Brexit slowly becoming a Farce.

[welshbairn]

6 minutes ago, The Chlamydia Kid said:

You seem to have great difficulty is distinguishing your opinions from fact. Your arrogance knows no limits. You honestly believe that you operate on an wholly superior intellectual level to 17 million people- who to a man can be written off as thickos. You're obviously wasted in your current role...

Repeatedly on here you show yourself completely unable to even contemplate a perspective different from your own.

So what did he get wrong?

[Granny Danger]

They can have my red passport when they prise it from my cold, dead hands.

[WILLIEA]

20 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

So what did he get wrong?

Absolutely nothing imo

[welshbairn]

Have to renew my passport before September anyway so should have proof of being proud European Citizen for a while longer. There is talk of allowing us to remain as EU members on an individual level, with all the rights, responsibilities and privileges that that would entail. Things like same health care as a local, right to work etc I assume. Presumably the responsibilities part would be a payment as our Government won't be participating. If you divide our net contribution to the EU by population it's probably something I'd be willing to pay, if only for self respect.

P.S. Rough calculation works it out as £125. A fucking bargain.

Edited April 4, 2017 by welshbairn

[HTG]

40 minutes ago, The Chlamydia Kid said:

17 million people- who to a man can be written off as thickos. 

You could have left the rest out - this is the key part of your post and absolutely bang on. 

[WILLIEA]

I believe Kilbowies post is what is termed a " telt "

[The Chlamydia Kid]

Thanks, I like you too. It is a fact that all of those things will happen as a result of brexit. Also if you honestly want the tories to have full control over workers rights, maternity pay etc and believe they wont act in the best interest of big business to shaft the working man you've obviously not being paying much attention to what they've been doing over the last 7 years. Also I have some magic beans you may want to buy?
 
Im perfectly aware of what brexit voters think, 'take back control' 'spend money on the NHS' 'control immigration' 'bendy bananas' 'are country'. But yeh having actually looked into the facts of the matter and being fully aware of what the EU does for the people of this country (albeit I believe there were things which required change) I think on the whole I am right and the brexit voters are wrong.
 
But dont take my word for it, have a look at what has happened so far; Leave won and said 'we'll get a better trade deal with the world' the EU has said that any new trade deal will not be on favourable terms and they hold the bargaining chips, the rest of the world has said they are in no rush to start trade negotiation talks with the UK, even members of 'Commonwealth mk2' including Australia are actually making moves to invest in Ireland as they realise Brexit is a disaster. The causal effect of not having a trade agreement is the imposition of WTO tariffs for trade until one is in place, ultimately this means everything you buy from a foreign country ie the EU goes from having no tariff to having WTO tariff rates on top of the price, If you can show me some way that buying a car from Germany currently within the free market is more expensive than buying the same car with WTO tariffs post brexit without a trade deal then I'll give you the car myself, you can put a union jack sticker in the back and call it the brexit mobile if you want.
The Americans are actively seeking to make inroads into privatising the NHS (you may have been too busy finger painting when Jeremy Hunt was over in the states after the vote actively touting this). The EU member states are pishing themselves laughing at the knuckle dragging snake oil buying drum banging Brexiters who have caused this mess. Economic experts (thats people who are good at economics) all agree this is a terrible move. Banks in the city of London are actively looking to move out of the country, removing wealth, relocating, JP morgan actively seeking office space in Dublin as we speak amongst others. Its likely that to get a trade deal with the EU we'll have to accept continued movement of people (thats not something that bothers me in the slightest, we need it) which i'm pretty sure was the corner stone of the entire brexit debate for most? So we're now in a position where people voted for something thinking they'd get more control over immigration but have voted to take us away from the body which will shape immigration policy and remove any influence we have over it?
 
But f**k it we've taken back control.
 
I personally know of a girl who works with David Davis in the civil service, on his first day (keep in mind that this is one of the heads of the leave campaign) had to be given a three hour lecture by an academic as to what the EU actually does. So yes I do think I'm pretty relaxed in thinking I know a little bit more about politics than some others, not an expert but hey it would seem anyone who's done a class in international relations at Uni knows more about the mechanisms of the EU than the minister in charge of negotiating the actual exit from it.
 
You accuse me of believing that i'm intellectually superior to 17million people, in a population of approx 60 million people thats not exactly a huge boast is it?
Its not how I feel, I know nothing about electrics and plumbing but im sure 17million people in the UK know more about one particular subject than me, I just think when it comes to politics namely brexit I've never been moved to concede that I'm wrong through reasoned debate.
And thats not to say I actually believe that, It just so happens I have a pretty strong belief (which I can approach with as you'll see above a reasoned and not hysterical brit nat brexit foam at the mouth madness mentality) that leaving the EU is a very bad move for the UK. See this is possibly where you get confused, when Nigel et al parked their bus I went away and looked to see if there was any basis in what they were saying, and ultimately I found there was none, thats called research, I get that its probably easier for you to just believe what the daily mail tells you, but I prefer to do my own thinking.
 
You accuse me of being unable to distinguish my opinions from fact, the problem is I form my opinions from facts.
 
Anyway the sun's going down so you'll probably be away sacrificing something in the hope that it'll rise tomorrow. Have a good night.
 
 

Nah I'm actually away on holiday tonight- better make the most of my ability to travel before we become marooned on Blighty....

[kirkyblue2]

I think Kilbowie should learn facts from assumptions.

[mjw]

I think Kilbowie should learn facts from assumptions.

Can you point to where he is wrong?

[kirkyblue2]

Just now, mjw said:

Can you point to where he is wrong?

He may be proved right but he can't base his argument on facts at this stage.

[The Chlamydia Kid]

Can you point to where he is wrong?

No deal has been struck. How can you predict what will happen? Nobody can say about our financial situation, business costs etc. All speculation. He may be proven correct but he may be wrong. Nobody knows for sure. He presents his beliefs as fact.

[zidane's child]

2 minutes ago, kirkyblue2 said:

He may be proved right but he can't base his argument on facts at this stage.

But he can base it on current observations both here and abroad.

[DeeTillEhDeh]

They can have my red passport when they prise it from my cold, dead hands.

To quote Mars Attacks "Your terms are acceptable."

[DeeTillEhDeh]

Thanks, I like you too. It is a fact that all of those things will happen as a result of brexit. Also if you honestly want the tories to have full control over workers rights, maternity pay etc and believe they wont act in the best interest of big business to shaft the working man you've obviously not being paying much attention to what they've been doing over the last 7 years. Also I have some magic beans you may want to buy?
 
Im perfectly aware of what brexit voters think, 'take back control' 'spend money on the NHS' 'control immigration' 'bendy bananas' 'are country'. But yeh having actually looked into the facts of the matter and being fully aware of what the EU does for the people of this country (albeit I believe there were things which required change) I think on the whole I am right and the brexit voters are wrong.
 
But dont take my word for it, have a look at what has happened so far; Leave won and said 'we'll get a better trade deal with the world' the EU has said that any new trade deal will not be on favourable terms and they hold the bargaining chips, the rest of the world has said they are in no rush to start trade negotiation talks with the UK, even members of 'Commonwealth mk2' including Australia are actually making moves to invest in Ireland as they realise Brexit is a disaster. The causal effect of not having a trade agreement is the imposition of WTO tariffs for trade until one is in place, ultimately this means everything you buy from a foreign country ie the EU goes from having no tariff to having WTO tariff rates on top of the price, If you can show me some way that buying a car from Germany currently within the free market is more expensive than buying the same car with WTO tariffs post brexit without a trade deal then I'll give you the car myself, you can put a union jack sticker in the back and call it the brexit mobile if you want.
The Americans are actively seeking to make inroads into privatising the NHS (you may have been too busy finger painting when Jeremy Hunt was over in the states after the vote actively touting this). The EU member states are pishing themselves laughing at the knuckle dragging snake oil buying drum banging Brexiters who have caused this mess. Economic experts (thats people who are good at economics) all agree this is a terrible move. Banks in the city of London are actively looking to move out of the country, removing wealth, relocating, JP morgan actively seeking office space in Dublin as we speak amongst others. Its likely that to get a trade deal with the EU we'll have to accept continued movement of people (thats not something that bothers me in the slightest, we need it) which i'm pretty sure was the corner stone of the entire brexit debate for most? So we're now in a position where people voted for something thinking they'd get more control over immigration but have voted to take us away from the body which will shape immigration policy and remove any influence we have over it?
 
But f**k it we've taken back control.
 
I personally know of a girl who works with David Davis in the civil service, on his first day (keep in mind that this is one of the heads of the leave campaign) had to be given a three hour lecture by an academic as to what the EU actually does. So yes I do think I'm pretty relaxed in thinking I know a little bit more about politics than some others, not an expert but hey it would seem anyone who's done a class in international relations at Uni knows more about the mechanisms of the EU than the minister in charge of negotiating the actual exit from it.
 
You accuse me of believing that i'm intellectually superior to 17million people, in a population of approx 60 million people thats not exactly a huge boast is it?
Its not how I feel, I know nothing about electrics and plumbing but im sure 17million people in the UK know more about one particular subject than me, I just think when it comes to politics namely brexit I've never been moved to concede that I'm wrong through reasoned debate.
And thats not to say I actually believe that, It just so happens I have a pretty strong belief (which I can approach with as you'll see above a reasoned and not hysterical brit nat brexit foam at the mouth madness mentality) that leaving the EU is a very bad move for the UK. See this is possibly where you get confused, when Nigel et al parked their bus I went away and looked to see if there was any basis in what they were saying, and ultimately I found there was none, thats called research, I get that its probably easier for you to just believe what the daily mail tells you, but I prefer to do my own thinking.
 
You accuse me of being unable to distinguish my opinions from fact, the problem is I form my opinions from facts.
 
Anyway the sun's going down so you'll probably be away sacrificing something in the hope that it'll rise tomorrow. Have a good night.
 
 

That is a telt!!!

[kirkyblue2]

There will be compromises so I don't think it will be as bad as some make out.

Edited April 4, 2017 by kirkyblue2

[The_Kincardine]

1 minute ago, kilbowie2002 said:

Oh contraire the only thing which is certain in life is death and taxes/tariffs.

Of all the homophones in all the world that has to be the worst on record.  In the context of Brexit "Owe contraire" would have had at least a hint of humour.

[NotThePars]

47 minutes ago, kirkyblue2 said:

He may be proved right but he can't base his argument on facts at this stage.

 

Well, no. It's possible to make assertions based on what's happening. That's like the entire point of a forum.

[mjw]

No deal has been struck. How can you predict what will happen? Nobody can say about our financial situation, business costs etc. All speculation. He may be proven correct but he may be wrong. Nobody knows for sure. He presents his beliefs as fact.

I don't disagree.
I'd just rather the negotiations were in anyones hands rather than the lunatics who are in charge just now.

[welshbairn]

45 minutes ago, The Chlamydia Kid said:

No deal has been struck. How can you predict what will happen? Nobody can say about our financial situation, business costs etc. All speculation. He may be proven correct but he may be wrong. Nobody knows for sure. He presents his beliefs as fact.

I understand Liam Fox has very high hopes of reducing Bhutan's trade barriers to Tunnock's Teacakes after Brexit.

[zidane's child]

1 hour ago, kilbowie2002 said:

It is an absolute fact that unless the UK can negotiate a trade deal with the EU which is better than the deal the EU already has (whats better in business terms than free trade??) then we will be worse off.
Everything we said would happen as a result of a leave vote has happened.
Even going by the Tories own estimates on time frames for negotiating trade deals we don't have time to negotiate trade deals with the international community before brexit and because we can't measure what our economy is going to be like its unlikely that we will be able to get deals in the immediate future.
I dont get whats hard for leave voters to understand about all thats going on/going to happen. There is absolutely no indication that brexit is going to be a positive thing for the UK.

Having watched Davis stutter and struggle in the Exiting EU commitee a few weeks ago, if that's one of our negotiators, then we're up s**t creek with no paddle.

ironically, we're trying to negotiate a deal that we've got just now and we want to throw it all away because we voted to leave. Not arguing with democracy here, but it shows how unprepared our government was for a leave vote.