Skyline Drifter Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 A different thread because I feel the other one is predominantly about the game rather than the overall situation. So where do we stand now then? Is it time for Berti to go? Is that the most redundant question ever? He was brought here to qualify us for the next World Cup. I think we'd all accept that's a very long shot now. Even three home wins and three away wins might not do it (I'm assuming that winning in Italy is not feasible) and six wins is unthinkable now anyway. We're out and we know we're out. It's just about avoiding embarrassment and trying to reach the giddy heights of third in the group. Could anyone else do any better? Yes, I think they probably could. We all know he has a sow's ear of a squad to work with, particularly this time around but we haven't really progressed in his time. Sure he's brought some youth into the squad but that would have happened anyway. I will give him credit for being prepared to use good players before they become Old Firm players and selecting players from other clubs even when there's an Old Firm alternative available (Gordon ahead of Marshall for example although in that case I'd rather see Marshall given a go). But tactically he seems to have little idea what he's doing, We went through several years of fiddling with tactics and playing players out of position. To be fair we now seem to have a more solid shape and, leaving the results out of the way for the moment, I'd have to say the last 4 performances (Spain, Slovenia, Norway and Moldova) were not that bad from a solid unit point of view. In fact Moldova probably made more chances than the other three did put together and he was shorn of most of his first choice defnse there. Spain, though a friendly, was a good showing and a good result. Slovenia, despite last night's result, are a good side and a 0-0 even at home was far from the end of the world. Norway are a poor side and a home defeat was a poor result but had Hughes effort gone over the line and Gordon not come for a ball he was never getting we'd be talking about a 1-0 win and much happier. On such small margins a career can falter. Last night was poor again, but it's not unique. Other manager's have had bad results to "diddy" nations. Moldova aren't actually that bad. Never mind the ranking, they were 10 minutes from drawing with England at home and DID draw in England in the last campaign. Could we seriously say we'd do the same? Had the last 4 performances been the first four I'd not be that unhappy. But he's been here a while now and we are not any better really. Perhaps the question now is not "can we afford to sack him?" but "can we afford not to?". Strachan seems to be the "people's choice". Presuming that he would actually take the job now is the time to do it. In six months time he may not be available. Here's an iron in the fire - Craig Brown is also available....... They say you should never go back but wee Craigy's achievements have looked all the better for the faltering of his successor. Discuss....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k38jfb Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 With the huge salary that Berti is commanding, it's very unlikely that the SFA will pay him off. He seems to have good ideas about the future rather than the present - bringing through young players, etc. Maybe he should be given the job that the shinty bloke had to give up a couple of months ago - Head of Development (or something!). Then the SFA wouldn't have to pay him off, move him upstairs, and we would get a new manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugster Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 With the huge salary that Berti is commanding, it's very unlikely that the SFA will pay him off. He seems to have good ideas about the future rather than the present - bringing through young players, etc. Maybe he should be given the job that the shinty bloke had to give up a couple of months ago - Head of Development (or something!). Then the SFA wouldn't have to pay him off, move him upstairs, and we would get a new manager. But they'd be as well paying him off anyway, because if they bump him upstairs, they then have to pay a new manager as well as him. And exactly what will he do? He's incompetent. He's proven to be a very, very expensive mistake. He should go, and so should Taylor or whoever gave him such an exhorbitant salary. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest blues_in_f Posted October 14, 2004 Share Posted October 14, 2004 George Graham is the man for the job. Took Arsenal to the Uefa cup final(cup winners cup?) - shows he can manage a team to success. Will instill some pride and aggression back into the team and will hopefully get the best out of the players. He has a better record than both strachan or smith. mind you i think i really just want a scottish manager - we play a certain style of football and it needs a scottish coach to utilise this. Anyway, point is: GEORGE GRAHAM FOR MANAGER OF SCOTLAND Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Here's an iron in the fire - Craig Brown is also available....... They say you should never go back but wee Craigy's achievements have looked all the better for the faltering of his successor.Discuss....... Craig Brown would do a decent job with this crop of players. However, I think it is time for a complete overhaul. Start from scratch and take a good look at the youth setup etc - Brown has never seemed keen to promote youngsters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k38jfb Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Walter Smith is the man for the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest AyrDelighted Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Walter Smith is the man for the job. Why? What has he done and what would he bring to the national team? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BRFC Tartan Army Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Craig Brown would do a decent job with this crop of players. However, I think it is time for a complete overhaul. Start from scratch and take a good look at the youth setup etc - Brown has never seemed keen to promote youngsters. Couldn't agree more with you mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k38jfb Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Why? What has he done and what would he bring to the national team? He won 7 league titles at Rangers, numerous other trophies and got them to a European semi-final. Then he went to Everton and led the cvlub through their most troubling times - no-one else could have done any better than him at Goodison. He's good at building team spirit and will get the players playing for each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miketheheadlesschicken Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 He won 7 league titles at Rangers, numerous other trophies and got them to a European semi-final. Then he went to Everton and led the cvlub through their most troubling times - no-one else could have done any better than him at Goodison. He's good at building team spirit and will get the players playing for each other. Smith inherited the best team in Scotland and spent over £50M to keep them there. Rangers never played in a European semi final. Rangers record in Europe under Walter Smith was appalling, especially considering they spent all the money on building a team for Europe. At Everton, they lingered just above the relegation zone until he was sacked before he finally relegated them. He was successful domestically at Rangers but he won't have millions to spend with Scotland and he won't always be playing against poorer teams. When he did manage his team against better opposition, ie. in Europe and in the Premiership, he failed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
k38jfb Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Smith inherited the best team in Scotland and spent over £50M to keep them there. Rangers never played in a European semi final. Rangers record in Europe under Walter Smith was appalling, especially considering they spent all the money on building a team for Europe. At Everton, they lingered just above the relegation zone until he was sacked before he finally relegated them.He was successful domestically at Rangers but he won't have millions to spend with Scotland and he won't always be playing against poorer teams. When he did manage his team against better opposition, ie. in Europe and in the Premiership, he failed. OK, they never played in a European semi-final, but they narrowly missed out on a final place to Marseille. And it's not about money, why I think Walter Smith is the man for the job. It's about building team spirit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
An Sionnach Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 MOL - feckin - DOVA, FFS! We can't even beat a third world, former Soviet Republic side from a country with half the population of Scotland! Take a leaf out of Berwick's books - ditch the manager - preferably in front of the away fans in the Hampden Car Park after we've scraped another pitiful draw against some half-arsed, 123rd ranked bunch of ex-Commies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reynard Posted October 15, 2004 Share Posted October 15, 2004 Yes Vogts will have to go because he failed to achieve his targets. Whether anyone else will make a better fist of it with the rubbish they will have to work with I dont know.I was a big critic of Broon at the time he was in charge but I suppose he did get the odd result for us.We certainly werent total whipping boys as we are now. Whoever takes over will be reduced to playing defensive saftey first football.Utterly boring to watch but with the players we have it might get us better results. Changing the manager wont be a panacea to Scotlands football difficulties.We only need to look at the state of the Under21s to know that its another generation of rubbish on its way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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