OFFICIAL HEARTS JUGGERNAUT THREAD 2020-

[VincentGuerin]

8 minutes ago, Molotov said:

I don’t think Aberdeen could not appoint him as manager after what he has achieved.

 

This is the kind of backwards thinking that prevails at our clubs, but you don't get in well-run businesses.

Of course you can move on a temporary employee in favour of someone you think will do the job better permanently. The business I work for does it all the time.

Doing a good job for ten weeks or so does not mean you get given a three-year contract if there are better options. I do not accept Robson was the best candidate for their job that Aberdeen could possibly have found. Said so at the time. Likewise with Naismith.

The leadership shown in the boardroom has to be better than this.

Edited September 3, 2023 by VincentGuerin

[Dons_1988]

Just now, VincentGuerin said:

You don't hire "some random". You draw up a spec and hire someone who fits the bill. Like a normal, functioning business.

The chances of that being a guy who happens to already be in the building and, as luck would have it, cheap as f**k, are slim.

‘Some random’ was facetious yet said from a fans perspective, not the clubs. not everything is literal. 

But every single manager is a gamble and if you oust a guy who’s churning results and clean sheets week after week from a team that was a laughing stock to appoint someone relatively obscure and who’s chances of success probably aren’t that much higher than robsons, you look silly. 

It was however always a risk that robson would be a Diddy at doing the real job. 

[Molotov]

How many top flight clubs are going to sack or replace their managers this season?

We are only a few weeks in and it is fcuking chaos in Scotland.  

[DC92]

1 minute ago, Dons_1988 said:

 

We were left in a difficult position. His leverage for the job was clearly helped by external circumstances (just how much of a mess Goodwin made and hearts implosion plus 3rd place being more significant than normal) but you can’t argue he took an absolute shambles and dragged it into a solid unit. 

Every manager is a gamble and if you give it to some random over robson and he fucks it you look ridiculous. Robson had to be given a go at building his own side but he looks to have fucked it early doors. 

The recruitment may well be ok but he looks tactically clueless now that we’ve moved away from just shutting down the opposition and letting clarkson, duk and miovski go and attack. 

Naismith was given the job full time for much less imo. 

The last paragraph is unquestionably true.

Robson took a team that was at rock bottom and had zero expectations but still had some good players and had sorted its main personnel issue in January, got a couple of wins after a meh start and then harnessed the momentum really well. Then the winning run ended and he hasn't looked so clever since.

I said at the time the only positive for us was that Aberdeen would be obliged to hire an unproven manager based on what is ultimately a small sample size. Unfortunately we have done the same thing but for much flimsier reasons.

[Molotov]

@VincentGuerin who would you have appointed instead of Robson at the end of last season after he took over in 6th and got them to 3rd? 

Who would you have appointed as Hearts manager(s) instead of the current gruesome twosome?

[VincentGuerin]

8 minutes ago, Molotov said:

@VincentGuerin who would you have appointed instead of Robson at the end of last season after he took over in 6th and got them to 3rd? 

Who would you have appointed as Hearts manager(s) instead of the current gruesome twosome?

People ask these questions as if it's some kind of zinger that I won't name someone.

But it's not my job to hire someone. Across Europe there are literally hundreds of people who are qualified fitba coaches with experience and who would be chuffed to bits to get a well-paid job in Edinburgh.

It is the job of the Hearts board to go and find one. Asking "Who would you have hired, then" shows that you just don't get the problem here. It's such simplistic nonsense.

Edited September 3, 2023 by VincentGuerin

[Dons_1988]

1 minute ago, VincentGuerin said:

People ask these questions as if it's some kind of zinger that I won't name someone.

But it's not mu job to hire someone. Across Europe there are literally hundreds of people who are qualified fitba coaches with experience and who would be chuffed to bits to get a well-paid job in Edinburgh.

It is the job of the Hearts board to go and find one. Asking "Who would you have hired, then" shows that you just don't get the problem here. It's such simplistic nonsense.

It is but your perspective is just as simplistic. It’s pretty easy to sit on the outside and demand that you knock everything down and start again then shrug your shoulders when asked to suggest where you go next. ‘Not my problem, pal’. 

It’s really not as easy as ‘there’s loads of coaches, just pick one!’. Not saying either of our clubs couldn’t do better at a manager search but clubs all over the world get this wrong all the time. 

[VincentGuerin]

7 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

It is but your perspective is just as simplistic. It’s pretty easy to sit on the outside and demand that you knock everything down and start again then shrug your shoulders when asked to suggest where you go next. ‘Not my problem, pal’. 

It’s really not as easy as ‘there’s loads of coaches, just pick one!’. Not saying either of our clubs couldn’t do better at a manager search but clubs all over the world get this wrong all the time. 

Clubs getting it wrong is not mitigation for not bothering your arse.

Genuinely stop and think about this. Hearts and Aberdeen can both offer good six-figure salaries, attractive living situations, clubs that have access to European football and an obvious stepping stone in a coach's career.

If you're telling me you think either club should ever be appointing someone who has never coached a first team before, then I just flat out disagree with you. We've done it three times in a decade now. The only time it was excusable was then we were emerging from admin. Even then, I wasn't mad keen.

Edited September 3, 2023 by VincentGuerin

[DC92]

23 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

This is my issue. Plus, as outlined above, I was not impressed with the 'process' that saw him get the job.

Hearts, as a club, get everything they could ask for from the fans. The stadium is full every week and we fire a fortune in through the FoH. We also have the good fortune of James Anderson. We are in a great position.

Yet, we have complete fucking amateurs running the club. Our managerial choices are ridiculous. We have money. We have a huge market to choose from. The club are squandering a tremendous situation.

We've played fucking Kilmarnock and Motherwell at home, and can't argue we deserve any more than we have. It's so, so poor.

Unfortunately there is no evidence we have any idea how to properly identify and recruit a manager. None whatsoever.

Aside from Stendel, who was hired based on fan hype, every manager we've appointed since admin has got the job because of who they know or the fact they happened to be in the building at the time. Naismith might even be the worst example of this given he was brought to the club as a player.

The one time I can remember us interviewing a shortlist of candidates was after Cathro was sacked. We then binned off all those candidates and hired Levein instead.

"Amateurs" is correct.

[VincentGuerin]

6 minutes ago, DC92 said:

"Amateurs" is correct.

There are individual mistakes that an organisation can make and that's just life. But at Hearts we now have a pattern going back years now. From the Main Stand, to recruitment, to managerial recruitment, to the obvious folly of how slow they were to act on Neilson (giving him a longer contract!). Even the way the likes of McKinley have handled themselves in public.

The club has a long record now of poor decision making and masses of evidence that the people running the club are basically just shite at it.

I can't think of how we could be better placed in terms of finance. STs sold out, every home game sold out, James Anderson, FoH, last year's European money. Yet the folk running the club continue to spunk it against the wall.

[Insert Amusing Pseudonym]

Do i think we'll sack him atm?  No.  Would it be harsh if we did, possibly.  But we've massively regressed even from even the minor improvement we showed at the end of the season.

He's already at a point where it seems like when rather than if he goes

[VincentGuerin]

6 minutes ago, Insert Amusing Pseudonym said:

Do i think we'll sack him atm?  No.  Would it be harsh if we did, possibly.  But we've massively regressed even from even the minor improvement we showed at the end of the season.

He's already at a point where it seems like when rather than if he goes

It would be harsh to sack Naismith on his own. He's not the sole problem here.

The whole management structure of the footballing side should be going. It's not working.

 

[DC92]

2 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

There are individual mistakes that an organisation can make and that's just life. But at Hearts we now have a pattern going back years now. From the Main Stand, to recruitment, to managerial recruitment, to the obvious folly of how slow they were to act on Neilson (giving him a longer contract!). Even the way the likes of McKinley have handled themselves in public.

The club has a long record now of poor decision making and masses of evidence that the people running the club are basically just shite at it.

I can't think of how we could be better placed in terms of finance. STs sold out, every home game sold out, James Anderson, FoH, last year's European money. Yet the folk running the club continue to spunk it against the wall.

This is the frustrating thing.

And it means this season is fucked. It shouldn't be fucked, because we have a more than capable squad and there isn't a standout team outside the OF. Even having a clueless manager isn't necessarily a problem because you can just replace them. But it is fucked, because when Naismith is binned in a few weeks they won't have a clue who to bring in.

After Neilson was sacked, I'm pretty sure McKinlay said that we keep a list of potential successors to ensure we're prepared in the event of a managerial exit. Two months later, we'd interviewed one midtable rando from Sweden who Aberdeen had been linked to and then hired the B team coach. Risible.

[VincentGuerin]

Can't wait for October's press release.

'After a thorough and extensive process, we are delighted to announce that Liam Fox was the outstanding candidate and the right man to take the club forward.'

[Stylish Kid]

49 minutes ago, DC92 said:

This is the frustrating thing.

And it means this season is fucked. It shouldn't be fucked, because we have a more than capable squad and there isn't a standout team outside the OF. Even having a clueless manager isn't necessarily a problem because you can just replace them. But it is fucked, because when Naismith is binned in a few weeks they won't have a clue who to bring in.

This. 

[Gorgie greatness]

2 hours ago, Molotov said:

@VincentGuerin who would you have appointed instead of Robson at the end of last season after he took over in 6th and got them to 3rd? 

Who would you have appointed as Hearts manager(s) instead of the current gruesome twosome?

It’s a threesome wee Gordon Forrest puts oot the cones!

[Darren]

Now's the time to act. International break, say thanks for keeping us ticking over and hire a proper football manager. But we won't, we'll sack them all in October and give it to Fox until the end of the season. A fucking shambles of a club.

[DC92]

Funny thing is, we're probably going to end up confirming him as actual manager this week.

[Darren]

36 minutes ago, DC92 said:

Funny thing is, we're probably going to end up confirming him as actual manager this week.

Must be hilarious for everyone else.

It's sorely tempting to ditch the FoH sub. I'd be better placed burning cash in my garden.

Edited September 4, 2023 by Darren

[Pens_Dark]

I get the impression that not sacking Naismith & co in the international break would just be kicking the can down the road. With Robson at least there was a reason for Aberdeen keeping him on. I just don't see that with Hearts & Naismith. It would be a massive opportunity wasted if they didn't bring in a competent manager to take charge of what is probably the 3rd best team in the league with strength in depth & quality. 

The appointment in the first place was just down right odd.