The Queen of the South thread

[bod]

Are Wimbledon playing Queens tonight?

[Slipmat]

Just now, bod said:

Are Wimbledon playing Queens tonight?

Seems like it!  5-0 after 50 mins!  Just noticed this quote from the BBC live updates about Ramsgate:

I don't understand why they are playing that way.

Trying to play triangles in their own penalty area.

They're just giving them easy chances.

[Terry_Tibbs]

2 hours ago, Scorge said:

Bartley must stay until Saturday 5pm at least.  Genuinely puzzled how someone who seemed so articulate and knowledgeable as a pundit/coach etc has made such a gibbering wreck of it, by and large.

Arrogance, naivety and stubbornness.

He's always struck me as David Brent on stilts.

[Monkey Tennis]

9 hours ago, Greenacres said:

Marvin video has sadly appeared .

He really talks a good game players being shown what to do told what to do but are not doing it .

To me that is poor management take as a example Duncan Ferguson at Inverness he tells you something it gets done.

Had to laugh Hamilton  turned the lights off half way through even the camera man gave up everyone it seems except our board who somehow think he is going to turn this around 

It's pretty much interchangeable with several others.

 "I told them exactly what to do in minute detail.  Inexplicably, they immediately did precisely the opposite".   It's wearing thin Marv. 

The lights are indeed surely going out for him now.

[Biblemaster]

11 hours ago, Monkey Tennis said:

It's pretty much interchangeable with several others.

 "I told them exactly what to do in minute detail.  Inexplicably, they immediately did precisely the opposite".   It's wearing thin Marv. 

The lights are indeed surely going out for him now.

It seems every time we make a mistake, the opposition scores! Surely Marvin's not suggesting nobody else in league 1 is making mistakes. The difference is that their manager's are setting up their "game plans" to allow for mistakes and have a plan b to cover for them. It seems to me Marvin wants to stick to the game plan so much, no one knows what to do when one of their teammates makes a mistake.

[Rjc-1988]

12 hours ago, Monkey Tennis said:

It's pretty much interchangeable with several others.

 "I told them exactly what to do in minute detail.  Inexplicably, they immediately did precisely the opposite".   It's wearing thin Marv. 

The lights are indeed surely going out for him now.

The lights are seemingly not going out - for some inexplicable reason someone somewhere within the club must be buying into this nonsense.

Every day that passes our situation becomes more precarious. 

[Nithsdale Wanderer]

A tale of two interviews.

As referenced above, Bartley is frustrated at the mistakes being made time after time especially after he has been so thorough in his preparation. If only Football Management was so simple as telling players what to do and they do it every time !

The penny doesn't seem to drop with him that if he keeps doing the same and the players keep doing the same and it isn't working then he is making mistakes as well - not just them.  As a Manager, in any field, you have to get to know your team members and how to motivate each one. Every individual is different and will learn in their own way. It is his job to find that out for each one and deliver accordingly.  

It sounds like he is taking a ' one size fits all ' approach ' which is easy and frankly, lazy.  I could well be wrong as I don't know what is happening on the inside as I am not there.  I mention that as Bartley seems to me had a bit of a go in a  very sneering, arrogant way during the Dundee Utd interview when Sandra mentioned some fans thought he had lost the  dressing room. He responded along the lines of they don't see what happens on the inside , I do,  inferring that they should all shut up as they don't know what they are talking about.

To the second interview from Jim McIntyre at Arbroath.

Arbroath are struggling too and he talked about a lot of similar things - preparation, game plans, instructions.

He recognises players will make mistakes - Bartley can't seem to grasp that -  " players are not robots ...  but when they do make mistakes it is the   Managers job to HELP them".  He also said " things happen during games and players need to think for themselves sometimes ". Heaven help any of our players that might do that !

Going back to understanding instructions McIntyre also said that a player might not play well but he shouldn't come off the pitch saying he didn't understand what he was being asked to do.

From these two interviews it is clear what the overall framework is for preparing and coaching a team to perform, but the key thing is the Managers approach to that and how best to deliver their message to each player in order to achieve maximum performance.

Bartley and McIntyre want to achieve the same things but they are very different characters. I have always enjoyed listening to McIntyre , comes across as a very positive guy though I am sure he can ' give it out ' when required.  Even when winning - rare I know - Bartley rarely cracks a smile and it is business as usual. You need that positivity around the training ground to carry into games not a culture of fear of making a mistake.

Listening to McIntyres interview just reinforced to me that he would have been able to lift the whole place. 

He spoke very fondly of his time at Palmerston too.

To sum up, Bartley seems incapable of changing therefore we need to make the change asap.

 

 

[Kelheart]

Stop playing Ambrose should instantly make you a better team , no previous managerial experience needed to tell you that

[19QOS19]

4 minutes ago, Kelheart said:

Stop playing Ambrose should instantly make you a better team , no previous managerial experience needed to tell you that

No no, apparently our biggest problem (apart from Bartley) is our lack of experience in the side. The fact our most experienced player causes the most problems for us shouldn't come into the argument.

[Rjc-1988]

I haven’t been to any games recently but when I was going every week Ambrose was our best defender by far. He must have deteriorated out of all recognition if he is now the prize “fall guy”. He admittedly gave the ball away at Alloa (when I was last there) but apart from that he was our MOM by a country mile.

[19QOS19]

9 minutes ago, Rjc-1988 said:

I haven’t been to any games recently but when I was going every week Ambrose was our best defender by far. He must have deteriorated out of all recognition if he is now the prize “fall guy”. He admittedly gave the ball away at Alloa (when I was last there) but apart from that he was our MOM by a country mile.

He's rank. As I said before, I'm hoping he follows Bartley out the door in January. 

Sadly any time he makes a mistake it seems to result in a goal. 

[bod]

23 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

He's rank. As I said before, I'm hoping he follows Bartley out the door in January. 

Sadly any time he makes a mistake it seems to result in a goal. 

As with any of our back line as it's generally within our penalty box as they try to play out.

[Rjc-1988]

29 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

He's rank. As I said before, I'm hoping he follows Bartley out the door in January. 

Sadly any time he makes a mistake it seems to result in a goal. 

He’s rank because you say so apparently.

You also kept telling me what a great capture Bartley was as well. Nobody gets them all right.

[19QOS19]

57 minutes ago, bod said:

As with any of our back line as it's generally within our penalty box as they try to play out.

The last two he was comfortably outside the box and nearer the corner flag. He did lose his man in the box for the goal mind you. 

50 minutes ago, Rjc-1988 said:

He’s rank because you say so apparently.

You also kept telling me what a great capture Bartley was as well. Nobody gets them all right.

He's rank based on what I've seen of him. That's usually how I judge players. You said he was MoM in the match where he literally cost us the game with his stupidity, it's no good being brilliant then gifting the opposition a goal. Show me the posts where I've continued to tell you Bartley was a great capture please. 

[Parttimesupporter]

On 04/12/2023 at 08:29, Otis Blue said:

Like him or not, I'd be very surprised - he's north of 70 now, has operated mostly in Fife or Angus and I think he also runs (with his brother) his own staff agency business or something like that.

They run an agency which provides in home care.  I agree that he is extremely unlikely to be interested for the reasons you have given, quite apart from the mess he would inherit.

[Fae_the_'briggs]

Efe Ambrose IS our best available central defender at the moment, which sadly doesn't say much for the rest. Admittedly his laid back style of play can, and has, proved costly at times but he's also turned in a few (almost) flawless performances as well. 

[Otis Blue]

To be fair to Efe, after scoring at Firhill in the cup of diddyness he did a triple back-flip somersault ... I mean, that's serious class - I've never seen a QOS player do that before ... well, at least not intentionally!!!  On that basis alone I'd be almost OK with him in the team provided that the rest of the back line were solid - alas, that ain't the case as we know only too well.  We're just dross. 

[Rjc-1988]

36 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

The last two he was comfortably outside the box and nearer the corner flag. He did lose his man in the box for the goal mind you. 

He's rank based on what I've seen of him. That's usually how I judge players. You said he was MoM in the match where he literally cost us the game with his stupidity, it's no good being brilliant then gifting the opposition a goal. Show me the posts where I've continued to tell you Bartley was a great capture please. 

 I think you must have selective memory in relation to MB - I continually questioned Bartley’s big empty talk and playing style but you repeatedly disagreed strongly (which is absolutely fine) but you can’t have it both ways. You were very confident in MB’s ability to be a success with us - I wasn’t for a number of reasons. Paton earned us second half respectability last season - as soon as he left Bartley has been shown up as a novice Manager who is completely out of his depth.

[19QOS19]

24 minutes ago, Rjc-1988 said:

 I think you must have selective memory in relation to MB - I continually questioned Bartley’s big empty talk and playing style but you repeatedly disagreed strongly (which is absolutely fine) but you can’t have it both ways. You were very confident in MB’s ability to be a success with us - I wasn’t for a number of reasons. Paton earned us second half respectability last season - as soon as he left Bartley has been shown up as a novice Manager who is completely out of his depth.

I still think "great capture" is a bit much. I was very happy with his appointment but I've never went as far as to say he was a great capture: that to me suggests we're very lucky to have got his services. 

It's taken me longer to give up on MB (probably been more patient with him purely because he's a rookie) than others but I'm certainly at that stage now. 

[Katboy]

2 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

I still think "great capture" is a bit much. I was very happy with his appointment but I've never went as far as to say he was a great capture: that to me suggests we're very lucky to have got his services. 

It's taken me longer to give up on MB (probably been more patient with him purely because he's a rookie) than others but I'm certainly at that stage now. 

Like you I was happy with his appointment.  I'd agree that it was stretching it a bit to say he was a great capture.  Like any rookie manager the appointment is not without its risks.  I had high hopes that he would recruit in a sensible and targeted manner, instead we got more of the scatter gun approach we had become used to.

Being a rookie manager he needs to find his feet and refine his approach.  For this reason I gave him plenty of leeway.  However, this ship has now sailed.  The constant blaming of others when it goes wrong (to me) shows a manager out of his depth.  

Next up is Montrose at Links Park, and I will make  the trip more in hope than expectation.