Omicron impact

[Dawson Park Boy]

40 minutes ago, roman_bairn said:

I see the antvaxxer brigade are out in force red dotting everything in site rather than debate as ever....

...

Can’t say I’ve come across any antivaxxers on here?

 

[Pride Of The Clyde]

2 hours ago, bairn88 said:

“Acceptable territory” Roman? The number of people in Scottish hospitals with Covid is half of what it was in September, and the number in ICU is just over a third of what it was in September. There is no data that make today’s announcement anything other than utterly unacceptable.  

I’m not sure what was happening in Sept with the numbers  but I would imagine cases and deaths were decreasing at that time unlike just now when infections are rising rapidly that would be the difference in approach. I wish people would remember all the dithering and lack of action at the start of all this was responsible for many avoidable deaths, hopefully we have learned from our previous mistakes.

[roman_bairn]

2 hours ago, AlanCamelonfan said:

They all also have lower vaccination rate than here. Have to point out working in a shop that a big number of Eastern Europeans don't wear a mask.

 

At least 500 people will get into the games. Better than nothing

Not sure it’s fair to pick on Eastern Europe. However, speaking from a bit of experience, in Romania, and many Eastern European countries, a succession of corrupt governments has bred mistrust in the public alongside a media long obsessed with conspiracy theories. Hence lower numbers vaccinated  than we’d all prefer to see….

[AlanCamelonfan]

8 minutes ago, roman_bairn said:

Not sure it’s fair to pick on Eastern Europe. However, speaking from a bit of experience, in Romania, and many Eastern European countries, a succession of corrupt governments has bred mistrust in the public alongside a media long obsessed with conspiracy theories. Hence lower numbers vaccinated  than we’d all prefer to see….

Not saying all but a fair chunk of them don't wear the mask. I have no problem with foreigners my ex was German but that is the reality

[Brummo]

3 hours ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

There won't be many in the top 4 divisions that can make economic sense of allowing a game to go ahead with a 500 limit.

We had a whopping great 193 for our recent midweek game against Airdrie played during Storm Barra.

We had more for the game against QP on Saturday which could have been abandoned because of fog.

To be honest a five hundred limit wouldn't be a disaster for quite a number of clubs in Leagues 1 and 2.

Edited December 21, 2021 by Brummo
Correction

[Passionate]

11 minutes ago, Brummo said:

We had a whopping great 193 for our recent midweek game against Airdrie played during Storm Barra.

We had more for the game against QP on Saturday which could have been abandoned because of fog.

To be honest a five hundred limit wouldn't be a disaster for quite a number of clubs in Leagues 1 and 2.

Don't think there are any rules on hospitality, apart from social distancing, so still ways of making revenue, clubs will have to limited comp tickets and make sure real paying fans get priority after season ticket holders...

 

Apart from Falkirk most other clubs could adjust semi comfortably for a few ga m d's anyway,    

[WBR]

12 hours ago, Pride Of The Clyde said:

I wish people would remember the government had a pandemic preparedness plan document but chose instead to follow advisers in thrall to China.  Their interventions, particularly “lockdown” (never part of our plan and advised against by WHO), have been estimated to cost many more lives than have been lost to Covid.  Our plan was also based on a more deadly virus than Covid, yet the response has been more severe.

Edited December 22, 2021 by WBR
Pride of the Clyde’s quote didn’t pull through - should read “I wish people would remember all the dithering and lack of action at the start of all this was responsible for many avoidable deaths, hopefully we have learned from our previous mistakes.”

[Skeletar Spider]

43 minutes ago, WBR said:

(never part of our plan and advised against by WHO), have been estimated to cost many more lives than have been lost to Covid. 

Do you have a source for this? 

[Life on Marrs?]

12 hours ago, Passionate said:

Don't think there are any rules on hospitality, apart from social distancing, so still ways of making revenue, clubs will have to limited comp tickets and make sure real paying fans get priority after season ticket holders...

 

Apart from Falkirk most other clubs could adjust semi comfortably for a few ga m d's anyway,    

If it is only for the weeks (max 2 games) then clubs are likely to just close doors. Costs incurred to let in largely season ticket holders will lose clubs money. Let's hope it is just the 3 weeks. 

[Sergeant Wilson]

4 minutes ago, Life on Marrs? said:

If it is only for the weeks (max 2 games) then clubs are likely to just close doors. Costs incurred to let in largely season ticket holders will lose clubs money. Let's hope it is just the 3 weeks. 

That was my point exactly. All the costs and none of the income. Clubs already probably lose money week on week. Unless streaming makes up the losses or the previous grants has them rolling in money, both of which I doubt.

[WBR]

3 hours ago, Skeletar Spider said:

Do you have a source for this? 

 

the plan

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/213696/dh_133656.pdf

Interestingly, this includes-

“put plans in place to ensure a response that is proportionate to a range of scenarios reflecting pandemic viruses of low, moderate and high impact, rather than focusing on the “worst case” planning assumptions;”  

WHO seems to have closed some links so I can’t get to what they previously stated.  WHO members have publicly reiterated the warnings of mass poverty and death resulting from the state-enforced closure of industries/economies, particularly the trickle down effect on poorer countries.  

The WHO also amended their definition of herd immunity from natural immunity from infections and vaccination to now just from vaccination.  They seem to ignore thousands of years of evolution.  I wonder why.

 

As to the study of collateral damage from lockdowns etc, I think this was a Bristol University paper but I could be wrong.  The long term death toll was estimated at over 500,000.  Not sure if Neil Ferguson was involved in that, though.

[David W]

2 hours ago, Life on Marrs? said:

If it is only for the weeks (max 2 games) then clubs are likely to just close doors. Costs incurred to let in largely season ticket holders will lose clubs money. Let's hope it is just the 3 weeks. 

Clyde certainly seem to be planning on allowing season ticket holders to attend the two matches we have which fall in that period.

[roman_bairn]

Looks like confirmation of what most of us expected Detailed report tomorrow. From Sky News but it’s the numbers we really need to see:
“Omicron is milder for most people - but UK will likely still see surge in hospital admissions - report
Government scientists are set to conclude the Omicron variant causes milder disease than Delta for most Britons, according to POLITICO's London Playbook.
Those who fall sick with Omicron are less likely to become severely ill than those who caught Delta, early data analysed by the UK Health Security Agency (UKHSA) will reportedly suggest.
This is likely due to the large number of people vaccinated or previously infected, and possibly partly due to Omicron being intrinsically milder.
However, the UKHSA found this will still not be enough to avoid large numbers of hospital admissions because the variant is so transmissible.
The experts found evidence that for those who become severely ill, there is still a high chance of hospital admission and death.
Still, there is some more positive news. The UKHSA is also expected to say that while two doses of a vaccine are not enough, a booster dose significantly reduces the chance of both symptomatic infection and ending up in hospital.”

[Life on Marrs?]

On 22/12/2021 at 13:30, David W said:

Clyde certainly seem to be planning on allowing season ticket holders to attend the two matches we have which fall in that period.

No announcement on East Fife's website yet, but as we aren't due to play at home until 2nd of January it's possible we are taking the lead from those at home this weekend. 

[Nowhereman]

On 22/12/2021 at 15:25, roman_bairn said:

Looks like confirmation of what most of us expected Detailed report tomorrow. From Sky News but it’s the numbers we really need to see:
“Omicron is milder for most people - but UK will likely still see surge in hospital admissions - report
Government scientists are set to conclude the Omicron variant causes milder disease than Delta for most Britons, according to POLITICO's London Playbook.
Those who fall sick with Omicron are less likely to become severely ill than those who caught Delta, early data analysed by the UK Health Security Agency (UKHSA) will reportedly suggest.
This is likely due to the large number of people vaccinated or previously infected, and possibly partly due to Omicron being intrinsically milder.
However, the UKHSA found this will still not be enough to avoid large numbers of hospital admissions because the variant is so transmissible.
The experts found evidence that for those who become severely ill, there is still a high chance of hospital admission and death.
Still, there is some more positive news. The UKHSA is also expected to say that while two doses of a vaccine are not enough, a booster dose significantly reduces the chance of both symptomatic infection and ending up in hospital.”

Don't think you need to be any sort of expert to come to that conclusion

[roman_bairn]

Don't think you need to be any sort of expert to come to that conclusion

Which is why I said I think we need to see numbers. Even the numbers we have seen in recent days are inconclusive as they are based predominantly on people under 40.
I’m hopeful, but not convinced.
Still, we could always take the Blundering Boris line and wait until the “case has been made”…..just like he did at the start of this and we now have 150K deaths.

[badgerthewitness]

HWFG!

Quote

Mark Woolhouse, professor of infectious disease epidemiology at Edinburgh University, told BBC Scotland on Monday that there was a "complete lack of necessity to keep us indoors" because "the virus does not transmit outdoors".

He added: "Somehow, through the scientific advisory systems and the politicians, this didn't get translated into public health action.

"As a result we all spent a lot of time having our activities curtailed for very little effect and far too long in my view."

Gutted for the knickerwetters & cowboy virologists on this thread.