Junior football, what is the future?

[FairWeatherFan]

8 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Do you think any North of Tay sides put in rescindable applications for the EOSL? 

Doubt it. Think any of the clubs that would be tempted by it lower down the leagues would rather have 2018/19 be in fairly local leagues against some of the bigger clubs from the area. It then gives everyone year to figure out what the future will hold.

And for the bigger clubs as you may have seen from some of their tweets are very anti EoS/pro juniors right now.

[A.M]

Just now, cmontheloknow said:

Do you think the future's rosy for the 85% or so remaining?

To be honest I havent  a clue what will happen, personally I thought we were going along ok and didnt see all this coming a year ago , so who knows, what I do think is that the later teams to move have panicked and left in fear of being " left behind".

If it does have to happen in the West I only hope it will be done en mass and not fragmented like it has been in the East.

[heedthebaa]

5 minutes ago, A.M said:

In the words of Bravehearts dad, should this not be moved to EOSL seniors now ?

Sunday is P+B GTF day, patience dear boy

[Khufu2]

1 minute ago, A.M said:

To be honest I havent  a clue what will happen, personally I thought we were going along ok and didnt see all this coming a year ago , so who knows, what I do think is that the later teams to move have panicked and left in fear of being " left behind".

If it does have to happen in the West I only hope it will be done en mass and not fragmented like it has been in the East.

If ever you needed a model for how not to establish a pyramid the one established by the East defectors would be it. If the West juniors see any benefit in  joining the senior pyramid I too hope they move en bloc.

[welshbairn]

7 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Doubt it. Think any of the clubs that would be tempted by it lower down the leagues would rather have 2018/19 be in fairly local leagues against some of the bigger clubs from the area. It then gives everyone year to figure out what the future will hold.

And for the bigger clubs as you may have seen from some of their tweets are very anti EoS/pro juniors right now.

Dwindling options then. I'd imagine a few phone calls with their Aberdeenshire brethren who are fed up with trips to the North West. It's getting like Game of Thrones.

[cmontheloknow]

9 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Dwindling options then. I'd imagine a few phone calls with their Aberdeenshire brethren who are fed up with trips to the North West. It's getting like Game of Thrones.

With dwindling members, does that make the SJFA Varys...

[Slaverysam]

Are treason and arson in a naval dockyard not still capital offences?
Who will hang for this?
Nominate your man.

Whichever one came up wi this guf or yer man Johnston

[bravehearts dad]

23 minutes ago, A.M said:

In the words of Bravehearts dad, should this not be moved to EOSL seniors now ?

A bit premature AM at the moment all clubs  are still members  of the quickly dimishing SJFA, then we can leave the thread to the west region and a saviour with the acronym AJ. The EoS have also to confirm the numbers of clubs accepted into their league(s).

Will you miss us?

[FairWeatherFan]

9 minutes ago, welshbairn said:

Dwindling options then. I'd imagine a few phone calls with their Aberdeenshire brethren who are fed up with trips to the North West. It's getting like Game of Thrones.

I find it very hard to judge. I don't see many phone calls to the North Region at any rate. Right now you can still get 30 odd clubs making up the East Region, as you know the North has 30 odd clubs that don't necessarily aspire to more than their lot. You'd imagine the West Region could still continue on with losing 30 clubs to the senior leagues.

Junior football could continue on in the same way that the EoS, SoS, HFL and NCFL carried on all those years. Just they'd have the Junior Cup and sense of identity that the non national Seniors never had. It could boil down to a West (now that districts in the West Region are being done away with), Central, East, North once it all plays out.

[bravehearts dad]

26 minutes ago, heedthebaa said:

Sunday is P+B GTF day, patience dear boy

Settle down folks settle down, The Big Rose still have the final of the Fife and Lothians to play next Wednesday so we can make comment till after that match.

See ye at the back of the goals that night?

[A.M]

3 minutes ago, bravehearts dad said:

A bit premature AM at the moment all clubs  are still members  of the quickly dimishing SJFA, then we can leave the thread to the west region and a saviour with the acronym AJ. The EoS have also to confirm the numbers of clubs accepted into their league(s).

Will you miss us?

Quickly diminishing ERSJFA,  it will be interesting where all these teams fit in to the leagues, will it be by who jumped first or by finishing order in the junior leagues, I would imagine the existing teams in the EOSL will want to retain their place in the top league so not much room for junior teams ?

I will miss playing against some of the top East teams in the junior cup but they have decided to leave so thats it.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 minute ago, A.M said:

Quickly diminishing ERSJFA,  it will be interesting where all these teams fit in to the leagues, will it be by who jumped first or by finishing order in the junior leagues, I would imagine the existing teams in the EOSL will want to retain their place in the top league so not much room for junior teams ?

This was answered weeks ago. All clubs whether existing or newcomers will start at tier 6 next season and the EoS will be split into regionalised divisions for one transitional season with the top finishing clubs in 18/19 entering into a 16 team top flight division in 19/20 and the rest being at tier 7 in pyramid terms.

[A.M]

7 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

This was answered weeks ago. All clubs whether existing or newcomers will start at tier 6 next season and the EoS will be split into regionalised divisions for one transitional season with the top finishing clubs in 18/19 entering into a 16 team top flight division in 19/20 and the rest being at tier 7 in pyramid terms.

Is that definite ?

[LongTimeLurker]

Has been clearly stated by the EoS, but not 100% definite until ratified at their AGM next week.

[FairWeatherFan]

4 minutes ago, A.M said:

Quickly diminishing ERSJFA,  it will be interesting where all these teams fit in to the leagues, will it be by who jumped first or by finishing order in the junior leagues, I would imagine the existing teams in the EOSL will want to retain their place in the top league so not much room for junior teams ?

I will miss playing against some of the top East teams in the junior cup but they have decided to leave so thats it.

Not necessarily. When the EoS was gutted by the Lowland League they had been running with an EoS Premier & EoS First. To keep the league going Lowland clubs ran reserve teams to keep the numbers going, the EoS First clubs were quite happy not to kick up a fuss over getting promoted then. This even saw the rather odd 2014-15 season where the EoS Premier of 9 clubs (2 reserves) and the 2nd Tier EoS First with 8 clubs. They opted for that over a 17 single division or forcing the reserves out because it better represented the standards of the clubs and would mean more competitive games.

One of the reasons they've not capped the number of entrants is because they want this transition to be as short as possible. They don't want to hoard the likes of Bonnyrigg, Linlithgow and Bo'ness. I doubt that any of them will be repeat EoS Champions because once they gain promotion to the Lowland League they won't be back (most likely). So if they don't want more than one season of lopsided losses, they certainly don't want multiple where clubs climb through the leagues.

That's why it's all in 2018-19 and bring in tiered leagues 2019-20 and beyond.

[LongTimeLurker]

1 minute ago, FairWeatherFan said:

...That's why it's all in 2018-19 and bring in tiered leagues 2019-20 and beyond.

One of the reason so many reluctant/hesitant superleague clubs eventually went for it is also probably at least in part that this season will be the last opportunity for newly entering clubs in the east to gain pyramid entry at tier 6 so that they are only one promotion away from the LL.

[welshbairn]

22 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

I find it very hard to judge. I don't see many phone calls to the North Region at any rate. Right now you can still get 30 odd clubs making up the East Region, as you know the North has 30 odd clubs that don't necessarily aspire to more than their lot. You'd imagine the West Region could still continue on with losing 30 clubs to the senior leagues.

Junior football could continue on in the same way that the EoS, SoS, HFL and NCFL carried on all those years. Just they'd have the Junior Cup and sense of identity that the non national Seniors never had. It could boil down to a West (now that districts in the West Region are being done away with), Central, East, North once it all plays out.

If the Banks o'Dee Chairman is serious about being uninterested in the HL, a merger of the Shire and Tayside juniors could make for a fairly competitive junior league, with travel not being much of an issue compared to before. Being as the NRJFA is Shire dominated, and the HL have done fuckall about the pyramid, I see that as a possibility with the North and West being left on their own to sort something out with the NCL.

[Junior_Arab]

58 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Doubt it. Think any of the clubs that would be tempted by it lower down the leagues would rather have 2018/19 be in fairly local leagues against some of the bigger clubs from the area. It then gives everyone year to figure out what the future will hold.

And for the bigger clubs as you may have seen from some of their tweets are very anti EoS/pro juniors right now.

I’m sure in the spreadsheet of the questionnaire results a few were pro pyramid. So that suggests that they are either in limbo or just not in favour of the pyramid in this guise (ie maybe they would rather be in the LL rather than HL catchment). 

I cant believe no team north of the Tay didn’t fire in a speculative EoS application just to test the water. Or hasn’t contacted TJ to see what he’s suggesting. Or the SFA or the HL to see about being part of a feeder. Or the North Region Juniors to propose a merger. It definitely does look like they’ve been largely ignored as poor relations, BUT I’m not sure they’ve been particularly pro active in improving their situation. 

[FairWeatherFan]

4 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

One of the reason so many reluctant/hesitant superleague clubs eventually went for it is also probably at least in part that this season will be the last opportunity for newly entering clubs in the east to gain pyramid entry at tier 6 so that they are only one promotion away from the LL.

Yip, they'd be in Tier 7 while the early adopters would be strengthening at Tier 6 and licenced making. 2 years athe very best just to get to the Lowland League isn't a very sunny outlook for some.

[FairWeatherFan]

2 minutes ago, Junior_Arab said:

I’m sure in the spreadsheet of the questionnaire results a few were pro pyramid. So that suggests that they are either in limbo or just not in favour of the pyramid in this guise (ie maybe they would rather be in the LL rather than HL catchment). 

I cant believe no team north of the Tay didn’t fire in a speculative EoS application just to test the water. Or hasn’t contacted TJ to see what he’s suggesting. Or the SFA or the HL to see about being part of a feeder. Or the North Region Juniors to propose a merger. It definitely does look like they’ve been largely ignored as poor relations, BUT I’m not sure they’ve been particularly pro active in improving their situation. 

That comment was a particular nod to the approaches of Lochee Utd and Carnoustie on twitter.

I'm sure there are clubs that feel stuck in limbo, and my hopes is that some are doing something about it.

An obvious club to reach out to would be Montrose Roselea. If the North Region Juniors or a NoSFL is something they'd consider, Roselea obviously have a couple years experience to inform decisions and could probably indicate Northern feelings to some sort of merger on any level.