Kyle Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 I'm still none the wiser as to why people feel the EU should bend over backwards to accommodate the UK. They've said repeatedly to go to them with proposals and they'll consider them. We've gone to them - finally - with this chequers deal which the EU had already effectively ruled out with their own red lines. The amount of rage towards the EU among the leavers is quite astounding really - surely the anger's better directed at the Government that's failing miserably to deliver what they want them to deliver? An absolute shambles all round. Even Chris Deerin - one of the chief unionist columnist during the Independence referendum - is a baw hair away from declaring for yes after the omnishambles endured this week. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
git-intae-thum Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, Detournement said: Does that not undermine the idea of European solidarity? Eh..it is our British nationalists that were attempting to stick the fingers up to the EU. If the EU makes any concessions on freedom of movement being traded for market access, it will seriously harm the integrity of the block. They have absolutely minimal incentive to be anything other than c@nts to the Britards....and from an EU point of view quite rightly. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 12 minutes ago, Detournement said: Does that not undermine the idea of European solidarity? Nope. Did Russia Today not explain the 4 freedoms for you? That is the glue that binds diverse and competing nation states into an economic union. You know the rules when you go in, you know the rules you will have to sign up for for single market access when you leave. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Just now, dorlomin said: Nope. Did Russia Today not explain the 4 freedoms for you? That is the glue that binds diverse and competing nation states into an economic union. You know the rules when you go in, you know the rules you will have to sign up for for single market access when you leave. I understand the four freedoms. It seems problematic not to have a fallback should an electorate reject one of them though. The EU is no way an economic union. Germany refuses any effort towards fiscal transfers and is fully committed to pauperising southern Europe. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Benjamin_Nevis Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Nope. Did Russia Today not explain the 4 freedoms for you? That is the glue that binds diverse and competing nation states into an economic union. You know the rules when you go in, you know the rules you will have to sign up for for single market access when you leave. You might need finger puppets. This boy thought investing in Northern Rock was genius. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, jupe1407 said: 6 minutes ago, dorlomin said: Nope. Did Russia Today not explain the 4 freedoms for you? That is the glue that binds diverse and competing nation states into an economic union. You know the rules when you go in, you know the rules you will have to sign up for for single market access when you leave. You might need finger puppets. This boy thought investing in Northern Rock was genius. Despite what the Dundonian brains trust keep repeating i'm not the person you are saying I am. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 13 minutes ago, JamieThomas said: Scotland needs to shut the f**k up and do what 61 year old Bill from Barnsley wants tho. Gr8 work, lads. Bill from Barnsley is a c**t. I hope he dies tonight, painfully. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesM82 Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 (edited) 30 minutes ago, Detournement said: Canada it is then. If there was any genuine goodwill from the EU27 to the UK they would have been willing to create a new model of relations for the UK's specific circumstances but there clearly isn't. Even the "Canada" model (basic free trade agreement) doesn't work as it stands, because the UK says it wants no checks on the Irish border or in the ports that have routes between Great Britain and Northern Ireland. Edited September 21, 2018 by JamesM82 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry94 Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Freedom of movement was the defining issue of the referendum. No UK government can negotiate a deal that includes that.The question was not freedom of movement, it was membership of the EU. Did 100% of the 51.9% vote on that issue alone?Go ahead and research the polling, it isn't even close and surprisingly, isn't even the lead issue. It's economic prosperity that's the primary issue and although that does correlate strongly with the immigration issue, it's by no means a deal breaker. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyrExile Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 41 minutes ago, D'Jaffo said: Genuinely have no idea what gives you that impression. Big business dictates the agenda and not puppet politicians who come and go. The important people in both countries who get stuff done don’t really feature in the day to day stuff. Far too much to lose on both sides from a hard Brexit so all will be done to avoid. Classic negotiation bullshit going on here with nobody willing to lose face. When it looks like it’s all lost a deal of sorts will appear when you least expect it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jakedee Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Freedom of movement was the defining issue of the referendum. No UK government can negotiate a deal that includes that.And the EU were clear from day 1 that the 4 freedoms were non negotiable. The UK Governments inability to recognise this, argue amongst itself and put forward plans like Chequers which were never going to be accepted by the EU is the reason we are where we are.The UK Government are going to be responsible for the shambles that's a no deal brexit not the EU. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 (edited) http://ukandeu.ac.uk/what-the-public-think-about-immigration/ John Curtice Quote Table 2. Attitudes towards requiring EU migrants to apply in the same way as non-EU migrants, September 2016-Oct 2017 As Table 2 shows, this is a relatively popular proposition – especially amongst those who voted Leave, 82% of whom backed it in the most recent survey. But at the same time almost half of Remain voters (49%) support it too. Remain voters are not necessarily uninterested in proposals to reduce EU migration. The relative popularity of attempts to control migration has also been confirmed by the answers respondents to NatCen’s panel gave when they were asked other, differently worded questions about the subject. Edited September 21, 2018 by Detournement 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 6 minutes ago, AyrExile said: Big business dictates the agenda and not puppet politicians who come and go. Aye our best chance of getting a deal is that Macron has a banker's hand up his arse at all times. I doubt many of the EPP types are keen on a Corbyn government either. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyrExile Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 1 minute ago, Detournement said: Aye our best chance of getting a deal is that Macron has a banker's hand up his arse at all times. I doubt many of the EPP types are keen on a Corbyn government either. I was also thinking the CEO of a German car maker reminding Juncker his champagne lifestyle might not last forever 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, AyrExile said: I was also thinking the CEO of a German car maker reminding Juncker his champagne lifestyle might not last forever I sadly think Luxembourg's corruption will see Jean Claude through his final years in the opulence he is accustomed to. I see Blair's hand in this. He was lobbying the EU last week and probably told them that going hard on May would lead to a second referendum. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry94 Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 http://ukandeu.ac.uk/what-the-public-think-about-immigration/ John Curtice Table 2. Attitudes towards requiring EU migrants to apply in the same way as non-EU migrants, September 2016-Oct 2017 As Table 2 shows, this is a relatively popular proposition – especially amongst those who voted Leave, 82% of whom backed it in the most recent survey. But at the same time almost half of Remain voters (49%) support it too. Remain voters are not necessarily uninterested in proposals to reduce EU migration. The relative popularity of attempts to control migration has also been confirmed by the answers respondents to NatCen’s panel gave when they were asked other, differently worded questions about the subject. And how strongly do they feel about it? More important than economic prosperity? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Being in the EU hasn't exactly delivered economic prosperity has it? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bairnardo Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Being in the EU hasn't exactly delivered economic prosperity has it?In comparison to? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Of course if Theresa May went to the EU with a plan that the EU could agree to then it is obvious what would happen. Nigel Farage, Boris Johnson, Jacob Rees Mogg and a hundred other low-lifes would accuse her of a sell-out. Maybe she should take a backseat, send them over to Brussels to see if any of their ideas have any mileage and take it from there. Oh, I forgot, they don't have ideas - they only have objections. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted September 21, 2018 Share Posted September 21, 2018 Just now, Bairnardo said: 3 minutes ago, Detournement said: Being in the EU hasn't exactly delivered economic prosperity has it? In comparison to? It's impossible to say what would happen under different circumstances but all the main EU members have suffered a fall in wages and increasing inequality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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