WoSFL Premier Division thread

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10 minutes ago, PossilYM said:

Enjoy the Lowland League then

Thank you!

[ParkTheBusFitbaPod]

https://parkthebusfitbapodcast.buzzsprout.com/1595431/14898606-tier-6-and-below

 

New pod

[An Absolute Imposter]

Sitting having a coffee and with SOS and EOS definitely taking part the play-off, realised that I didn't know who ir how many clubs in the WOS Prem are licensed, so had a look.

Some interesting little facts I found out, I can be a total anorak about facts and figures.

EOS Prem has 11 licensed clubs, occupying places 1 to 11. So will be losing 3 non- licensed clubs. Their 1st Div has 8 with it looking likely all 3 promotion places will be licensed clubs. Only Whitburn can realistically finish in top 3, their facilities appear up to scratch, so they might be close if licensing was allowed. 

Here in the SOS we have 5 licensed clubs in our Prem Div  . Top 3 places are licensed clubs. Just as well there is no relegation as bottom 2 clubs are licensed .

In WOS 8 of the 16 are licensed, which considering West entered pyramid a few seasons after East Juniors and we had the 2 season covid nonsense, is pretty decent to be fair; will come to the SFA and their games in a bit.

Of the 8 one looks lost to Div 1, Medda, in Div 1 there are only 2 licensed clubs; Glencairn and the North Ayrshire Gers, both of whom are involved in promotion battle.

Across each league the number of licensed clubs shows up the problem with licensing at this stage.

EOS have 26 out of 61 clubs I think, Stirling Uni don't count. Here in the SOS we have a massive 5 out if 11, Stranraer SOS again are invisible.

In the WOS, it's 15 out of 80.

So how can the SFA allow a pyramid system where so many clubs are basically excluded from it?

And how can they expect the biggest section of the pyramid to be fully committed with this 'suspension' in place. I think we are all aware if Beith's challenges with their Licensing journey. 

How many other clubs have been caught in this 'suspension net'.

There are a myriad of reasons why the SFA and others at the top of the pyramid are only paying lip service to the pyramid. If they care about grassroots football one jot, then either open up the pyramid to all the clubs or close the door and allow clubs, leagues, associations to decide if its worth being in the pyramid or not.

p.s. not looking to start a back door argument about juniors v seniors. Just think clubs have a right at upcoming agm's to discuss points like these and give their association a mandate to at least approach the SFA and ask questions. The SFA have acted like a dictatorship for too long, hold them to account

Another long winded post from that horse pest from doon Sooth. I'm bored waiting on the vet arriving.

[Vanderbilt]

42 minutes ago, An Absolute Imposter said:

Sitting having a coffee and with SOS and EOS definitely taking part the play-off, realised that I didn't know who ir how many clubs in the WOS Prem are licensed, so had a look.

Some interesting little facts I found out, I can be a total anorak about facts and figures.

EOS Prem has 11 licensed clubs, occupying places 1 to 11. So will be losing 3 non- licensed clubs. Their 1st Div has 8 with it looking likely all 3 promotion places will be licensed clubs. Only Whitburn can realistically finish in top 3, their facilities appear up to scratch, so they might be close if licensing was allowed. 

Here in the SOS we have 5 licensed clubs in our Prem Div  . Top 3 places are licensed clubs. Just as well there is no relegation as bottom 2 clubs are licensed .

In WOS 8 of the 16 are licensed, which considering West entered pyramid a few seasons after East Juniors and we had the 2 season covid nonsense, is pretty decent to be fair; will come to the SFA and their games in a bit.

Of the 8 one looks lost to Div 1, Medda, in Div 1 there are only 2 licensed clubs; Glencairn and the North Ayrshire Gers, both of whom are involved in promotion battle.

Across each league the number of licensed clubs shows up the problem with licensing at this stage.

EOS have 26 out of 61 clubs I think, Stirling Uni don't count. Here in the SOS we have a massive 5 out if 11, Stranraer SOS again are invisible.

In the WOS, it's 15 out of 80.

So how can the SFA allow a pyramid system where so many clubs are basically excluded from it?

And how can they expect the biggest section of the pyramid to be fully committed with this 'suspension' in place. I think we are all aware if Beith's challenges with their Licensing journey. 

How many other clubs have been caught in this 'suspension net'.

There are a myriad of reasons why the SFA and others at the top of the pyramid are only paying lip service to the pyramid. If they care about grassroots football one jot, then either open up the pyramid to all the clubs or close the door and allow clubs, leagues, associations to decide if its worth being in the pyramid or not.

p.s. not looking to start a back door argument about juniors v seniors. Just think clubs have a right at upcoming agm's to discuss points like these and give their association a mandate to at least approach the SFA and ask questions. The SFA have acted like a dictatorship for too long, hold them to account

Another long winded post from that horse pest from doon Sooth. I'm bored waiting on the vet arriving.

Don’t know why it isn’t just the highest placed licensed club.The LL are doing it as the B teams can’t go forward even if they win the league.

It should be the leagues nominated club not champion club.

Edited April 17 by Vanderbilt

[beithboy]

Pics from last night Glenafton  v Beith 

 

https://www.flickr.com/gp/swkphoto/2cB84U19q5

[timeforchange]

49 minutes ago, An Absolute Imposter said:

Sitting having a coffee and with SOS and EOS definitely taking part the play-off, realised that I didn't know who ir how many clubs in the WOS Prem are licensed, so had a look.

Some interesting little facts I found out, I can be a total anorak about facts and figures.

EOS Prem has 11 licensed clubs, occupying places 1 to 11. So will be losing 3 non- licensed clubs. Their 1st Div has 8 with it looking likely all 3 promotion places will be licensed clubs. Only Whitburn can realistically finish in top 3, their facilities appear up to scratch, so they might be close if licensing was allowed. 

Here in the SOS we have 5 licensed clubs in our Prem Div  . Top 3 places are licensed clubs. Just as well there is no relegation as bottom 2 clubs are licensed .

In WOS 8 of the 16 are licensed, which considering West entered pyramid a few seasons after East Juniors and we had the 2 season covid nonsense, is pretty decent to be fair; will come to the SFA and their games in a bit.

Of the 8 one looks lost to Div 1, Medda, in Div 1 there are only 2 licensed clubs; Glencairn and the North Ayrshire Gers, both of whom are involved in promotion battle.

Across each league the number of licensed clubs shows up the problem with licensing at this stage.

EOS have 26 out of 61 clubs I think, Stirling Uni don't count. Here in the SOS we have a massive 5 out if 11, Stranraer SOS again are invisible.

In the WOS, it's 15 out of 80.

So how can the SFA allow a pyramid system where so many clubs are basically excluded from it?

And how can they expect the biggest section of the pyramid to be fully committed with this 'suspension' in place. I think we are all aware if Beith's challenges with their Licensing journey. 

How many other clubs have been caught in this 'suspension net'.

There are a myriad of reasons why the SFA and others at the top of the pyramid are only paying lip service to the pyramid. If they care about grassroots football one jot, then either open up the pyramid to all the clubs or close the door and allow clubs, leagues, associations to decide if its worth being in the pyramid or not.

p.s. not looking to start a back door argument about juniors v seniors. Just think clubs have a right at upcoming agm's to discuss points like these and give their association a mandate to at least approach the SFA and ask questions. The SFA have acted like a dictatorship for too long, hold them to account

Another long winded post from that horse pest from doon Sooth. I'm bored waiting on the vet arriving.

Very good detailed explanation and some detail of why the pyramid system is flawed. The Sfa wanted a Wosfl to balance out there structure. I don’t think they expected the volume of clubs to all move over but clubs were reluctant to not move incase they were left out. Then came the obstacles slowly being put in place regarding promotion and relegation etc, criteria for promotion , licences required etc the list goes on and I’m 100% certain it’s not finished at that yet. Then you have the low and league letting clubs buy into their league how is that fair and sporting integrity when they can’t be promoted and it stops others from genuine promotion. It is the correct to have a pyramid system but not under the current way it works 

[glensmad]

17 minutes ago, Vanderbilt said:

Don’t know why it isn’t just the highest placed licensed club.The LL are doing it as the B teams can’t go forward even if they win the league.

It should be the leagues nominated club not champion club.

That has still to be tested as a B team hasn't won the Lowland League yet, so we don't know how the Scottish FA will react if a non-champion club were to be put forward for the Upper Pyramid Play-Off.

[glensmad]

5 minutes ago, timeforchange said:

Very good detailed explanation and some detail of why the pyramid system is flawed. The Sfa wanted a Wosfl to balance out there structure. I don’t think they expected the volume of clubs to all move over but clubs were reluctant to not move incase they were left out. Then came the obstacles slowly being put in place regarding promotion and relegation etc, criteria for promotion , licences required etc the list goes on and I’m 100% certain it’s not finished at that yet. Then you have the low and league letting clubs buy into their league how is that fair and sporting integrity when they can’t be promoted and it stops others from genuine promotion. It is the correct to have a pyramid system but not under the current way it works 

To be fair it was clear from the outset point of the formation of the WoSFL that a Scottish FA Licence would be required for promotion to the Lowland League. That has always been set in stone.

[FairWeatherFan]

23 minutes ago, Vanderbilt said:

Don’t know why it isn’t just the highest placed licensed club.The LL are doing it as the B teams can’t go forward even if they win the league.

It should be the leagues nominated club not champion club.

Because there's been a licensed Tier 6 Champion for every completed season since 2016-17. Why should another league champion be undermined because another league can't get itself in order.

The whole thing is a nonsense argument about putting in an endless series of caveats because some in the West feel they're being held back. When by the sounds of things, Beith could have ended up licensed if it hadn't been for an extraordinary set of circumstances. Made worse by the SFA freezing applications.

[Vanderbilt]

6 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Because there's been a licensed Tier 6 Champion for every completed season since 2016-17. Why should another league champion be undermined because another league can't get itself in order.

The whole thing is a nonsense argument about putting in an endless series of caveats because some in the West feel they're being held back. When by the sounds of things, Beith could have ended up licensed if it hadn't been for an extraordinary set of circumstances. Made worse by the SFA freezing applications.

Even more reason for changing it was the fact that SFA licensing had been suspended!

[FairWeatherFan]

1 minute ago, Vanderbilt said:

Even more reason for changing it was the fact that SFA licensing had been suspended!

The spots get filled already. You just want a participation trophy.

[Vanderbilt]

7 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

The spots get filled already. You just want a participation trophy.

How could clubs get licensed when it was suspended ffs

[Shanner]

58 minutes ago, Vanderbilt said:

Don’t know why it isn’t just the highest placed licensed club.The LL are doing it as the B teams can’t go forward even if they win the league.

It should be the leagues nominated club not champion club.

Yup plenty of precedent for it elsewhere in different forms. 

As we're in a setup where even qualifying Champions don't get promoted automatically it's not something I anticipate changing anytime soon. 

[Shanner]

34 minutes ago, FairWeatherFan said:

Because there's been a licensed Tier 6 Champion for every completed season since 2016-17. Why should another league champion be undermined because another league can't get itself in order.

The whole thing is a nonsense argument about putting in an endless series of caveats because some in the West feel they're being held back. When by the sounds of things, Beith could have ended up licensed if it hadn't been for an extraordinary set of circumstances. Made worse by the SFA freezing applications.

It's not really undermining anyone. Hypothetically you could have a team with no intention of seriously pursuing promotion or a licence spending the money they're saving on that process on their playing squad. Not very good for the integrity of things.

Win the league, get your trophy and if that's the height of your ambition then it shouldn't really be a problem if another side steps up to the plate 

[An Absolute Imposter]

1 hour ago, Vanderbilt said:

Don’t know why it isn’t just the highest placed licensed club.The LL are doing it as the B teams can’t go forward even if they win the league.

It should be the leagues nominated club not champion club.

Isn't that how it is in Engerland?.

It's definitely a possibility that should be explored. This next point is not aimed at Beith or any club challenging for the title, but one licensing is reopens there does need to be a commitment and evidence that they are working towards licensing or penalties are awarded I e. point deductions for example.

My main thought is that there needs to be discussions across the pyramid about this issue. The pyramid basically fails or succeeds on promotion and relegation. Fluidity its called.

[Cowden Cowboy]

1 hour ago, timeforchange said:

Very good detailed explanation and some detail of why the pyramid system is flawed. The Sfa wanted a Wosfl to balance out there structure. I don’t think they expected the volume of clubs to all move over but clubs were reluctant to not move incase they were left out. Then came the obstacles slowly being put in place regarding promotion and relegation etc, criteria for promotion , licences required etc the list goes on and I’m 100% certain it’s not finished at that yet. Then you have the low and league letting clubs buy into their league how is that fair and sporting integrity when they can’t be promoted and it stops others from genuine promotion. It is the correct to have a pyramid system but not under the current way it works 

B teams aren’t stopping anyone getting promotion.  If they weren’t there the LL would be operating with 16 teams and the same promotion/relegation rules 

[Cowden Cowboy]

1 hour ago, glensmad said:

That has still to be tested as a B team hasn't won the Lowland League yet, so we don't know how the Scottish FA will react if a non-champion club were to be put forward for the Upper Pyramid Play-Off.

B teams can’t be champions 

[glensmad]

2 minutes ago, Cowden Cowboy said:

B teams can’t be champions 

I know, but what I'm saying is the test will come when a B team finishes top of the Lowland League and the LL then nominates a team for the play-off who haven't finished top of their league. Will the SPFL accept it ? Time will tell.

[Cowden Cowboy]

Just now, glensmad said:

I know, but what I'm saying is the test will come when a B team finishes top of the Lowland League and the LL then nominates a team for the play-off who haven't finished top of their league. Will the SPFL accept it ? Time will tell.

Yes they will - that’s all been agreed - after all letting these B teams in is helping SPFL member clubs 

[glensmad]

2 minutes ago, Cowden Cowboy said:

Yes they will - that’s all been agreed - after all letting these B teams in is helping SPFL member clubs 

As I said, time will tell.