Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I was asked to give an example and did so, not banging on about anything. No you're probably right, and I may be wrong, but it seems to be the loyalist community that is harboring a greater sense of grievance in recent times and the evidence would certainly suggest it is they who have the greater problem with racism and intolerance atm. But as I said that doesn't mean there's not complete cretins on both. At last, a bit of temperance.... There are morons on both sides, to varying degrees, (yup, Belfast Dim is back), but I take umbrage to the small group of people who continually refer to "bigot apologists", when I have repeatedly condemned the actions of my own community, as well as that other mob. The Loyalist community does harbour a sense of grievance, (and rightly so in my opinion), as Sinn Fein appear to making great progress since the GFA, but that will never excuse morons flying nazi flags. A better course of action would be to question the dreadful leadership they have had over the years? Their attitudes to racism should be addressed, (quickly and sharply) through education and, if that fails, the courts. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Which side has blocked equality legislation at Stormont? Without doubt, the DUP but I suspect that they would have many supporters in the RC church, but let's not go down this road....................... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Aye, ok, course it didn't. Not surprised you can't even recall half the pish you post tbh. Have a go then. I'll offer a tenner to a charity of your choice if you can quote me, "deflecting about the comments from the Grand Master." If you're wrong I'd ask for a tenner to be donated to Erskine: http://www.erskine.org.uk/ Deal or no deal? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Semantics then, it wasn't the grand master. Chief Bigot or whatever his ludicrous title is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AberdeenBud Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I read it and if you take it seriously then you're a fool. Deflect, deflect, sweep, sweep. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 The constant reference to "bigot apologist", © the Big Greenock Virgin, leads to me to ask who really is the bigot? http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/bigotry 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milton75 Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I don't think I have ever white knighted the more unsavoury elelements of the loyalist community , my point has been people seem too easily to umbrella all these parts of the loapylistbside under the orange order when in reality their are clear differences between them , recent example being the nazi flag put up , probably put up by some wee end from the local scheme yet many here had simply blamed the orange order when in reality it probably had he haw to do with them . I can also see the orange order has had its faults over the years but blaming it on every issue on the loyalist side is just simply lazy Is it as lazy as immediately saying I was talking pish about the OO Paramilitary thing, when a 2-second google would have uncovered the fact that I wasn't? I don't think knowing things about a friends is so strange , particularly if you are close . Most people probably know most of their close friends background, religion ,sexuality , politics and football team . If they have never popped up yous probably are not that close I agree with you that it's not strange knowing these things. It is strange mentioning them. Do any of these sentences seem normal to you: "So I went to the football the other day with Dave the Sikh ". "So I went running the other day with Bob, he's a Jew". etc. It was an odd comment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The OP Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I think the main issue the Naranja side of the fence have (when it comes to having a microscope placed upon their views and misdeeds) is that they invite criticism by drawing attention to themselves in the most ostentatious manner possible throughout the summer months. If you want to stop drawing ire you'd be as well not banging drums and lighting 40 foot fires. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 It was a tongue in cheek reaction to constantly being called a bigot apologist., hence the "God forbid" remark afterwards, or didn't you see that? Does it strike you as really being that strange, once contextualised? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I think the main issue the Naranja side of the fence have (when it comes to having a microscope placed upon their views and misdeeds) is that they invite criticism by drawing attention to themselves in the most ostentatious manner possible throughout the summer months. If you want to stop drawing ire you'd be as well not banging drums and lighting 40 foot fires. Does this excuse certain posters denigrating a whole community, that sort of behaviour being, in itself, the essence of bigotry? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forever_blue Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 (edited) Is it as lazy as immediately saying I was talking pish about the OO Paramilitary thing, when a 2-second google would have uncovered the fact that I wasn't? I agree with you that it's not strange knowing these things. It is strange mentioning them. Do any of these sentences seem normal to you: "So I went to the football the other day with Dave the Sikh ". "So I went running the other day with Bob, he's a Jew". etc. It was an odd comment. Sorry I was not aware of the comment as it seems to be from about 15 years ago , I would have ben 5-6 at the time so excuse my ignorance to the comment , however it was not exactly the call to arms or in the immediate run up to the yes campaign as I thought you were claiming it was to be, so aplogies , it does certainly come across as a stupid thing to say Edited July 12, 2015 by forever_blue 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why even bother to respond to this guy? Anyone who genuinely believes that the Orange Order was going to morph into a paramilitary group in the event of a Yes vote last year or that Carrickfergus is a hotbed of neo-Nazism has a tenuous grip on reality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The OP Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Does this excuse certain posters denigrating a whole community, that sort of behaviour being, in itself, the essence of bigotry? I don't know what you're on about. Is the Orange Order a community? I thought it was a weird fraternal organization which embarrasses members of wider communities. I would denigrate any fraternal organization tbh, whilst accepting that certain members might be alright aside from the need to be part of a fruity club, but fraternal societies defined by largely by what they oppose are most deserving of criticism. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Have a go then. I'll offer a tenner to a charity of your choice if you can quote me, "deflecting about the comments from the Grand Master." If you're wrong I'd ask for a tenner to be donated to Erskine: http://www.erskine.org.uk/ Deal or no deal? Semantics then, it wasn't the grand master. Chief Bigot or whatever his ludicrous title is. Deflect, deflect, sweep, sweep. So a tenner to Erskine? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why? Because to leave comments like that unchallenged allows the perpetuation of the myth that all the ills of Northern Ireland are down to one side of the fence, and one only. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LongTimeLurker Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Why? Because to leave comments like that unchallenged allows the perpetuation of the myth that all the ills of Northern Ireland are down to one side of the fence, and one only. I was meaning more the bigot-apologist angle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
forever_blue Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I don't know what you're on about. Is the Orange Order a community? I thought it was a weird fraternal organization which embarrasses members of wider communities. I would denigrate any fraternal organization tbh, whilst accepting that certain members might be alright aside from the need to be part of a fruity club, but fraternal societies defined by largely by what they oppose are most deserving of criticism. Including the republican ones on the other side? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I don't know what you're on about. Is the Orange Order a community? I thought it was a weird fraternal organization which embarrasses members of wider communities. I would denigrate any fraternal organization tbh, whilst accepting that certain members might be alright aside from the need to be part of a fruity club, but fraternal societies defined by largely by what they oppose are most deserving of criticism. That. in itself, I would agree with, but I would suggest that you re being disingenuous here? Posters on this board often use the vicissitudes of the OO or the paramilitaries as being representative of one side as a while, but I suspect you are intelligent enough to already know that? Racist morons in the loyalist are no more representative of the wider community that the p***k at Parkhead with an IRA flag is representative of thousands of decent Celtic fans. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audaces Fortuna Juvat Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 I was meaning more the bigot-apologist angle. Certainly not my stance, but I still get lumped into the bigot apologist group, although point taken. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Kincardine Posted July 12, 2015 Share Posted July 12, 2015 Not surprised you can't even recall half the pish you post tbh. How about this wee nugget of ignorance, chappy? The fair bloke would donate a tenner to Erskine for making a c**t of himself. The cheap man would offer an apology. Which option will you choose? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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