The Apprentice 2023

[19QOS19]

10 minutes ago, RH33 said:

Rachel's only 27. I thought she was about 40.

That's what Leeds will do to you. 

[coprolite]

Dentists making £400k profit is probably worth £2.5m, meaning Sugar lowballed him by ~£1m.  Gtf was the correct response. 
 

Half of £600k cash in the bank for £250k is a good deal for Sugar; covers his downside if the pies don’t make any money. 
 

I remember when people didn’t need to pay “Sir Alan” to win

[TheScarf]

The morphing into Dragon's Den took a big leap last night then Sugar started negotiating with Paul.  is there really any need for both shows now?

[The Minertaur]

Big fan of the fact that Phil is going to win despite Sugar clearly wanting Paul in the final instead of him  

[Albertlegend]

I’m fucking raging Phil is in the final! He’s been shite all the way through, ducked decisions at every point, wasn’t even that good on food tasks, his interviews were shite and didn’t include accounts in his business plan. What’s the point of all the task if this dick gets to the end! Tre was a far better candidate but didn’t have a family business he could put up and instead had a terrible business proposition.

 

have I missed something with Flo? Don’t get the hate for her.

[Skyline Drifter]

On 10/04/2024 at 10:31, Skyline Drifter said:

Just about the right final five I think with Phil the obvious outlier.

From VERY early in the process it's been obvious Tre and Flo were the standout candidates. Rachel looked a strong 3rd early on in the series but has stumbled towards the end, losing three of the last four tasks, two of them as PM, and she made a backside of it last week and absolutely hung Faluso out to dry. She deserves her place in the final five but is well behind the other two now.

Paul's been quietly effective throughout without ever standing out. He's never been in the Boardroom apart from the one he lost as PM and he's clearly getting along with the other candidates and making wise calls as he goes. He's a dark horse for this. Given he owns a dental business one would assume his business plan relates to expanding that. Would be a bit left field for Sugar but then he invested in the Beauty Clinic of Leah Totten a few years ago so he's not above going left field. I think he'll deal with interviews well. Wouldn't be a bit surprised if his plan stands up better than the others and he makes the final.

As for Phil, he's clearly been a bit useless throughout, though probably unlucky to have lost as often as he did. Given he's in the food business, leading the team last week should have been an open goal for him and he even made an arse of that, though was saved by Steve's bizarre decision to go for curried cheese. The unavoidable conclusion is that Sugar quite likes his business plan also which will inevitably be based on expanding his existing pie business. I suppose there's a chance therefore that having made the final five he then gets through.

I assume it's likely Flo has a business plan relating to her existing recruitment consultant job which is a bit old hat. It's been done several times before and he's invested in a couple (Ricky Martin, James White). Rachel's clearly looking to expand her fitness studio into something franchisable which isn't that different to last year's Boxing Gyms. Not absolutely clear what Tre's business will be but he's been very likeable throughout the process so he has a chance of selling it if whatever it is stands up to interrogation.

I've said before, I hate the "new" process (I say new but it has been in for 12 years out of the 18 now) of it being a pointless 10 week gameshow leading to a two week episode of 'Dragon's Den' (and to be honest, I'm fairly convinced he normally knows who is winning after the interviews, the final week is just a glorified reunion show. They may as well let Justin Lee Collins host it!). Preferred it when it was a job interview and there was more merit in the early tasks, as daft as they are. There's probably a fairly good chance that Phil and Paul end up the final two with established businesses that are probably scalable.

Absolutely called it! Other than not seeing Paul coming from left field with the whole Scrubs thing instead of offering his dental practice.

Knew Tre would have some left field bonkers plan. Never getting entertained. And as decent as Flo was, despite her daft numbers, he doesn't want a bloody 4th Recruitment Agency! Best two candidates in the process but out before the interviews started in effect.

19 hours ago, DrewDon said:

Mike buying up the domains is my favourite Apprentice bit. 

Well that and him making up a recipe drink. Have none of these clowns ever watched a previous series? He does it EVERY YEAR. It's not rocket science.

I did think however, he was out of line in the whole Established 1933 is a lie rant at Phil. Just because they didn't incorporate a company and open a shop until 2005 or whatever it was doesn't mean they haven't been trading in pies since 1933. It's a completely reasonable claim to make assuming they have. I've got two or three major clients who both claim to have over 100 years serving the public in their line of trade and they absolutely do but none of them were incorporated as as companies until the 1980's. It doesn't mean the claim's a lie. Phil however was too stupid / intimidated / rabbit frozen in headlights to actually argue back on it though.

19 hours ago, 19QOS19 said:

I mean, I think we all know the finalists are picked right off the bat but if ever you needed proof, it's Phil  I'm still pretty shocked he's been put through regardless of the money in the bank. I'm not sure the guy has any business sense. I bet his parents (or whoever was running it) have only recently left the company. 6 months without looking at the accounts? Opening a new shop on the back of a great year where things were very different to normal (Covid). Mental. 

Glad the dentist told Sugar to go f**k himself. Sneaky fucker wanting 50% of a successful business for 250K? Aye right, ya chancer. 

I really don't care who wins now. I don't particularly like the lassie and it'll be an hilarious farce if Phil wins but the fact it won't be the arsehole Tory with her Tory as f**k business plan means I really don't care

I thought it was chronically unfair that Paul was allowed to / encouraged to move his business plan in the Boardroom. It's a nonsense, that's not the point. I note Sugar said it's happened before. Has it? What's he referring to? Didn't think that was fair on the other candidates at all. Why not offer the eminently likeable Tre the chance to come up with a different plan on the spot?

And absolutely Sugar was at it. No chance Paul should be giving him a half share in a business making £400k per annum for £250k capital.

I think you'd be surprised at the number of businesses who fell into money during Covid and thought it was the perfect time to expand and later got a rude awakening. I've seen it a lot. Phil's no different to many and plenty of businesses are run by people with no direct handle on the accounts either, though he certainly should have some idea of numbers over a six month period.

Again though, do none of these clowns ever watch a past series when they are accepted for it? Every damned year, "not enough numbers, over ambitious plans, no samples, false claims in plans". Every. Damned. Year. FFS. Learn, you clowns!

The fact that Sugar routinely sacks any accountant to enter in the first three weeks because he doesn't like accountants gets him what he deserves mind you.

[coprolite]

33 minutes ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Absolutely called it! Other than not seeing Paul coming from left field with the whole Scrubs thing instead of offering his dental practice.

Knew Tre would have some left field bonkers plan. Never getting entertained. And as decent as Flo was, despite her daft numbers, he doesn't want a bloody 4th Recruitment Agency! Best two candidates in the process but out before the interviews started in effect.

Well that and him making up a recipe drink. Have none of these clowns ever watched a previous series? He does it EVERY YEAR. It's not rocket science.

I did think however, he was out of line in the whole Established 1933 is a lie rant at Phil. Just because they didn't incorporate a company and open a shop until 2005 or whatever it was doesn't mean they haven't been trading in pies since 1933. It's a completely reasonable claim to make assuming they have. I've got two or three major clients who both claim to have over 100 years serving the public in their line of trade and they absolutely do but none of them were incorporated as as companies until the 1980's. It doesn't mean the claim's a lie. Phil however was too stupid / intimidated / rabbit frozen in headlights to actually argue back on it though.

I thought it was chronically unfair that Paul was allowed to / encouraged to move his business plan in the Boardroom. It's a nonsense, that's not the point. I note Sugar said it's happened before. Has it? What's he referring to? Didn't think that was fair on the other candidates at all. Why not offer the eminently likeable Tre the chance to come up with a different plan on the spot?

And absolutely Sugar was at it. No chance Paul should be giving him a half share in a business making £400k per annum for £250k capital.

I think you'd be surprised at the number of businesses who fell into money during Covid and thought it was the perfect time to expand and later got a rude awakening. I've seen it a lot. Phil's no different to many and plenty of businesses are run by people with no direct handle on the accounts either, though he certainly should have some idea of numbers over a six month period.

Again though, do none of these clowns ever watch a past series when they are accepted for it? Every damned year, "not enough numbers, over ambitious plans, no samples, false claims in plans". Every. Damned. Year. FFS. Learn, you clowns!

The fact that Sugar routinely sacks any accountant to enter in the first three weeks because he doesn't like accountants gets him what he deserves mind you.

Rangers accountant?

[19QOS19]

3 hours ago, Skyline Drifter said:

I thought it was chronically unfair that Paul was allowed to / encouraged to move his business plan in the Boardroom. It's a nonsense, that's not the point. I note Sugar said it's happened before. Has it? What's he referring to? Didn't think that was fair on the other candidates at all. Why not offer the eminently likeable Tre the chance to come up with a different plan on the spot?

Aye something tells me it's happened before. If you can't remember who it was there's no chance I will! When they were hinting he changes his plan I said to my Mrs "That's happened before" so something is there that I can slightly recall. 

3 hours ago, Skyline Drifter said:

And absolutely Sugar was at it. No chance Paul should be giving him a half share in a business making £400k per annum for £250k capital.

I think this is probably the reason why Paul was encouraged and not Tre though. They've clearly seen he's making money and were trying to get Sugar a slice. I'm glad Paul had the sense not to be exploited. 

3 hours ago, Skyline Drifter said:

Again though, do none of these clowns ever watch a past series when they are accepted for it? Every damned year, "not enough numbers, over ambitious plans, no samples, false claims in plans". Every. Damned. Year. FFS. Learn, you clowns!

I can't recall if it was on this actual thread or an article I read where it said they are given next to no time to come up with a business plan. I can only assume this is legit and the producers are happy with it this way as it makes better television. 

[Skyline Drifter]

33 minutes ago, 19QOS19 said:

Aye something tells me it's happened before. If you can't remember who it was there's no chance I will! When they were hinting he changes his plan I said to my Mrs "That's happened before" so something is there that I can slightly recall. 

There have been one or two series I didnt watch. Probably circa 2019. 

[Silvio Tattiescone]

I read that since it changed from offring a job to offering an investment, the first 4 made Sugar money but the last 8 have all failed. Probably reflects on the type of candidates they bring in now. 

[TheScarf]

1 hour ago, Newbornbairn said:

I read that since it changed from offring a job to offering an investment, the first 4 made Sugar money but the last 8 have all failed. Probably reflects on the type of candidates they bring in now. 

No wonder. Even the winners are utter morons these days. 

[Bert Raccoon]

Did Tre work in the music business? You would think he'd mention something like that 

[Silvio Tattiescone]

Just shows how utterly, utterly pointless most of the show is. Tre went through 10 weeks of tasks only for it to turn out he had no business plan and his idea was wired to the moon. What was the fucking point of that? 

[Skyline Drifter]

On 13/04/2024 at 07:59, Newbornbairn said:

I read that since it changed from offring a job to offering an investment, the first 4 made Sugar money but the last 8 have all failed. Probably reflects on the type of candidates they bring in now. 

I suspect that will be partly because in the early days they got a flood of applications from people with genuine business ideas who needed help and it's now graduated into a game show with clueless twats whose first aim is to be accepted and then they worry about it. I have a friend who interviewed for the show and got accepted through to the 2nd round of interviews, though he never went. Decided he preferred his current job for now. He 100% had no business plan though and not one person at the production company gave a toss or asked him about it.

If you seek out candidates and then ask them to come up with a business you'll get what we have been getting. Candidates who genuinely have a business plan are far more likely to go on Dragon's Den. Less of a waste of their time and more of a genuine investment. The Apprentice is a game show for publicity seekers.

It was far better when it was a job interview but got binned after it became clear it didn't actually work in practice. I assume there was a lot of friction with people who had genuinely worked their way up in business seeing some gameshow winner parachute in at their level and being expected to work with them. Tim Campell who won the first series seemed to do well, probably at least partly due to the novelty. He's obviously still close to Sugar and is back on the show now but even he only worked directly for him for 2 years before leaving. I think all the others left within 2 years too and after the Stella English debacle in season 6 he said he wasn't employing anyone directly again.

Series 7 saw the new format start and was won by a genuine innovator in Tom Pellereau, albeit they very quickly binned his new idea and went back to his previously successful nail file product. Ricky Martin (Series 8 ) and Mark Wright (Series 10) were both very successful and have been held up by the show as a standard of what can be achieved. In between was Leah Totten and her Beauty Clinic which I believe did well also.

Since then it's all been a bit less memorable. I recall Joseph Valente (Series 11) with his gas business where SUgar left the business after 2 years and it subsequently went bust. Not clear whether Sugar got his money back on leaving or not. If I'm being honest I had to look up the other winners since then. Apparently they were:

Series 12 - Alana Spencer - Ridiculously Rich Bakery
Series 13 - Shared - James White - Right Time Recruitment and Sarah Lynn - Sweets in the City
Series 14 - Sian Gabbidon - Swimwear
Series 15 - Carina Lepore - Bakery
Series 16 - Harpreet Kaur - Oh So Yum Desserts
Series 17 - Marnie Swindells - Boxing Gyms

I recall Alana and Marnie from just last year. I'm not sure I even watched some of the ones in between.

Companies House suggests that By Alana Limited which appears to be what the company Spencer and Sugar started was actually called is doing well and making decent money. Albeit Sugar resigned in 2019 and the company bought back his shares. Certainly doesn't appear to have failed.

Right Time Recruitment is still trading too albeit it's not exactly flush with cash and its current accounts are somewhat overdue. Sugar exited in 2020 when the company bought back his shares again.

Sweets in the City appears to still be trading relatively successfully with Sugar having made his exit in 2022 with his shares repurchased. Not sure it's making much actual profit but there's over £100k of capital still in it.

Sian Marie Fashion Limited certainly didn't work. Sugar exited in 2022 and it was in liquidation and insolvent by early 2023.

Dough Artison Bakehouse Limited (Carina Lepore) is still trading, with a remarkably similar website to Ridiculously Rich Bakery incidentally! Sugar departed last year and appears to have gotten his money back looking at the way the asset base collapsed in the year after. Company looks fairly worthless based on its 2023 accounts but that might just be that it cleaned itself out buying him out and it will recover. Hard to say at this point.

Oh So Yum Limited appears to be trading successfully. Sugar exited in 2023, after the last set of accounts was filed. Looks like he probably got his money back and left it solvent and trading but with little capital at that point.

Bronx Boxing Limited (Marnie) is still trading and he's still a 50% owner it would appear. Very early though. Company only started trading in June 2023. Accounts were published for the period to end of June 2023 showing his investment coming in but nothing since obviously so no clarity on how it's doing

So basically, I'm not sure it's fair to say the last 8 have failed. Impra Gas (Joseph Valente) and Sian Marie (Sian Gabbidon) definitely failed. Far too early to debate Bronx Boxing. The other five are still trading albeit Sugar's exited from all of them. Alana Spencer's Ridiculously Rich Bakery seems to be doing fine. The others are all still validly in operation but nobody's got rich from them.

 

Edited April 18 by Skyline Drifter

[nelsjfc]

"Phil my pie"

Edited April 18 by nelsjfc

[bs1903]

I can’t be alone in thinking English pies look absolutly shite? Use shortcrust pastry instead of puff and in general look dry as f**k.

I remember getting a pie at a Man City game(pre Arab money) and when it was presented asking the server wtf is that? Same as that shite on offer tonight. The server with a look of pure bamboozlment, blissfully unaware of the beauty of a proper Scottish pie.

[Steve_Wilkos]

Poor final for an otherwise good series. 

[Skyline Drifter]

Have to hold my hands up to getting that entirely wrong tonight. The entire episode I was sure he was picking Phil. He made it clear he didnt particularly like or want another gym. He (rightly) doubted that, as good as Rachel may be, its not really scalable if she's not hands on. When Phil confirmed he's already turning over £2.7m for me it was as easy a decision as there's ever been.

But there was a 'volte face' in the closing moments. For all Phil clearly, by an absolute mile, had the better business with more potential, Sugar just didnt believe in him personally. He hung himself with the 'business isnt necessarily about profit' line. Sugar was clearly horrified at that. That and nailing his colours to the 'Pies by Post' concept that is clearly limited. It was obvious when he called them back in Phil had realised his own stupidity and tried to row back from it, talking about opening more shops. But he was too late.

Fundamentally Sugar clearly looked at Rachel and saw a determined business partner with a focus and clearly given her lack of staff turnover capable of inspiring loyalty. And he went with his gut on the person rather than the much better business.

Ultimately he's probably got that right. Nine lives Phil finally shot himself in the foot once too often.

 

Edited April 19 by Skyline Drifter

[TheScarf]

Phil was the classic 'good business, shite businessman' candidate.

Overall I think Rachel deserved it, she was a solid candidate throughout, gyms are the rage these days so her and Sugar are bound to make money. Especially from folk who want to join a gym that is owned by an Apprentice winner.

Agreed about the pies, they looked shite and like they would crumble just by breathing on them.  

When the candidates came back to help out, I was like 'who the fuck is this ginger cunt at the back?' Totally forgot about the other Paul in the process.

[JS_FFC]

On 12/04/2024 at 21:56, 19QOS19 said:

Aye something tells me it's happened before. If you can't remember who it was there's no chance I will! When they were hinting he changes his plan I said to my Mrs "That's happened before" so something is there that I can slightly recall. 

I think this is probably the reason why Paul was encouraged and not Tre though. They've clearly seen he's making money and were trying to get Sugar a slice. I'm glad Paul had the sense not to be exploited. 

I can't recall if it was on this actual thread or an article I read where it said they are given next to no time to come up with a business plan. I can only assume this is legit and the producers are happy with it this way as it makes better television. 

You’d think anyone remotely serious would have their business plan created before even going on the show.

 

Its no coincidence IMO that 6 of the last 8 winners either went for a gym or some kind of dessert parlour type business.

These are the kind of businesses that tend to do well for the first year or two out of novelty. The perfect amount of time for Sugar to make a quick buck and get out before it goes tits up.

All the while he and his two mates are pocketing handsome salaries from the BBC and getting their faces on the telly for a couple of months every year.