When will indyref2 happen?

[mjw]

Well according to Sky news, so far.....

They should just change their name to Fox news UK and be done with it.

[Whitburn Vale]

At the last ref,the majority of poles,latvians etc from other EU countries were against independence,cant see them voting against it now,what with their citizenship under threat if we stay in the UK.

[Bishop Briggs]

2 minutes ago, Shades75 said:

Well according to Sky news, so far.....

We'll get kicked out of NATO, the Referendum won't be fair because no one will know what we're voting for (Brexit anyone?), It's divisive (Brexit anyone?), there might be a hard border, Sturgeon was pushed into it by Salmond and she doesn't think that it's winnable anyway.

Thanks for that .

No one knows which EU Scotland will be voting to join after a Yes vote - http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-17-385_en.htm

The White Paper sets out five scenarios, each offering a glimpse into the potential state of the Union by 2025 depending on the choices Europe will make (see Annex). The scenarios cover a range of possibilities and are illustrative in nature. They are neither mutually exclusive, nor exhaustive.

• Scenario 1: Carrying On - The EU27 focuses on delivering its positive reform agenda in the spirit of the Commission's New Start for Europe from 2014 and of the Bratislava Declaration agreed by all 27 Member States in 2016. By 2025 this could mean:
  • Europeans can drive automated and connected cars but can encounter problems when crossing borders as some legal and technical obstacles persist.
  • Europeans mostly travel across borders without having to stop for checks. Reinforced security controls mean having to arrive at airports and train stations well in advance of departure.

• Scenario 2: Nothing but the Single Market – The EU27 is gradually re-centred on the single market as the 27 Member States are not able to find common ground on an increasing number of policy areas. By 2025 this could mean:
  • Crossing borders for business or tourism becomes difficult due to regular checks. Finding a job abroad is harder and the transfer of pension rights to another country not guaranteed. Those falling ill abroad face expensive medical bills.
  • Europeans are reluctant to use connected cars due to the absence of EU-wide rules and technical standards.

• Scenario 3: Those Who Want More Do More – The EU27 proceeds as today but allows willing Member States to do more together in specific areas such as defence, internal security or social matters. One or several "coalitions of the willing" emerge. By 2025 this could mean that:
  • 15 Member States set up a police and magistrates corps to tackle cross-border criminal activities. Security information is immediately exchanged as national databases are fully interconnected.
  • Connected cars are used widely in 12 Member States which have agreed to harmonise their liability rules and technical standards.

• Scenario 4: Doing Less More Efficiently - The EU27 focuses on delivering more and faster in selected policy areas, while doing less where it is perceived not to have an added value. Attention and limited resources are focused on selected policy areas. By 2025 this could mean
  • A European Telecoms Authority will have the power to free up frequencies for cross-border communication services, such as the ones used by connected cars. It will also protect the rights of mobile and Internet users wherever they are in the EU.
  • A new European Counter-terrorism Agency helps to deter and prevent serious attacks through a systematic tracking and flagging of suspects.

• Scenario 5: Doing Much More Together – Member States decide to share more power, resources and decision-making across the board. Decisions are agreed faster at European level and rapidly enforced. By 2025 this could mean:
  • Europeans who want to complain about a proposed EU-funded wind turbine project in their local area cannot reach the responsible authority as they are told to contact the competent European authorities.
  • Connected cars drive seamlessly across Europe as clear EU-wide rules exist. Drivers can rely on an EU agency to enforce the rules.

[mjw]

f**k sake.
That was tedious enough the first time you posted it.

[Chapelhall chap]

Just spent ten minutes catching up on all the posts. It will be even longer as the whole Brexit/Independence bandwagons roll on and I am looking forward to all of it. My only quibble today was that May said there would be further division and uncertainty, which surely means she is responsible for the current division and uncertainty? And poor wee Ruth was upset that she had not been informed of the contents of the speech before it was made; where was she when Cameron strode out to announce English votes for English Laws?

[doulikefish]

Just now, mjw said:

f**k sake.
That was tedious enough the first time you posted it.

Copy and pasted it you mean

[Ross.]

6 minutes ago, Ned Nederlander said:

FWIW - I'm keeping a lower profile on FB this time 'round, I'm sure half my friends still have my content blocked.

Pretty much where I am. I'll be doing my best to let you lot get on with it. I should get permanent residency here at the start of next year. If all goes as planned you can vote whichever fucking way you want.

[Romeo]

Will the Russians still be invading?

[renton]

3 minutes ago, Whitburn Vale said:

At the last ref,the majority of poles,latvians etc from other EU countries were against independence,cant see them voting against it now,what with their citizenship under threat if we stay in the UK.

Aye, assuming the EU guys get the franchise, then they voted 65/35 against last time - population is something like 186,000. Probably safe to say the vast majority would now vote yes.

[mizfit]

12 minutes ago, Sooky said:

 

Credit for somehow trying to spin this considering that a) support for Welsh independence is minuscule in comparison and b) they voted to leave the EU

 

 

And the Welsh are, quite rightly a complete and utter irrelevance. 

[Jacksgranda]

2 minutes ago, Ross. said:

Pretty much where I am. I'll be doing my best to let you lot get on with it. I should get permanent residency here at the start of next year. If all goes as planned you can vote whichever fucking way you want.

And if it doesn't go as planned you might want to delete that post...

[Shades75]

2 minutes ago, Bishop Briggs said:

No one knows which EU Scotland will be voting to join after a Yes vote - http://europa.eu/rapid/press-release_IP-17-385_en.htm

The White Paper sets out five scenarios, each offering a glimpse into the potential state of the Union by 2025 depending on the choices Europe will make (see Annex). The scenarios cover a range of possibilities and are illustrative in nature. They are neither mutually exclusive, nor exhaustive.

• Scenario 1: Carrying On - The EU27 focuses on delivering its positive reform agenda in the spirit of the Commission's New Start for Europe from 2014 and of the Bratislava Declaration agreed by all 27 Member States in 2016. By 2025 this could mean:
  • Europeans can drive automated and connected cars but can encounter problems when crossing borders as some legal and technical obstacles persist.
  • Europeans mostly travel across borders without having to stop for checks. Reinforced security controls mean having to arrive at airports and train stations well in advance of departure.

• Scenario 2: Nothing but the Single Market – The EU27 is gradually re-centred on the single market as the 27 Member States are not able to find common ground on an increasing number of policy areas. By 2025 this could mean:
  • Crossing borders for business or tourism becomes difficult due to regular checks. Finding a job abroad is harder and the transfer of pension rights to another country not guaranteed. Those falling ill abroad face expensive medical bills.
  • Europeans are reluctant to use connected cars due to the absence of EU-wide rules and technical standards.

• Scenario 3: Those Who Want More Do More – The EU27 proceeds as today but allows willing Member States to do more together in specific areas such as defence, internal security or social matters. One or several "coalitions of the willing" emerge. By 2025 this could mean that:
  • 15 Member States set up a police and magistrates corps to tackle cross-border criminal activities. Security information is immediately exchanged as national databases are fully interconnected.
  • Connected cars are used widely in 12 Member States which have agreed to harmonise their liability rules and technical standards.

• Scenario 4: Doing Less More Efficiently - The EU27 focuses on delivering more and faster in selected policy areas, while doing less where it is perceived not to have an added value. Attention and limited resources are focused on selected policy areas. By 2025 this could mean
  • A European Telecoms Authority will have the power to free up frequencies for cross-border communication services, such as the ones used by connected cars. It will also protect the rights of mobile and Internet users wherever they are in the EU.
  • A new European Counter-terrorism Agency helps to deter and prevent serious attacks through a systematic tracking and flagging of suspects.

• Scenario 5: Doing Much More Together – Member States decide to share more power, resources and decision-making across the board. Decisions are agreed faster at European level and rapidly enforced. By 2025 this could mean:
  • Europeans who want to complain about a proposed EU-funded wind turbine project in their local area cannot reach the responsible authority as they are told to contact the competent European authorities.
  • Connected cars drive seamlessly across Europe as clear EU-wide rules exist. Drivers can rely on an EU agency to enforce the rules.

 I don't deny that there's uncertainty.

I do offer, though, that all scenarios available on the constitutional future of Scotland, and indeed the U.K., are uncertain.

Scottish Independence is not unique in that respect so "uncertainty" isnot much of a big stick to use.

If we use the 2014 referendum as a yard stick then voting for the supposed continuity did not exactly deliver, did it?

[williemillersmoustache]

Brexit uncertainty isn't as uncertainty-ee as independence uncertainty which is the uncertaintiest uncertainty of all the uncertainties ever.

[doulikefish]

Whens big Gordy getting rolled out??Still discussing his fee??

Edited March 13, 2017 by doulikefish

[welshbairn]

6 minutes ago, renton said:

Aye, assuming the EU guys get the franchise, then they voted 65/35 against last time - population is something like 186,000. Probably safe to say the vast majority would now vote yes.

Quite a few Anglo Scots might change too.

[Jacksgranda]

1 minute ago, doulikefish said:

Whens big Gordy getting rolled out??Still discussing his fee??

Is he dead??

[Bishop Briggs]

2 minutes ago, mjw said:

f**k sake.
That was tedious enough the first time you posted it.

Yes it's tedious but it shows that the EU has no clue where it's going. Those scenarios only highlight the differing views in Brussels and the Member States.

The EU Commissioner has confirmed this afternoon that Scotland will need to apply as a new Member State, under article 49. Scotland will exit the EU with rest of the UK even if it votes for independence.

If the vote is in 2019, Brexit may have been completed. The deadline for the Brexit deal will be March 2019. 

[doulikefish]

4 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

Is he dead??

He will rise up as soon as his bank account goes cha ching

[Shades75]

7 minutes ago, Bishop Briggs said:

Yes it's tedious but it shows that the EU has no clue where it's going. Those scenarios only highlight the differing views in Brussels and the Member States.

The EU Commissioner has confirmed this afternoon that Scotland will need to apply as a new Member State, under article 49. Scotland will exit the EU with rest of the UK even if it votes for independence.

If the vote is in 2019, Brexit may have been completed. The deadline for the Brexit deal will be March 2019. 

A "spokesperson" you mean?

She also said that Scotland could be fast tracked.

 

[renton]

Theresa May there, leaning heavily on the "eat your cereal" trope.