Pull My Strings Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 8 minutes ago, craigkillie said: The post I was replying to said "if you are cited you need to defend your position - it's not a fucking choice". I don't believe this to be remotely true - there was absolutely no requirement for these clubs to be represented. They were entitled to be represented, and I'm not criticising them for doing so, but it absolutely is a choice. The "position" in the context of the post made it sounds as though there was some stance or decision taken by those clubs which was material to the case. This is not true. The promoted clubs have a position in both senses (1. they have been promoted and need to defend that promotion; 2. the resolution is not unfair on Hearts, etc. and reversing their promotion would be grossly unfair on the promoted). It's frankly nonsense to suggest that they don't have a position, whatever you may wish to infer from that word. Now, literally, they do have a choice in the same way as anyone cited in a civil action has a choice. You can ignore it and let the court make a judgement in your absence but it's not a sensible choice. I think that's what the chap was getting at. The SPFL could have ignored it as well. They also had a choice. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gorgie greatness Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 3 hours ago, Insaintee said: If you don't get eight million, I'd guess you guys are next Na we will offset it by getting a Celtic super store at tynie....that’ll work right? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mishtergrolsch Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 This thread 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snifter Pee Rot Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 So they've no beef with Dundee U, good, decision was legal, case dismissed, take your medicine. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Golden Gordon Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 11 minutes ago, mishtergrolsch said: This thread Think we can probably guess who the occupants of the speeding van were... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 8GamesToGo Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, Aim Here said: There was no legal onus on the SPFL to respond either. They could have ignored it and sucked up the default judgement. But they obviously had to do it because the lawsuit was going to target them and cost them a shitton. Likewise, the three clubs would have to reply if they didn't want to lose a shitton - £10 million between Raith and United, if the petition's assessment of the cost of being in a lower league, as opposed to a higher one isn't a fantasy pulled-out-of-their-arse figure. And the SPFL's defence is not going to be the same as the three clubs defence - the three clubs have to be the guys paying the lawyers if they want the lawyer to represent their interests. As for the other points - it was a retort to Hearts statement; they felt the need to rehash that argument, I'll just autopilot the response. There was nothing stoping the SPFL getting all clubs together ages ago if calling the league early really was the only route they wanted to go down and coming up with a compensation package. At that time Budge was talking 3m and probably would settle for half. Instead they didn't even mention the relegated clubs in their announcement after the resolution was passed (eventually). From the start the SPFL has set the tone of this. They've used the media to say they have no money, ie no compensation for you. This basically meant take it to court or nothing and forced Hearts and Pt's hands from the start. They didn't take control of the reconstruction process. They didn't take control of anything to be honest. Club chairman have been all over the papers spouting all sorts of nonsense. Now very quiet all of a sudden - why's that? Nothing to gain for them I suppose. They've set clubs against clubs. In social media the open misogyny has been absolutely disgusting, also from a couple of club chairmen in the press one in particular I can't remember his name. Do we honestly think one of the boys club members would have got this level of stick? Now they're promoting a tactic of actually encouraging open warfare between clubs. I only see this as helping Pt and Hearts but it's an absolute car crash and it's all on the SPFL. Edited July 10, 2020 by 8GamesToGo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilbur Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 I'm confident that, at some point in the future, the handful of Hearts fans who have polluted this thread with their relentless "poor me", "it's an injustice ", "Neil Cockwomble is a criminal ", etc, etc, will come to realise that Ann Budge and her catalogue of tactical misjudgments has all along been the problem for Hearts, not the solution. Today's statement, implying that the court defence by the 3 promoted clubs will be divisive, is so ludicrous coming from the party that chose to pursue court action (and a ridiculous compensation claim) against the rest of Scottish football. 10 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 8GamesToGo Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Wilbur said: I'm confident that, at some point in the future, the handful of Hearts fans who have polluted this thread with their relentless "poor me", "it's an injustice ", "Neil Cockwomble is a criminal ", etc, etc, will come to realise that Ann Budge and her catalogue of tactical misjudgments has all along been the problem for Hearts, not the solution. Today's statement, implying that the court defence by the 3 promoted clubs will be divisive, is so ludicrous coming from the party that chose to pursue court action (and a ridiculous compensation claim) against the rest of Scottish football. "it's an injustice ", You could be quoting Micky Mellon there a few weeks ago when he was at Tranmere. Every club would be doing the same in our position. Hearts chose none of this. There were always other options. We'll find out anyhow although the way things are going (slowly or not at all) we'll probably end up back in court at this rate. On the Budge thing. See when Hibs slid down the leagues for years eventually getting relegated, tactical misjudgement after tactical misjudgement, millions wasted, a manager sacked almost every year, squad disputes... Who was in charge? Rod Petrie. Now head of the SFA. There are many incompetent people in Scottish football. How is it some get rewarded for mistakes and others get trashed? It's an old boys club from top to bottom - Celtic to Brechin. Edited July 10, 2020 by 8GamesToGo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aim Here Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, 8GamesToGo said: From the start the SPFL has set the tone of this. They've used the media to say they have no money, ie no compensation for you. This basically meant take it to court or nothing and forced Hearts and Pt's hands from the start. Your problem is that the SPFL was right to say that. Paying out prize money early to all 42 clubs meant taking on an unsecured risk of nearly £2 million to debtors on the grounds that they were having financial difficulties. The SPFL only has ~£5 million or so in assets. It would be criminal financial negligence to take on that kind of risk - it's like taking out a mortgage in order to lend your bankrupt, unemployed, mate 1/3 of the value of your house until payday, and hoping that he'll be able to pay you back. Ann Budge seems to think that if the SPFL is able to lend £150k to one obviously solvent club in 2017, it's able to lend £2 million to a bunch of distressed ones in 2020. Just as that unemployed mate of yours is moaning that you lent your cousin £50 last month, so you can lend him £80,000 today. 13 minutes ago, 8GamesToGo said: They didn't take control of the reconstruction process. It's not the SPFL's job to take control of it. The clubs make the decisions, the SPFL bureaucracy administers the decisions they make. If a club wants to change how the league works, it's their job to drum up support for it and propose the rule changes. If Ann Budge is too bone idle or too politically inept to pick up the phone and talk to League Two clubs to at least even see what their opinions are, let alone persuade them of the merits of her favourite system, that's not Neil Doncaster's problem. His problem is giving her the opportunity to look into the issue, and to facilitate the votes and the process by which she could do that - and he put her in charge of the reconstruction committee and gave her two perfectly good shots at drumming up the support. Edited July 10, 2020 by Aim Here 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beans on Toast Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 Would one of my learned colleagues kindly advise how to put someone on ignore? Thank you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ric Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 Personally I would like to have Tom English's take on the statement, after all he has always come across as reasoned and balanced throughout this whole affair. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aim Here Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, Beans on Toast said: Would one of my learned colleagues kindly advise how to put someone on ignore? Thank you. If you're on a PC, hover your mouse cursor over 8GamesToGo's username or userpic, and a popup window comes up with the option to ignore him. Hope this helps. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 8GamesToGo Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, Aim Here said: Your problem is that the SPFL was right to say that. Then they shouldn't have let it get to court and put member clubs at risk of a compensation payment they can't afford. There were other solutions that didn't have that risk. As I've said before it's incredible the support other fans are giving the SPFL over their handling of this. Hibs I can understand. Mid table, noting to win or lose, having a laugh at us, I'd be doing the same. I wouldn't be backing the SPFL like this though. Never seen anything like it in decades following Scottish football and there's some sort of dispute every year. Edited July 10, 2020 by 8GamesToGo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snifter Pee Rot Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, 8GamesToGo said: Then they shouldn't have let it get to court and put member clubs at risk of a compensation payment they can't afford. There were other solutions that didn't have that risk. As I've said before it's incredible the support other fans are giving the SPFL over their handling of this. Hibs I can understand. Mid table, noting to win or lose, having a laugh at us, I'd be doing the same. I wouldn't be backing the SPFL like this though. Never seen anything like it in decades following Scottish football and there's some sort of dispute every year. You are getting no compo. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 7 minutes ago, 8GamesToGo said: I wouldn't be backing the SPFL like this though. You would if Hibs were suing you for a share of £10 million. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 8GamesToGo Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 3 minutes ago, Snifter Pee Rot said: You are getting no compo. We get at least 300k parachute payment. Where's the 500k or whatever parachute payment earmarked for Hamilton if they'd gone down via a playoff they luckily avoided by voting to avoid it? Just pocketed? Why hasn't that been offered. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 8GamesToGo Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 1 minute ago, welshbairn said: You would if Hibs were suing you for a share of £10 million. Ignore the 10m it's a lawyer-led starting point. Hearts would probably have accepted a million or so and probably still would. At the time that amount was mooted, Hearts and PT were possibly looking at NO football next season - ie demoted to a league not running - as clubs in the lower leagues were talking about not being able to operate at all. That's now sorted so I'd imagine our expectations have been lowered. I don't know. A bit extra compensation for having to play 27 games only and lay off staff seems fine. Something for the Scottish cup nonsense of being put at a disadvantage compared to the other teams and missing out on a European spot potentially. I've always thought the parachute payment was silly, rewarding teams for getting relegated so I wouldn't expect anything in a normal season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FTOF Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 Just now, 8GamesToGo said: We get at least 300k parachute payment. Where's the 500k or whatever parachute payment earmarked for Hamilton if they'd gone down via a playoff they luckily avoided by voting to avoid it? Just pocketed? Why hasn't that been offered. Because you were bottom of the league, not in the play off position. You only get one reward for abject failure. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snifter Pee Rot Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 2 minutes ago, 8GamesToGo said: We get at least 300k parachute payment. Where's the 500k or whatever parachute payment earmarked for Hamilton if they'd gone down via a playoff they luckily avoided by voting to avoid it? Just pocketed? Why hasn't that been offered. You weren't in a play off spot so why does that affect you? None of your business. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted July 10, 2020 Share Posted July 10, 2020 1 minute ago, 8GamesToGo said: We get at least 300k parachute payment. Where's the 500k or whatever parachute payment earmarked for Hamilton if they'd gone down via a playoff they luckily avoided by voting to avoid it? Just pocketed? Why hasn't that been offered. Doncaster said on Sportsound that enhanced parachute payments could be discussed. Budge wasn't interested, went for reconstruction and when she failed miserably went straight to the CoS. Seeing as there hasn't been any playoff's the revenue to pay off the demoted clubs would have had to have come from a different source. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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