SPFL Clubs raising the drawbridge?

[Greenmachine]

2 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

I agree that automatic relegation at the bottom needs changed but thats got f**k all to do with the nonsense I replied to previously. Time for you to go on ignore I think. 

Ignore any posts that call into question the fact that diddy SPFL clubs are running scared of losing their hand outs?

[TxRover]

2 hours ago, Nowhereman said:

Why would clubs need a legal expert? Cant they just instruct a lawyer as and when they need one?

There isn’t a requirement for a legal expert.

[Johnny Worm]

2 hours ago, Nowhereman said:

Why would clubs need a legal expert? Cant they just instruct a lawyer as and when they need one?

Probably just means access to legal advice than someone on the books

[parsforlife]

19 minutes ago, Greenmachine said:

Ignore any posts that call into question the fact that diddy SPFL clubs are running scared of losing their hand outs?

You can’t seriously be trying to argue that clubs genuinely believe that adding a few more requirements is going to stop teams coming up. It’s not like they’ve suddenly asked for the fabled gold plated toilets the old blazers used to lie about

[Greenmachine]

12 minutes ago, parsforlife said:

You can’t seriously be trying to argue that clubs genuinely believe that adding a few more requirements is going to stop teams coming up. It’s not like they’ve suddenly asked for the fabled gold plated toilets the old blazers used to lie about

Why bother with it then?

 

[gordon9736]

2 hours ago, Nowhereman said:

Why would clubs need a legal expert? Cant they just instruct a lawyer as and when they need one?

Maybe it's an Old Firm thing seeing as they seem permamently  using lawyers to deal with their run-ins with UEFA/SPFL/SFA with regards to their fans' behaviour.

[Ocelot1877]

32 minutes ago, Greenmachine said:

Why bother with it then?

 

To ensure more professional standards whilst maintaining safety for fans, players and employees whilst safe guarding the clubs and league from any legal ramifications.

The same reason that only licensed clubs can get promoted to the lowland and highland league and why Beith weren’t eligible for promotion this year after winning the WOSL premier.

But you know it’s a load of shite eh? These bloody self preserving SPFL league 2 teams eh
 

 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Ocelot1877

[Greenmachine]

14 minutes ago, Ocelot1877 said:

To ensure more professional standards whilst maintaining safety for fans, players and employees whilst safe guarding the clubs and league from any legal ramifications.

The same reason that only licensed clubs can get promoted to the lowland and highland league and why Beith weren’t eligible for promotion this year after winning the WOSL premier.

But you know it’s a load of shite eh? These bloody self preserving SPFL league 2 teams eh
 

 

I’m sure having those extra covered areas up to 500 will make it much safer

What will happen to the clubs that are currently in the SPFL that are entry level like Airdrie etc?

Edited July 18, 2023 by Greenmachine

[Ocelot1877]

23 minutes ago, Greenmachine said:

I’m sure having those extra covered areas up to 500 will make it much safer

What will happen to the clubs that are currently in the SPFL that are entry level like Airdrie etc?

I don’t know why you have picked a requirement that obviously makes things safer to make your point? 
 

Teams that are currently in the league system and ones that are chasing  promotion will still be able to apply for waivers/exceptions as has already been covered and stated by the authorities. 

Just so we are clear what out of the below requirements from entry to bronze has got you so upset?

Bronze
5.4 The Field	The field shall be rated in “satisfactory” condition.
5.4 The Field	FIFA Quality Pro, club to demonstrate annually it meets the standard
5.4 The Field	95x60m (+5x4m)
5.4 The Field	(Actual numbers rather than best practice)
5.4 The Field	No other markings on the field
5.4 The Field	Socketed goalposts
5.8 Dressing Rooms	Match officials room with space for 5 instead of 4
5.13 Spectator Areas	Cover for home and away fans
5.13 Spectator Areas	Cover for 500 (up from 100)
5.15 Provision for Disabled Spectators	Appoint a disability access officer
5.15 Provision for Disabled Spectators	No sightline obstructions
5.15 Provision for Disabled Spectators	PA adjacent seating
6.1 Training and Coaching Facilities for Senior Players	Suitable training facilities
6.3 Medical and First Aid Facilities for Senior Players Rehabilitation	Medical examination facility (not third party)
6.4 Medical and First Aid Provision for Senior Players at Matches	Club doctor/paramedic, physiotherapist, medical bag
6.6 Team Manager/ Head Coach	B licence
6.7 First Team Coaches	B licence
6.8 Club Doctor or Medical Officer	Clubs shall have one
6.9 Club Therapist	Clubs shall have one
6.10 Goalkeeping Coach	Clubs shall have one
8.4 Finance Manager	Clubs shall have a professional one
8.5 Safety Officer	Clubs shall have a qualified one
8.11 Annual Financial Statements	Stricter, prepared by qualified accountant
8.13 Insolvency Events	Not since June 2020
8.17 Attendance at a Scottish FA Organised Event on Refereeing Matters	Manager/coach and team captain (instead of just someone from the club)
8.19 Diversity and Inclusion	The club shall identify the training requirements for staff and key volunteers and create a learning development plan within the equality action plan.

 

Edited July 18, 2023 by Ocelot1877

[Greenmachine]

21 minutes ago, Ocelot1877 said:

I don’t know why you have picked a requirement that obviously makes things safer to make your point? 
 

Teams that are currently in the league system and ones that are chasing  promotion will still be able to apply for waivers/exceptions as has already been covered and stated by the authorities. 

Just so we are clear what out of the below requirements from entry to bronze has got you so upset?

Bronze
5.4 The Field	The field shall be rated in “satisfactory” condition.
5.4 The Field	FIFA Quality Pro, club to demonstrate annually it meets the standard
5.4 The Field	95x60m (+5x4m)
5.4 The Field	(Actual numbers rather than best practice)
5.4 The Field	No other markings on the field
5.4 The Field	Socketed goalposts
5.8 Dressing Rooms	Match officials room with space for 5 instead of 4
5.13 Spectator Areas	Cover for home and away fans
5.13 Spectator Areas	Cover for 500 (up from 100)
5.15 Provision for Disabled Spectators	Appoint a disability access officer
5.15 Provision for Disabled Spectators	No sightline obstructions
5.15 Provision for Disabled Spectators	PA adjacent seating
6.1 Training and Coaching Facilities for Senior Players	Suitable training facilities
6.3 Medical and First Aid Facilities for Senior Players Rehabilitation	Medical examination facility (not third party)
6.4 Medical and First Aid Provision for Senior Players at Matches	Club doctor/paramedic, physiotherapist, medical bag
6.6 Team Manager/ Head Coach	B licence
6.7 First Team Coaches	B licence
6.8 Club Doctor or Medical Officer	Clubs shall have one
6.9 Club Therapist	Clubs shall have one
6.10 Goalkeeping Coach	Clubs shall have one
8.4 Finance Manager	Clubs shall have a professional one
8.5 Safety Officer	Clubs shall have a qualified one
8.11 Annual Financial Statements	Stricter, prepared by qualified accountant
8.13 Insolvency Events	Not since June 2020
8.17 Attendance at a Scottish FA Organised Event on Refereeing Matters	Manager/coach and team captain (instead of just someone from the club)
8.19 Diversity and Inclusion	The club shall identify the training requirements for staff and key volunteers and create a learning development plan within the equality action plan.

 

Keeps clubs like Pollok and Beith down without major infrastructure expense with their pitches.Yet it’s apparently ok if the pitch is an absolute shambles as long as it’s the right size and flat like Dumbarton.

 

[Ocelot1877]

15 minutes ago, Greenmachine said:

Keeps clubs like Pollok and Beith down without major infrastructure expense with their pitches.Yet it’s apparently ok if the pitch is an absolute shambles as long as it’s the right size and flat like Dumbarton.

 

Beith and Pollok aren’t in the lowland league and in a world where they were and on the verge of getting promoted they could apply for a waiver/ exception as has been stated to you yet again. 

Beith are currently being kept down because they haven’t got an SFA license so they weren’t able to participate in the promotion playoff after winning the league.

There are currently safety concerns at Newlandsfield which is why their capacity got cut to 900 despite being able to hold much more. In terms of their pitch not being big enough to meet the bronze standard of the league it is unfortunately an expense they will need to pay but one that is achievable.
The same way Dumbarton pay money to make their pitch meet the criteria of the league. 
 

Imagine wanting to play on a flat pitch. What a world eh 

Again I’ll ask, what one of the requirements stated from Entry license to Bronze license do you not think should be in place for a club playing in league 2?

Edited July 18, 2023 by Ocelot1877

[parsforlife]

11 minutes ago, Greenmachine said:

Keeps clubs like Pollok and Beith down without major infrastructure expense with their pitches.Yet it’s apparently ok if the pitch is an absolute shambles as long as it’s the right size and flat like Dumbarton.

 

Bronze licensing requires a satisfactory rating from the referees pitch reports of the course of the season.  So no it’s not ok to be an absolute shambles and it wouldn’t surprise me if someone has asked Dumbarton about this.

And the size/gradient requirements for a bronze licence are not that difficult.

[Greenmachine]

11 minutes ago, Ocelot1877 said:

Beith and Pollok aren’t in the lowland league and in a world where they were and on the verge of getting promoted they could apply for a waiver/ exception as has been stated to you yet again. 

Beith are currently being kept down because they haven’t got an SFA license so they weren’t able to participate in the promotion playoff after winning the league.

There are currently safety concerns at Newlandsfield which is why their capacity got cut to 900 despite being able to hold much more. In terms of their pitch not being big enough to meet the bronze standard of the league it is unfortunately an expense they will need to pay but one that is achievable.
The same way Dumbarton pay money to make their pitch meet the criteria of the league. 
 

Imagine wanting to play on a flat pitch. What a world eh 

Again I’ll ask, what one of the requirements stated from Entry license to Bronze license do you not think should be in place for a club playing in league 2?

Entry level is fine for Mickey Mouse part time football with a few hundred people at it.

Edited July 18, 2023 by Greenmachine

[Ocelot1877]

1 minute ago, Greenmachine said:

Entry level is fine for Mickey Mouse part time football with a few hundred people at it.

Aye exactly but we are talking about entry into the prestigious Cinch here. Standards must be held and up kept

[rockson]

8 hours ago, Greenmachine said:

There are 2 AUTOMATIC relegation places from the EFL.

I can’t think of a country with a pyramid system which doesn’t have an automatic relegation place?

That's only since very recently. Before that it was one. Before that it was none at all. Not even a play-off.

And it's two from a division with 24 clubs in it. Not 2 from ten - which is what you seem to be suggesting (and which would be insane.)

[rockson]

5 hours ago, Greenmachine said:

it’s the Self Preservation Football League.

Do you know the definition of ironic?

Edited July 18, 2023 by rockson

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

4 hours ago, parsforlife said:

You can’t seriously be trying to argue that clubs genuinely believe that adding a few more requirements is going to stop teams coming up. It’s not like they’ve suddenly asked for the fabled gold plated toilets the old blazers used to lie about

The stuff on pitch dimensions absolutely has a massive impact on clubs like Pollok etc who could tick all the other boxes in time but would cost them millions to move to a new ground which met the dimension criteria. It is a bit of a farce that Dumbarton can play on what is one of the worst playing surfaces in Scottish football (not only that but be allowed to have a groundsharing agreement also) with a corner flag going into a sink hole but a surface like newlandsfield (and as much as i hate pollok they keep it in great condition) isnt acceptable. 
Having a doctor at every game is difficult, something that lots of existing  teams are going to find more difficult as the shortage of doctors increases. Some medical indemnity companies wont insure GPs to undertake this work. Id agree with having a sports first aider, cpr trained staff and working defib at every ground as a minimum. 

3 hours ago, Greenmachine said:

I’m sure having those extra covered areas up to 500 will make it much safer

What will happen to the clubs that are currently in the SPFL that are entry level like Airdrie etc?

Kick them out. 

[Gordon EF]

These new restrictions are worth it, if only to get a laugh from the reaction of the Old Firm & ex-West Junior half-and-half scarf types.

[parsforlife]

1 hour ago, Inanimate Carbon Rod said:

The stuff on pitch dimensions absolutely has a massive impact on clubs like Pollok etc who could tick all the other boxes in time but would cost them millions to move to a new ground which met the dimension criteria. It is a bit of a farce that Dumbarton can play on what is one of the worst playing surfaces in Scottish football (not only that but be allowed to have a groundsharing agreement also) with a corner flag going into a sink hole but a surface like newlandsfield (and as much as i hate pollok they keep it in great condition) isnt acceptable. 
Having a doctor at every game is difficult, something that lots of existing  teams are going to find more difficult as the shortage of doctors increases. Some medical indemnity companies wont insure GPs to undertake this work. Id agree with having a sports first aider, cpr trained staff and working defib at every ground as a minimum.  

Nearly every spfl club meets the current requirements and those who don’t have agreed they will.  If current requirements become too difficult for large amounts of clubs to meet then they’ll be adapted appropriately.  
 

on pitches Cowdenbeath and Brechin were previously notorious for being small parks and both meet the requirements, though I’m sure Central Park was widened to do so even if it still plays narrow.

95 x 60 is a small pitch, if clubs can’t meet that even with adaptations I’m not sure what to say other than telling them to sort it out and not ask to play profesional 11 aside football on a 7 aside pitch.  Looking at pics I struggle to see how Newlandsfield can’t be adapted, it only needs a 1m or so right the way around,  expensive, maybe but their close enough that if they got to the spfl(which is a minimum 2 years away) I reckon they get a 2-3 year waiver plus maybe another similar period under small fines. During that time they probably pocket close to 1/2 a million if not more through league prize money, league cup entry etc, they’ll also find themselves more eligible for funding there’s 6 figure sums going around to help with this sort of work.

[foreverarover]

On 17/07/2023 at 17:38, Beachcomber said:

New Dundas Park certainly  needs toilets built, the "Portaloos" were disgusting.

Fech me stenny had themselves and Queens playing in a ground that had 4 or 5 portaloos as toilets in the away end for the full season.