inflation - let's see what he's made of. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoganAAFC Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 (edited) What we going for with these- seen on Twitter earlier on: Player of the Season: Surprise Package: Most Improved Player: Disappointment of the Season: Goal of the Season: Win of the Season: Loss of the Season: Signing of the Season: Edited March 5 by LoganAAFC 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 Player of the Season: Kurtis Roberts Surprise Package: Kurtis Roberts Most Improved Player: Steve Buchanan Disappointment of the Season: Euan Deveney Goal of the Season: Taylor Steven v Stirling Win of the Season: Hamilton away Loss of the Season: Stirling Albion at home Signing of the Season: Bobby Wales (if loans count) 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LoganAAFC Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 1 hour ago, Rory said: Player of the Season: Kurtis Roberts Surprise Package: Kurtis Roberts Most Improved Player: Steve Buchanan Disappointment of the Season: Euan Deveney Goal of the Season: Taylor Steven v Stirling Win of the Season: Hamilton away Loss of the Season: Stirling Albion at home Signing of the Season: Bobby Wales (if loans count) Certainly agree with most, feel Goal of the Season could be any, for me Kurtis v Hamilton or Cammy v Kelty also contenders, Win of the Season could be Stirling away for the importance but so is Hamilton. Loss maybe Falkirk 5-0 went in there with heads high and confident and then that happened but Stirling for losing the Derby for the first time in a long period 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rory Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 1 hour ago, LoganAAFC said: Certainly agree with most, feel Goal of the Season could be any, for me Kurtis v Hamilton or Cammy v Kelty also contenders, Win of the Season could be Stirling away for the importance but so is Hamilton. Loss maybe Falkirk 5-0 went in there with heads high and confident and then that happened but Stirling for losing the Derby for the first time in a long period I totally forgot about the 5-0 loss to Falkirk, must have repressed that memory. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlbionMan Posted March 5 Share Posted March 5 On 04/03/2024 at 13:50, Skyline Drifter said: The irony of the one club in ten who reported a profit last season being the one who has subsequently had an insolvency event is not lost on me! It's pretty clear that clubs at this level are generally spending money they can't afford. Most of them have had money left over from Covid that they've been able to use over the last couple of years but I'd imagine that's largely run out now. I wonder if there will be a reset of wage levels at this level of football in the next few months? With our Board announcing that they are leaving at the end of the season last week after basically being in charge for about 15 years, it remains to be seen if someone else with wealth will step in or if we'll have to factor back our budget significantly. Hamilton, Alloa, Cove, Kelty and Edinburgh were being supported by businessmen also, though Kelty aren't now unless they've got someone else in, not sure? Falkirk are big enough to support their spending in practice although they've still apparently managed to lose a fortune over the last few years. I don't know enough about Stirling to know where the funding came from that let them overspend to that degree. I assume it's not a bottomless pit since as far as I know they are run by their Supporter's Trust. Also not sure if anyone bankrolls Montrose or if it's just run with the commercial income / gate receipts they get? Stirling used their Rangers cup tie money from the previous season to fund the promotion push. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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