East Region Juniors

[Burnieman]

"Teams with delusions of grandeur who have destroyed what we have loved for decades" dear God.

"Move away from East football who have destroyed what I loved"

These people are destroying their own club, they just can't see it.

[Bestsinceslicebread]

5 hours ago, Whitburn Vale said:

They dont care Stanley.....

A lot of this is still driven by bitterness.

They are still raging at those around them that took the leap and moved on,ruining the "grade".

One of the Whitburn committee men has just posted something to back up what I've just said...

I am delighted that we're going senior and feel the EoS would be best suited for us but that decision will lie with the committee or the WoS/EoS..

 

Whitburn Vale, total get what your saying but for me I will never get this bitterness, when that person(s) you have  a job to do for your club
Any bitterness is from people who are only interested in themselves.
When in their job, volunteer or paid, they should be looking after their club and the clubs future, not making decisions based on their own personal bitterness.

I will say to anyone, even face to face, teams moving to the pyramid never ruined the grade as in junior. The junior level was and still is a celling level of football with no progression and teams who have left, well I believe, have left to progress their club and their future, so to me what's wrong with that trying to better your team and try to make it secure.

Edited February 20, 2021 by Bestsinceslicebread

[Pyramidic]

The other issue is of course the fate of the Tayside clubs that remain outwith the EOSFL heartland. Blairgowrie Junior FC posted the following statement on 5 June 2018 and it is clear that no progress has been made whatsoever over the last two and a half years.

Blairgowrie  Statement

“CLUB STATEMENT re EAST REGION LEAGUE
Many of you will be aware of the current turbulence in the world of Scottish Junior Football. It is important to explain what is going on, and what it will mean for our club.
A survey was carried out by the Scottish Junior FA (SJFA) asking all member clubs  to agree or disagree with the proposal that the SJFA join the relatively new pyramid system within Scottish football. 
We, at Blairgowrie, were in agreement with this, in line with the majority of member clubs. These results gave the SJFA the go ahead to negotiate a place for all member clubs within the SFA pyramid.
However, since these results were made public a large number of our fellow East Region clubs have joined, or have applied to join, the East of Scotland (Senior) League (EoSL). The EoSL already exists within the pyramid with promotion to the Lowland League and eventual promotion to the SPFL 2.  These clubs have done so with the intention of joining the pyramid system in time for the start of next season. There has been no communication from the SJFA regarding any success in negotiating a united pathway to the pyramid for junior clubs. 
We, at Blairgowrie, affirm that we have not applied to join the East of Scotland League, or to leave the juniors' East Region. All of our fellow East Region junior clubs that have applied to join the EoSL, including Jeanfield Swifts, find themselves, geographically, within its catchment area. This extends as far north as the River Tay. Clubs north of the Tay, like Blairgowrie, are in the SFA’s north zone. Currently, there is no similar pathway to the pyramid in this area and so Tayside clubs are unable to make a move such as those made by clubs from Fife, Lothians and others south of the Tay. The Highland League operates within the pyramid system but there is no avenue for promotion into it. 
It is possible that 25 clubs will leave the East Region of the Juniors. A meeting will take place on 12th June to re-organise the remaining  clubs into a new league structure. 
Despite these events, we are working hard to ensure that, whatever league we may find ourselves in, we can meet the challenges that come our way. As ever, we look forward to the continuing support of the people of Blairgowrie.“
 

I think the critical issue is that the Tayside clubs lack leadership to take the bull by the horns and sort the mess out. With no football being played there is probably not a better time to sort out the Tayside conundrum before the 31st March 2021. Zoom meetings are necessary with the key parties - SFA, HL, ERJFA, NRJFA, LL, EOSFL, WOSFL and SOSFL - to properly sort out a route map for Tayside football.

Inaction will result in another year wasted.

[Dev]

17 hours ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:

I was told its its easier travel in the WOSFL if its put into district conferences

But to be honest I think personally that it should go by boundaries and no other way. if a team play in the West then they need to go to the WOSFL and the same for teams that are in the East boundaries, they should join the EOSFL

If a new WoS bottom division is created for all new clubs then it would cover the whole of the WoS area e.g. possibly Saltcoats with Kilbride Thistle. They'll have to hope that no more Ayrshire clubs decide to give it a go.

[Dev]

2 hours ago, Pyramidic said:

The other issue is of course the fate of the Tayside clubs that remain outwith the EOSFL heartland. Blairgowrie Junior FC posted the following statement on 5 June 2018 and it is clear that no progress has been made whatsoever over the last two and a half years.

Blairgowrie  Statement

“CLUB STATEMENT re EAST REGION LEAGUE
Many of you will be aware of the current turbulence in the world of Scottish Junior Football. It is important to explain what is going on, and what it will mean for our club.
A survey was carried out by the Scottish Junior FA (SJFA) asking all member clubs  to agree or disagree with the proposal that the SJFA join the relatively new pyramid system within Scottish football. 
We, at Blairgowrie, were in agreement with this, in line with the majority of member clubs. These results gave the SJFA the go ahead to negotiate a place for all member clubs within the SFA pyramid.
However, since these results were made public a large number of our fellow East Region clubs have joined, or have applied to join, the East of Scotland (Senior) League (EoSL). The EoSL already exists within the pyramid with promotion to the Lowland League and eventual promotion to the SPFL 2.  These clubs have done so with the intention of joining the pyramid system in time for the start of next season. There has been no communication from the SJFA regarding any success in negotiating a united pathway to the pyramid for junior clubs. 
We, at Blairgowrie, affirm that we have not applied to join the East of Scotland League, or to leave the juniors' East Region. All of our fellow East Region junior clubs that have applied to join the EoSL, including Jeanfield Swifts, find themselves, geographically, within its catchment area. This extends as far north as the River Tay. Clubs north of the Tay, like Blairgowrie, are in the SFA’s north zone. Currently, there is no similar pathway to the pyramid in this area and so Tayside clubs are unable to make a move such as those made by clubs from Fife, Lothians and others south of the Tay. The Highland League operates within the pyramid system but there is no avenue for promotion into it. 
It is possible that 25 clubs will leave the East Region of the Juniors. A meeting will take place on 12th June to re-organise the remaining  clubs into a new league structure. 
Despite these events, we are working hard to ensure that, whatever league we may find ourselves in, we can meet the challenges that come our way. As ever, we look forward to the continuing support of the people of Blairgowrie.“
 

I think the critical issue is that the Tayside clubs lack leadership to take the bull by the horns and sort the mess out. With no football being played there is probably not a better time to sort out the Tayside conundrum before the 31st March 2021. Zoom meetings are necessary with the key parties - SFA, HL, ERJFA, NRJFA, LL, EOSFL, WOSFL and SOSFL - to properly sort out a route map for Tayside football.

Inaction will result in another year wasted.

Haven't there ben one or two posts from supporters of north Tayside clubs hinting that one or more may apply to the EoS in order to see what happens so that the remaining north Tayside clubs will then know one way or the other if the EoS will accept them/any of them?  If the EoS doesn't accept them then it's decision time about what to do e.g. remain Junior, link up with the North Juniors, form a standalone Pyramid League to feed into the Highland Pyramid etc etc.

[sdr71]

35 minutes ago, Dev said:

Haven't there ben one or two posts from supporters of north Tayside clubs hinting that one or more may apply to the EoS in order to see what happens so that the remaining north Tayside clubs will then know one way or the other if the EoS will accept them/any of them?  If the EoS doesn't accept them then it's decision time about what to do e.g. remain Junior, link up with the North Juniors, form a standalone Pyramid League to feed into the Highland Pyramid etc etc.

They need to use the space between their ears and find themselves a place in the pyramid as a league, as soon as possible.  If half of them end up in the EoS and half in the North Juniors, they are locking themselves into excess travel for the foreseeable future - this is already happening of course with old Tayside Region clubs in both leagues.

[Pyramidic]

19 minutes ago, Dev said:

Haven't there ben one or two posts from supporters of north Tayside clubs hinting that one or more may apply to the EoS in order to see what happens so that the remaining north Tayside clubs will then know one way or the other if the EoS will accept them/any of them?  If the EoS doesn't accept them then it's decision time about what to do e.g. remain Junior, link up with the North Juniors, form a standalone Pyramid League to feed into the Highland Pyramid etc etc.

There are different ways and permutations that could be followed to address the Tayside issue. The easiest and most obvious would appear to be a stand-alone Pyramid league feeding into the HL as a third strand. But would it be supported by the HL and the Dundee clubs? To date there have been no takers.

Another option might be the Tayside clubs forming a Tier 8 regional division feeding into the EOSFL. With (say) just one promotion place a year available from the division to EOSFL Tier 7, the impact on the EOSFL as a whole would be minimal. However, it would enhance the status of the EOSFL given the arrival of 17 new clubs. It would also ensure that clubs like Eyemouth and Tweedmouth and other lower tier clubs would not have to play Tayside clubs in league encounters.

A workable solution is possible. Tayside would be in the Pyramid but the impact on the EOSFL would be kept to a minimum.

[Burnieman]

There are different ways and permutations that could be followed to address the Tayside issue. The easiest and most obvious would appear to be a stand-alone Pyramid league feeding into the HL as a third strand. But would it be supported by the HL and the Dundee clubs? To date there have been no takers.
Another option might be the Tayside clubs forming a Tier 8 regional division feeding into the EOSFL. With (say) just one promotion place a year available from the division to EOSFL Tier 7, the impact on the EOSFL as a whole would be minimal. However, it would enhance the status of the EOSFL given the arrival of 17 new clubs. It would also ensure that clubs like Eyemouth and Tweedmouth and other lower tier clubs would not have to play Tayside clubs in league encounters.
A workable solution is possible. Tayside would be in the Pyramid but the impact on the EOSFL would be kept to a minimum.

They can hook up with the NRJFA, they already have a good relationship with them via their Regional Cup.

[LongTimeLurker]

14 minutes ago, Burnieman said:

They can hook up with the NRJFA, they already have a good relationship with them via their Regional Cup.

Reasonable to state this is what should happen. There is no evidence available at this point to support the assertion that it can happen and that they have any prospect of entry into the north pyramid.

Edited February 20, 2021 by LongTimeLurker

[Cyclizine]

29 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Reasonable to state this is what should happen. There is no evidence available at this point to support the assertion that it can happen and that they have any prospect of entry into the north pyramid.

But only because, as we've seen from the Blairgowrie statement, no-one representing the Tayside clubs has initiated any discussions about potential options. The Tayside clubs need to take the lead on this and decide where their future lies.

[Burnieman]

Not a lot changes for Tayside next season, they'll probably be the only clubs in the ERJFA but that doesn't change their league fixtures, they can still play NRJFA in their cup, and I guess the Junior Cup will exist in some form. They don't need to push to make something happen in time for next season.

I did hear on the grapevine that they weren't happy that someone from Glasgow assumed control of the SJFA when TJ retired. There's also a suggestion that at least some clubs may look north, but that's all third hand info so who knows how accurate.

[FairWeatherFan]

11 minutes ago, Cyclizine said:

But only because, as we've seen from the Blairgowrie statement, no-one representing the Tayside clubs has initiated any discussions about potential options. The Tayside clubs need to take the lead on this and decide where their future lies.

Nobody thought the likes of Colt teams were possible at Tier 5. Yet the Highland League seriously listened to ICT's attempt. Fortunately coming to the conclusion to dismiss it.

As for the lack of evidence there's the Tay used as the HL/LL boundary from around 2012 before the  SPFL Playoff sets it officially, Montrose and Brechin both attempting to change the SPFL Playoff boundary, and the quotes from HL officials around the time the pyramid became official.

None of these have been walked back, certainly not publicly. If the remaining East Region actually approached the HL about becoming a feeder it's not like they can be dismissed without consideration.

 

[invergowrie arab]

56 minutes ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Reasonable to state this is what should happen. There is no evidence available at this point to support the assertion that it can happen and that they have any prospect of entry into the north pyramid.

I don't see how the HFL could stop them without risking their own status as a league as a feeder league. 

Of course it's up to the Tayside clubs and not the HFL to come up with the proposal 

[Ginaro]

8 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:

I find it a bit farcical that some of those remaining East Juniors on the South side are considered big teams, only for them to complain about travel. The vast majority of the Borders teams will be rooted to the bottom tier of the EoSFL. At which point it's mainly South Fife to the just East of Edinburgh you have to worry about in the upper tiers with a few exceptions. If they played to their reputation they'd only have to deal with a nice away day in a cup to the Borders every once in a while.

I can only imagine they're panicking about Tayside getting in.

I honestly couldn't believe my ears when the Whitburn manager brought out the "Gala Fairydean on a Tuesday night" line.

Though by now I really shouldn't be surprised with some of the stuff I heard on the Down the Divisions podcast episode, about how great the West Lothian league is and how there "may be teams ready to step out of the EOS or WOS". 

Maybe the people at these clubs just can't bring themselves to even consider that the game may be up for the Juniors? The current state of affairs is just prolonging the agony for them.

1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Reasonable to state this is what should happen. There is no evidence available at this point to support the assertion that it can happen and that they have any prospect of entry into the north pyramid.

The future north pyramid is the HL with the NCL and NRJFA below it, three of them are in discussions to create a promotion play-off. If the Tayside teams join the North Juniors then how can entry into the north pyramid not happen?

Edited February 20, 2021 by Ginaro

[Burnieman]

I don't see how the HFL could stop them without risking their own status as a league as a feeder league. 
Of course it's up to the Tayside clubs and not the HFL to come up with the proposal 

Let's call them the ERJFA as that is what the Tayside clubs will be. The ERJFA can indicate their desire to enter the northern Pyramid to the SFA/HL/NRJFA/NL and see what happens. I can't see much of an issue being accepted at tier 6.

The other option is a tie-up with the NRJFA with a combined top division or some other arrangement.

[FairWeatherFan]

2 minutes ago, Ginaro said:

I honestly couldn't believe my ears when the Whitburn manager brought out the "Gala Fairydean on a Tuesday night" line.

That one really did make me cringe. What with Gala in the LL and a couple years removed at the very least. It would also only be 1 game a year at the absolute most unlike Elgin where I guess it's possible twice a year

The manager seemed to have a mainly Western background, so maybe he doesn't have the knowledge to pick out a Tweedmouth, Eyemouth, or Hawick.

[invergowrie arab]

If I was designing it we would go 3 feeders to HL (Renamed the Northern League) 

Feeder A - Perthshire, Dundee, Angus

B - Aberdeen/shire and Moray

C - Highland and Islands 

If any Tayside juniors get accepted to EOSL they all need to go and integrate into existing structure or go ammy.

There won't be a Tayside League in the LL structure 

 

[Bestsinceslicebread]

17 minutes ago, invergowrie arab said:

If I was designing it we would go 3 feeders to HL (Renamed the Northern League) 

Feeder A - Perthshire, Dundee, Angus

B - Aberdeen/shire and Moray

C - Highland and Islands 

If any Tayside juniors get accepted to EOSL they all need to go and integrate into existing structure or go ammy.

There won't be a Tayside League in the LL structure 

 

|this is another feasible option, sure there's some positives and negatives but in general it looks sound for most teams, all play local and try and try and reach the HL.
Any highland league team who are relegated form the current group for example would probably move into the HL district, (but the Highlands and islands is the only problem I can see), is there enough teams and how far flung would they all be

[Cyclizine]

16 minutes ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:

|this is another feasible option, sure there's some positives and negatives but in general it looks sound for most teams, all play local and try and try and reach the HL.
Any highland league team who are relegated form the current group for example would probably move into the HL district, (but the Highlands and islands is the only problem I can see), is there enough teams and how far flung would they all be

Feeder B is essentially the North Region Juniors and Feeder C is the North Caledonian League. There are just over 30 teams in the North Juniors and currently 13 in the North Caley, although one of them is Nairn County's reserve team. I wouldn't worry about teams being far flung, that's par for the course up here!

[invergowrie arab]

The current NCL are all in the proposed H&I feeder. Fort William would probably end up there in short order 

In the current HFL 6 clubs would be in the H&I feeder area.

Also, there could be two tiers at a whole north level if that's what clubs want