Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Todd_is_God]

9 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Unrelated, though maybe not, the fat Edinburgh Labour MP getting a headline the other day in the Herald online something like “the Scottish people losing faith in Sturgeon”.

The limited polls I’ve seen suggest the absolute opposite but the Herald obviously feels it is fair and balanced journalism to offer a platform to this unsubstantiated nonsense.

The big reveal of 'her' roadmap tomorrow (minus the ability for people to get back to work) might influence that.

Though probably not as there is little incentive to go back to work for many, as after work is finished they can't really do anything

Edited May 20, 2020 by Todd_is_God

[madwullie]

Just read on twitter that super drug are selling an antibody test, 70 notes. 97% accuracy apparently. 

[madwullie]

9 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

From what I’ve read, which is also limited, an explanation has been given which certain folk are unwilling to accept.

I think that the Scottish Government have questions to answer related to their handling of the crisis, not sure this is one of them.  However the SNPbad lot will no doubt have a go.

Unrelated, though maybe not, the fat Edinburgh Labour MP getting a headline the other day in the Herald online something like “the Scottish people losing faith in Sturgeon”.

The limited polls I’ve seen suggest the absolute opposite but the Herald obviously feels it is fair and balanced journalism to offer a platform to this unsubstantiated nonsense.

 

I mean I do feel that Tories and Labour are choking for an opportunity to stick the boot in, and will deoserately grab at anything at all, no matter how thin - but I'm also aware I'm an snp supporter and have prejudices because of that, and if NS has made an arse of something then it should be pointed out, especially given how (rightly) critical many are being about Johnston 

[Granny Danger]

Just now, madwullie said:

I mean I do feel that Tories and Labour are choking for an opportunity to stick the boot in, and will deoserately grab at anything at all, no matter how thin - but I'm also aware I'm an snp supporter and have prejudices because of that, and if NS has made an arse of something then it should be pointed out, especially given how (rightly) critical many are being about Johnston 

Like I say she gave an explanation that related to an issue of confidentiality of individuals that could not be breached.  Some folk are not willing to accept that explanation.

[Todd_is_God]

4 minutes ago, madwullie said:

Just read on twitter that super drug are selling an antibody test, 70 notes. 97% accuracy apparently. 

Limited point in shelling out for one atm tbf

[Granny Danger]

8 minutes ago, madwullie said:

Just read on twitter that super drug are selling an antibody test, 70 notes. 97% accuracy apparently. 

Not sure how that works. If you took the test twice and got the same result would that improve the accuracy?

 

[Todd_is_God]

2 minutes ago, Granny Danger said:

Like I say she gave an explanation that related to an issue of confidentiality of individuals that could not be breached.  Some folk are not willing to accept that explanation.

Covid-19 was a reportable disease in Scotland on 22nd Feb.

https://www.gov.scot/news/coronavirus-becomes-notifiable-disease-in-scotland/

It's completely unacceptable to use confidentiality clauses after this date as an excuse.

Make no mistake that if this was not the SNP and in Scotland we'd be all over it.

[ICTChris]

The explanation given about the conference is that it couldn't be publicised due to patient confidentiality.  I'm not sure that stands up - how could it be the case that making public the outbreak of an infectious potentially deadly illness could not trump the confidentiality?  Also, taking public health steps like warning people who were in the vicinity or cancelling gatherings would not have required any breach of confidentiality.  The fact there was significant community transmission of the virus in Scotland, in one of the most densely populated parts of the second largest city and that no-one in the public was told about it does stand out as a bit of an issue though.  Was the hotel shut down?  Did they test all the staff?  Did any contact tracing take place of people in contact with the delegates, as was supposed to happen at that time given the stage in the response we were at?  As far as i can see the answer to those questions is no.

Of course, this is looking at things with the benefit of hindsight, as all the decisions and actions taken in February and early March are.  If the Scottish Government had publicised this and cancelled, for example, the Inverness v Hibs Scottish cup tie, people would've been outraged, and it would've been against the advice of the scientific advisers, who were advising that mass gatherings were safe for weeks after this.

The most disspiriting thing about this story in terms of politics though, is that it's pretty clear that people are just sitting back in their entrenched positions - SNPBad or SNPGood, Yoon media bad, Nippy bad etc etc.  A significant number of people just turn their hearing off if someone they have decided is their champion has made a mistake or faces difficult questions.  There are huge questions about the way this disease outbreak has been handled by the Scottish Government but I doubt there will be significant holding to account of anyone because of the sclerotic politics we have, where everyone who takes an active interest supports their side and there is no real opposition or alternative.

[Wee Bully]

2 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said:

Covid-19 was a reportable disease in Scotland on 22nd Feb.

https://www.gov.scot/news/coronavirus-becomes-notifiable-disease-in-scotland/

It's completely unacceptable to use confidentiality clauses after this date as an excuse.

Make no mistake that if this was not the SNP and in Scotland we'd be all over it.

Sorry - you have me confused here.  

Are you saying it wasn't notified?

[HeartsOfficialMoaner]

With all them old folks sent back to care homes from hospitals and taking the virus with them can the relatives of the victims sue the governments/NHS/care homes?

[Todd_is_God]

8 minutes ago, Wee Bully said:

Sorry - you have me confused here.  

Are you saying it wasn't notified?

"At least 25 people linked to the Nike event may have contracted the virus but people who shared facilities with delegates were not told.

The first minister said details were not made public at the time because of patient confidentiality guidelines."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52711995

There is no excuse for not making people aware they came in to contact with people who tested positive, particularly during the early part of the outbreak when there were next to no cases.

Edited May 20, 2020 by Todd_is_God

[Wee Bully]

3 minutes ago, Todd_is_God said:

"At least 25 people linked to the Nike event may have contracted the virus but people who shared facilities with delegates were not told.

The first minister said details were not made public at the time because of patient confidentiality guidelines."

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52711995

There is no excuse for not making people aware they came in to contact with people who tested positive, particularly during the early part of the outbreak when there were next to no cases.

Is that what something becoming a "notifiable disease" means?

[HeartsOfficialMoaner]

My question to the politicians when they stand up chatting about how well they are doing would be, have your lawyers told you to admit nothing just in case you get sued to fcuk?

[ICTChris]

A notifiable disease means that the relevant public health authoriities should be notified of any cases, either in writing or via telephone.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notifiable_diseases_in_the_United_Kingdom

[Todd_is_God]

8 minutes ago, Wee Bully said:

Is that what something becoming a "notifiable disease" means?

No of course it doesn't. But for the SNP to say they couldn't tell people for confidentiality reasons they had obviously been made aware as the legislation had been followed.

There is no excuse for the SNP not acting on this.

Like I said had this been London rather than Edinburgh, and people not been notified they had come in to contact with a group of people testing positive right at the start of an outbreak the Tories would get called out on it.

The SNP don't get a free pass

Edited May 20, 2020 by Todd_is_God

[ICTChris]

I think I posted it on here earlier in the thread but if that Nike Conference outbreak happens in the next six months or wherever, the response will be to lock down the city of Edinburgh.  From what the First MInister said today it's being investigated if the specific straing associated with the outbreak is more widespread in Scotland.

[Wee Bully]

1 minute ago, ICTChris said:

A notifiable disease means that the relevant public health authoriities should be notified of any cases, either in writing or via telephone.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Notifiable_diseases_in_the_United_Kingdom

I know that, which is why i asked

 

Just now, Todd_is_God said:

No of course it doesn't. But for the SNP to say they couldn't tell people for confidentiality reasons they had obviously been made aware as the legislation had been followed.

There is no excuse for the SNP not acting on this.

This is a word salad, but I'll try to interpret.  

Notification happened correctly?  I'm thinking you agree with this.

The fact that it has been notified to the relevant authorities therefore means the world should be told?  Regardless of patient confidentiality?  

[ICTChris]

1 minute ago, Wee Bully said:

The fact that it has been notified to the relevant authorities therefore means the world should be told?  Regardless of patient confidentiality?  

In some circumstances, yes absolutely.  I think there is provision for that in the legislation.

[Wee Bully]

1 minute ago, ICTChris said:

In some circumstances, yes absolutely.  I think there is provision for that in the legislation.

So, "in some circumstances" suggests that not in all.  In other words, there is a balancing act to be carried out.

I'm not saying the SG made the right call, but it was a call they were entitled to make.

[Todd_is_God]

7 minutes ago, Wee Bully said:

The fact that it has been notified to the relevant authorities therefore means the world should be told?  Regardless of patient confidentiality?  

Let me ask you this.

Whilst the conference took place, there were zero recorded cases of Covid-19 in Scotland.

Do you not agree that, if it later came to light that a number of people who had been at an event in Scotland had tested positive,it may have been a good idea to attempt to test those who may have come in to contact with them, test them and potentially limit the spread?

What is the point in bringing in legislation to then not make use of the information?

Edited May 20, 2020 by Todd_is_God