Arsenal till I die Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I've seen some posts on friendface (I'm an IT crowd fan) saying that Labour should just give in to those lovely Tories over English votes for English laws so those lovely Tories can give Scotland extra powers. That was never part of the deal, the 3 parties all agreed that Scotland would get extra powers in the event of a No vote. That was the deal, there was no condition of doing anything about the West Lothian question. That the Tories are trying to tie it in, means that it is the Tories who have broken this promise, however according to some it's Labour who are breaking the promise by not allowing the Tories to alter the deal, Darth Vader style? I've even seen some say that the Tories were never going to give extra powers to Scotland without throwing in English votes on English laws. That to me is a bit like saying "she was wearing a short skirt". I expect people to be brainwashed south of the border. However along with 55% of voters being brainwashed into voting no, it seems that even plenty of yes voters have allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that England is clamouring for English votes for English laws. Trust me, proportionately hardly anyone here cares about the West Lothian question. Far more people are bothered about the Lords. Do you think it's fair we should have this forced on us when there is no English mandate, and no referendum proposed for it? Do you think it's fair that we should have a law only voted on by Tory English M.P's, and then have the same law voted on by Tory Lords? Some seem to be using this as an excuse to advocate voting anyone but Labour, including the Orange Order. A nasty, bigoted, racist organisation which doesn't recognise the Irish state, celebrates the conquer of the entire island of Ireland, burns tricolours in its lodges, complains about Dido recording a song called Rebel Song, still to this day opposes the coming about of Irish independence and celebration of it, but better to vote them than Labour?! Are some of you out of your minds?! Have people's views been warped by some sense of greater betrayal by Labour? What were you hoping for from Labour on referendum day? Had they not been at the forefront of the No Campaign? Is it the fact that they're the biggest Unionist party in Scotland? Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, that's because they might just be the best of a bad Unionist bunch? But still, let's blame Labour for this Tory U-Turn, who needs logic eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Addie Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 tl;dr. Labour sold Scotland down the river by taking the interests of their own party over the people of Scotland. Also I haven't seen The Orange Order stand for Parliament before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booker-T Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I've seen some posts on friendface (I'm an IT crowd fan) saying that Labour should just give in to those lovely Tories over English votes for English laws so those lovely Tories can give Scotland extra powers. That was never part of the deal, the 3 parties all agreed that Scotland would get extra powers in the event of a No vote. That was the deal, there was no condition of doing anything about the West Lothian question. That the Tories are trying to tie it in, means that it is the Tories who have broken this promise, however according to some it's Labour who are breaking the promise by not allowing the Tories to alter the deal, Darth Vader style? I've even seen some say that the Tories were never going to give extra powers to Scotland without throwing in English votes on English laws. That to me is a bit like saying "she was wearing a short skirt". I expect people to be brainwashed south of the border. However along with 55% of voters being brainwashed into voting no, it seems that even plenty of yes voters have allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that England is clamouring for English votes for English laws. Trust me, proportionately hardly anyone here cares about the West Lothian question. Far more people are bothered about the Lords. Do you think it's fair we should have this forced on us when there is no English mandate, and no referendum proposed for it? Do you think it's fair that we should have a law only voted on by Tory English M.P's, and then have the same law voted on by Tory Lords? Some seem to be using this as an excuse to advocate voting anyone but Labour, including the Orange Order. A nasty, bigoted, racist organisation which doesn't recognise the Irish state, celebrates the conquer of the entire island of Ireland, burns tricolours in its lodges, complains about Dido recording a song called Rebel Song, still to this day opposes the coming about of Irish independence and celebration of it, but better to vote them than Labour?! Are some of you out of your minds?! Have people's views been warped by some sense of greater betrayal by Labour? What were you hoping for from Labour on referendum day? Had they not been at the forefront of the No Campaign? Is it the fact that they're the biggest Unionist party in Scotland? Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, that's because they might just be the best of a bad Unionist bunch? But still, let's blame Labour for this Tory U-Turn, who needs logic eh? So are you a two faced labour fanboy or one of the stupid ones? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Killie Zenit Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Labour can't sign up to something as flimsy as the Vow and then cry "No fair!" when someone else throws in another fundamental constitutional issue that has been floating round for decades just because it doesn't suit them. Maybe they should have shown the people of Scotland some respect and spent a little more time constructing something more concrete and defined, instead of making a panicked phone call to the Daily Record when things didn't seem to be going their way. No-one forced them to get in bed with the Tories on this, but here they are reaping what they sow. That's Westminster. Up them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 tl;dr. Labour sold Scotland down the river by taking the interests of their own party over the people of Scotland. Also I haven't seen The Orange Order stand for Parliament before? Young Adlington nailed it. Labour put their own gravy train ahead of the betterment of Scotland. And for that we will NEVER forgive them. And you'll notice I put "never" in capitals, so I really fucking mean it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon EF Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I've seen some posts on friendface (I'm an IT crowd fan) saying that Labour should just give in to those lovely Tories over English votes for English laws so those lovely Tories can give Scotland extra powers. That was never part of the deal, the 3 parties all agreed that Scotland would get extra powers in the event of a No vote. That was the deal, there was no condition of doing anything about the West Lothian question. That the Tories are trying to tie it in, means that it is the Tories who have broken this promise, however according to some it's Labour who are breaking the promise by not allowing the Tories to alter the deal, Darth Vader style? I've even seen some say that the Tories were never going to give extra powers to Scotland without throwing in English votes on English laws. That to me is a bit like saying "she was wearing a short skirt". I expect people to be brainwashed south of the border. However along with 55% of voters being brainwashed into voting no, it seems that even plenty of yes voters have allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that England is clamouring for English votes for English laws. Trust me, proportionately hardly anyone here cares about the West Lothian question. Far more people are bothered about the Lords. Do you think it's fair we should have this forced on us when there is no English mandate, and no referendum proposed for it? Do you think it's fair that we should have a law only voted on by Tory English M.P's, and then have the same law voted on by Tory Lords? Some seem to be using this as an excuse to advocate voting anyone but Labour, including the Orange Order. A nasty, bigoted, racist organisation which doesn't recognise the Irish state, celebrates the conquer of the entire island of Ireland, burns tricolours in its lodges, complains about Dido recording a song called Rebel Song, still to this day opposes the coming about of Irish independence and celebration of it, but better to vote them than Labour?! Are some of you out of your minds?! Have people's views been warped by some sense of greater betrayal by Labour? What were you hoping for from Labour on referendum day? Had they not been at the forefront of the No Campaign? Is it the fact that they're the biggest Unionist party in Scotland? Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, that's because they might just be the best of a bad Unionist bunch? But still, let's blame Labour for this Tory U-Turn, who needs logic eh? What a mess. The Labour Party sold any principles they had down the river long ago. That's why I hate them probably more than any other paryt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScotlandGer Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I've seen some posts on friendface (I'm an IT crowd fan) saying that Labour should just give in to those lovely Tories over English votes for English laws so those lovely Tories can give Scotland extra powers. That was never part of the deal, the 3 parties all agreed that Scotland would get extra powers in the event of a No vote. That was the deal, there was no condition of doing anything about the West Lothian question. That the Tories are trying to tie it in, means that it is the Tories who have broken this promise, however according to some it's Labour who are breaking the promise by not allowing the Tories to alter the deal, Darth Vader style? I've even seen some say that the Tories were never going to give extra powers to Scotland without throwing in English votes on English laws. That to me is a bit like saying "she was wearing a short skirt". I expect people to be brainwashed south of the border. However along with 55% of voters being brainwashed into voting no, it seems that even plenty of yes voters have allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that England is clamouring for English votes for English laws. Trust me, proportionately hardly anyone here cares about the West Lothian question. Far more people are bothered about the Lords. Do you think it's fair we should have this forced on us when there is no English mandate, and no referendum proposed for it? Do you think it's fair that we should have a law only voted on by Tory English M.P's, and then have the same law voted on by Tory Lords? Some seem to be using this as an excuse to advocate voting anyone but Labour, including the Orange Order. A nasty, bigoted, racist organisation which doesn't recognise the Irish state, celebrates the conquer of the entire island of Ireland, burns tricolours in its lodges, complains about Dido recording a song called Rebel Song, still to this day opposes the coming about of Irish independence and celebration of it, but better to vote them than Labour?! Are some of you out of your minds?! Have people's views been warped by some sense of greater betrayal by Labour? What were you hoping for from Labour on referendum day? Had they not been at the forefront of the No Campaign? Is it the fact that they're the biggest Unionist party in Scotland? Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, that's because they might just be the best of a bad Unionist bunch? But still, let's blame Labour for this Tory U-Turn, who needs logic eh? , not sure about that, to be honest. It was presented as a promise, solemn vow, and senior Labour figures assured that they were the guardians of its delivery. To be fair, it really is all we need to know about a Labour promise that Better Together partners broke ranks only a few hours after the referendum result, making a mockery of each of Gordon Brown's words. It's Labour's responsibility as equally as it is for the Tories, it's Labour's credibility on the line as equally as it is for the Tories. All the while, Labour and Tories have only a couple of weeks before the next deadline is missed. Bearing in mind, we were promised ' a system of government as close to federalism' when in reality, the debate is about how to find agreement beyond something resembling bare extra-devolution. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 English votes for english laws in quite right. It labour who wont sign up because they are frightened about west lothian on their own party, rather than honouring their commitment to Scotland. The unionist parties r all full of it but its the red torries who are the worst of the bad bunch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael W Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I wonder why Labour are hesitant about English votes for English laws? In some ways, I actually agree that a lot of people down here don't care much about English devolution etc. As ever, a few angry people making comments on the Daily Mail website isn't a reflection on what people really think. Devolving more powers to Scotland may start to change views on that, however. And there should be devolution in England too - I'm just not sure what form it should take. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bennett Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Labour politicians made promises which they have to honour otherwise i hope they are finished in Scotland. Also they were quite happy to do the Tories dirty work for them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Booker-T Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 English votes for english laws in quite right. It labour who wont sign up because they are frightened about west lothian on their own party, rather than honouring their commitment to Scotland. The unionist parties r all full of it but its the red torries who are the worst of the bad bunch They don't care about Scotland - only their party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy1970 Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 Gordon Brown has absolutely no authority, yet he is the one supposedly helping to underpin this pledge. A backbench MP whose execrable performance as Labour's last prime minister put the tin lid on it for many Labour voters. All those who could pretend that the only thing wrong with New Labour was Blair got their comeuppance when Brown took over and revealed the problems were institutional and not personal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loondave1 Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 I've seen some posts on friendface (I'm an IT crowd fan) saying that Labour should just give in to those lovely Tories over English votes for English laws so those lovely Tories can give Scotland extra powers. That was never part of the deal, the 3 parties all agreed that Scotland would get extra powers in the event of a No vote. That was the deal, there was no condition of doing anything about the West Lothian question. That the Tories are trying to tie it in, means that it is the Tories who have broken this promise, however according to some it's Labour who are breaking the promise by not allowing the Tories to alter the deal, Darth Vader style? I've even seen some say that the Tories were never going to give extra powers to Scotland without throwing in English votes on English laws. That to me is a bit like saying "she was wearing a short skirt". I expect people to be brainwashed south of the border. However along with 55% of voters being brainwashed into voting no, it seems that even plenty of yes voters have allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that England is clamouring for English votes for English laws. Trust me, proportionately hardly anyone here cares about the West Lothian question. Far more people are bothered about the Lords. Do you think it's fair we should have this forced on us when there is no English mandate, and no referendum proposed for it? Do you think it's fair that we should have a law only voted on by Tory English M.P's, and then have the same law voted on by Tory Lords? Some seem to be using this as an excuse to advocate voting anyone but Labour, including the Orange Order. A nasty, bigoted, racist organisation which doesn't recognise the Irish state, celebrates the conquer of the entire island of Ireland, burns tricolours in its lodges, complains about Dido recording a song called Rebel Song, still to this day opposes the coming about of Irish independence and celebration of it, but better to vote them than Labour?! Are some of you out of your minds?! Have people's views been warped by some sense of greater betrayal by Labour? What were you hoping for from Labour on referendum day? Had they not been at the forefront of the No Campaign? Is it the fact that they're the biggest Unionist party in Scotland? Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, that's because they might just be the best of a bad Unionist bunch? But still, let's blame Labour for this Tory U-Turn, who needs logic eh? It is quite baffling the outrage that a Unionist party took up a Unionist position in the Referendum.Im a Labour voter and I voted NO, all quite logical to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taza Posted September 27, 2014 Share Posted September 27, 2014 It is quite baffling the outrage that a Unionist party took up a Unionist position in the Referendum.Im a Labour voter and I voted NO, all quite logical to me. ^^^ S.S.S. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy1970 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I'm now assuming Loondave must be a SNP troll or a very dumb Labour supporter. Makes no difference either way, keep posting is what I say as a YES voter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itzdrk Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I've seen some posts on friendface (I'm an IT crowd fan) saying that Labour should just give in to those lovely Tories over English votes for English laws so those lovely Tories can give Scotland extra powers. That was never part of the deal, the 3 parties all agreed that Scotland would get extra powers in the event of a No vote. That was the deal, there was no condition of doing anything about the West Lothian question. That the Tories are trying to tie it in, means that it is the Tories who have broken this promise, however according to some it's Labour who are breaking the promise by not allowing the Tories to alter the deal, Darth Vader style? I've even seen some say that the Tories were never going to give extra powers to Scotland without throwing in English votes on English laws. That to me is a bit like saying "she was wearing a short skirt". I expect people to be brainwashed south of the border. However along with 55% of voters being brainwashed into voting no, it seems that even plenty of yes voters have allowed themselves to be brainwashed into thinking that England is clamouring for English votes for English laws. Trust me, proportionately hardly anyone here cares about the West Lothian question. Far more people are bothered about the Lords. Do you think it's fair we should have this forced on us when there is no English mandate, and no referendum proposed for it? Do you think it's fair that we should have a law only voted on by Tory English M.P's, and then have the same law voted on by Tory Lords? Some seem to be using this as an excuse to advocate voting anyone but Labour, including the Orange Order. A nasty, bigoted, racist organisation which doesn't recognise the Irish state, celebrates the conquer of the entire island of Ireland, burns tricolours in its lodges, complains about Dido recording a song called Rebel Song, still to this day opposes the coming about of Irish independence and celebration of it, but better to vote them than Labour?! Are some of you out of your minds?! Have people's views been warped by some sense of greater betrayal by Labour? What were you hoping for from Labour on referendum day? Had they not been at the forefront of the No Campaign? Is it the fact that they're the biggest Unionist party in Scotland? Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe, that's because they might just be the best of a bad Unionist bunch? But still, let's blame Labour for this Tory U-Turn, who needs logic eh? Why should we vote for any unionist party? Labour/Tories same thing to me Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loondave1 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Why should we vote for any unionist party? Labour/Tories same thing to me Im sure they are but that's really just down to lack of knowledge on your part. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itzdrk Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 Im sure they are In before the edit i agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loondave1 Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 In before the edit i agree I know what this is really about.Ayr off the top and the mighty Loons go top.Still in the Union and top of the table.Dry your eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itzdrk Posted September 28, 2014 Share Posted September 28, 2014 I know what this is really about.Ayr off the top and the mighty Loons go top.Still in the Union and top of the table.Dry your eyes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.