How different are Boris and Trump, not disciplining their own, Brexit/America first, flip flopping everywhere?

[Chazy G]

Are Boris and Trump so different now. Trump's pardons, Boris's protection of his cabinet and advisors. America First and Brexit, both very much tag-lines with very little definition. Trump anti China to try and sway global economic balance, Boris Brexit it appears largely to get top job. Both should be focusing on potential internal benefits but largely trying to exclude the rest of the world. Then one acts the comedy clown to cover his own policy errors/issues, the other just seems to ignore the true situation and set his own self promoting narrative. Why did big nations pick this type of character, when the majority of the world has stayed true to selecting leaders on character and political ability?

[Fullerene]

1 hour ago, Chazy G said:

Are Boris and Trump so different now. Trump's pardons, Boris's protection of his cabinet and advisors. America First and Brexit, both very much tag-lines with very little definition. Trump anti China to try and sway global economic balance, Boris Brexit it appears largely to get top job. Both should be focusing on potential internal benefits but largely trying to exclude the rest of the world. Then one acts the comedy clown to cover his own policy errors/issues, the other just seems to ignore the true situation and set his own self promoting narrative. Why did big nations pick this type of character, when the majority of the world has stayed true to selecting leaders on character and political ability?

Both are populist leaders who identify some "other" as responsible for everything that is going wrong.  For Boris it is the EU, for Trump it is the Washington swamp.  For both it is the liberal elite (as opposed to the more powerful conservative  elite) and of course immigrants.

Both are privileged white males who think poverty if when you are not a Millionaire.  In no way do they have similar lives to the people who vote for them but as long as they stay vague and talk mainly of grievances then there are people who think they are on the same page.

There are other populist leaders in Brazil, Hungary and Poland.

[SANTAN]

1 hour ago, Fullerene said:

Both are populist leaders who identify some "other" as responsible for everything that is going wrong.  For Boris it is the EU, for Trump it is the Washington swamp.  For both it is the liberal elite (as opposed to the more powerful conservative  elite) and of course immigrants.

Both are privileged white males who think poverty if when you are not a Millionaire.  In no way do they have similar lives to the people who vote for them but as long as they stay vague and talk mainly of grievances then there are people who think they are on the same page.

There are other populist leaders in Brazil, Hungary and Poland.

And Scotland. 

[Cheese]

The thread title is too long.

[SANTAN]

Add Corbyn to the list too. 

[Guest Bob Mahelp]

Firstly, stop calling the khunt 'Boris'. 

 

[Jacksgranda]

Aye, his name's Donald...

[Gus Setsniffer]

Hasn't the Murica 1st policy been in some ways beneficial to the US? While Brexit is just like waking up to discover you and the wife have both shat the bed after that Chicken Korma.

[coprolite]

5 hours ago, Chazy G said:

Are Boris and Trump so different now. Trump's pardons, Boris's protection of his cabinet and advisors. America First and Brexit, both very much tag-lines with very little definition. Trump anti China to try and sway global economic balance, Boris Brexit it appears largely to get top job. Both should be focusing on potential internal benefits but largely trying to exclude the rest of the world. Then one acts the comedy clown to cover his own policy errors/issues, the other just seems to ignore the true situation and set his own self promoting narrative. Why did big nations pick this type of character, when the majority of the world has stayed true to selecting leaders on character and political ability?

Genuinely not sure which one is which here. 2 peas from a privileged pod. 

Plenty other right wing populists about. Some (Bolsonaro, Duterte) are even worse than those two. 

I think there's a positive feedback loop between political culture and the media. Countries tend to have both institutions being grown up or a sensationalist media and infantile politics. I don't think you can disentangle cause and effect. 

[GordonD]

However much you hate Boris (and I do) I can't see him whining like a little girl when the time comes that he's voted out.

[NotThePars]

I can't remember who wrote about it and from what angle but there was a piece on how American and Britain, the apparent model democracies, have been shown up to be a load of old shit every day since 2016 and that a charlatan can easily run rings around them. Covid's just highlighted even further that us and the Americans don't have the institutional capacity or will to cope with a domestic crisis anymore.

ETA: I'm sure it must've been someone from the right because it wasn't just that the Americans and British made their claims on being the oldest democracies it was someone who had drank the Kool-Aid and believed the myth-making of Washington and Westminster.

Edited November 29, 2020 by NotThePars

[SANTAN]

So you're all just going to ignore the populism displayed by the leader of Scotland? 

Typically close minded of this place.

[Cheese]

They're both definitely symptoms of decrepit institutions and failing systems.

It's just a bit more open and obvious now than it was before. Johnson and Trump aren't the worst ever President/PM, they're just a natural progression.

[Steve_Wilkos]

I don't understand the thread title, is it supposed to be a question?

Something about Are Boris and Trump?

[Gordon EF]

Populism is the new neoliberalism baby!

Edited November 29, 2020 by Gordon EF

[DeeTillEhDeh]

And Scotland. 

DRoss isn't popular though.

[coprolite]

4 hours ago, Gus Setsniffer said:

Hasn't the Murica 1st policy been in some ways beneficial to the US? While Brexit is just like waking up to discover you and the wife have both shat the bed after that Chicken Korma.

To the extent that America first is a coherent policy rather than a dog whistle slogan, it is about creating barriers to international trade. 

Tarrifs create winners and losers but have a net overall cost to the economy. US Tarrifs on Chinese steel are great for Us steelmakers but shit for US construction, carmakers etc. 

Similarly it looks as if Brexit will be good for Stilton makers who export to Japan and terrible for the rest of the economy. 

Which is quite like waking up in your wifes curry skitters. 

Edited November 29, 2020 by coprolite

[NotThePars]

So you're all just going to ignore the populism displayed by the leader of Scotland? 

Typically close minded of this place.

 

Populism isn’t necessarily a bad thing and the blanket dismissal is partially why the centre is so widely loathed but it matters what popular impulses you’re appealing to. And if it’s nativism as a smokescreen so your pals can asset strip public services then that’s a bad populism IMO.

 

Anyway, Salmond was a more natural populist than Sturgeon.

[Miguel Sanchez]

Both have shite hair too.

[coprolite]

7 minutes ago, Miguel Sanchez said:

Both have shite hair too.

You'd never catch the left with that on their heads