[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Fucking hell.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry, but the latter seems more appropriate.

[Petty Things That Get On Your Nerves...]

I had a few incidents trying to search for bands up at my mates on Friday as well. It got to the point where she just took the laptop off me and I had to dictate. Saying that, I still don't think that worked.

That sounds like a good deal. Maybe there's a use for women after all.

I think if you ever believed that any degree was a passport to riches then you are a fool, regardless of what the government told you. Before I went to uni I did some research. A study had been done to find out that after 6 months of graduation, students with which degree were most likely to have degree based graduate job. Geography came 2nd on the list, which is partly why I chose it.

I'm really not driven by money myself. I'd like to earn approx £25,000 a year in a job I enjoyed which would be enough to see me through life. I know I can supplement this income with £10,000 a year tax free (probably up to £20,000) a year by trading on football betting markets pre match.

Call me arrogant, but I think I'm too clever (not specifically in an academic sense) to ever really be struggling.

In England and Wales more than up here, the Government really push uni. There are glossy adverts all over the papers, public tansport and the telly suggesting that a degree is something all the cool kids have.

I doubt that many prospective students put in the research you describe, given the number working in unskilled jobs. This was the case long before the recession hit, as a result of the insane target of having 50% of school leavers in higher education.

We're just below that and I'd say much less and you'd struggle. Two days a week at nursery is £258 quid a month for a start. Fair enough I'm also paying a huge chunk out to get a tiny bit of debt paid off in 12 months.

I could potentially earn more but I'd have to work in Glasgow so I forfeit the couple extra grand (aprox 1k of which would e spent on travel) to have something a bit closer to home.

I'd also think carefully about how many I could afford but it is those in society who believe they are owed something for nothing who aren't so considerate.

The last paragraph is bang on. Working folk on modest incomes are faced with these decisions whereas the dregs have no such concerns.

[Petty Things That Get On Your Nerves...]

Going through school, I would never have qualified for EMA, but more or less at the same time I left school, my Mum lost her job.

Thankfully, EMA is just SAAS-lite, and the good people at the Student Awards Agency Scotland can't seem to stop giving me money, which is lovely. And much needed.

As I say, circumstances can change, and that's where the state has a duty to provide support.

I've got the exact same views on the matter as you. People can do what they want, none of my business etc, but I probably wouldn't even consider having a child until I was in a long term relationship (probably 5 years +) and we had a joint income of £40,000+.

I also hate how people complain about having a low paid job. The same people are always the sort who like to try and blame the goverment and the like for their misfortune. IT YOUR OWN FAULT YOU HAVE A SHIT JOB. SHUT UP OR f**k OFF.

Absolutely. I'd say that a joint income of 40 grand is the bare minumum on with you could give children a decent quality of life nowadays.

Folk seem to view having children as a right. With rights come responsibilities, so if you can't provide a stable, comfortable home for them, then don't f'cking bother.

I'd take you to task on the last point though. I know pleny of folk better qualified than I who have shitty jobs. People were sold on the idea that a degree, any degree, would be their passport to riches. That misconcpetion is the fault of the government.

[Petty Things That Get On Your Nerves...]

I'm sure they'd spend it wisely on museum admission and textbooks, not drink, drugs and fags.

I appreciate that circumstances can channge, but why the f'ck would you have children if you had a household income of less than 20 grand anyways?

14-15K is the bare mimumum on which a single person can live independently IMO. Even that would pay for a 1 bed flat at best. I earn a few grand more than that, but certainly couldn't support a family.

[Petty Things That Get On Your Nerves...]

See considering just how far gone I was last night when I posted that, I'm incredibly pleased that there is only one mistake in it!

Anyway, I'm tired and I'm still online. It's petty, and it's getting on my nerves.

That's because it probably took you 35 minutes to type the thing.

I simply cannot type when I'm pished.

Amongst my Spotify searches from Friday night was "Niel Yeuhg" or similar. There should be pished search option that suggests the artist whose name you're attempting to type.

[Petty Things That Get On Your Nerves...]

I could be wrong, but I think that's what happened. I believed I was annoying wearealldoomed at the time. Maybe he can clear things up.

That'll be fucking shining bright.

I recall speaking to you briefly, but that's about it. Any wobbly burd incidents escaped my attention.

[Top Gear]

The Scirocco adverts.

The suicide one was class.

I was in pain by the time the laughter subsided following the suicide advert.

[Nom Nom Nom]

I'd be more than a little bemused, I must say.

Well, 'tis after 10 and the petrol station may have ran out of muck.

[Nom Nom Nom]

Nah, but only because that would hardly be a surprise.

A carton of Tropicana and a copy of the Ecomomist then?

[Nom Nom Nom]

We're both hungry so my boyfriend has been sent to the petrol station with the instruction "surprise me". If he brings me back a Pot Noodle, our son will not be having any younger brothers or sisters.

I asked my boyfriend earlier to go to shops and was told "suprise me". He came back with a big bag of Maltesers, Sour Cream & Onion Pringles and Cheesey Doritos.

Not a bad effort...

Yet if the respective blokes came back with a bottle of Buckfast and a copy of Razzle, you'd throw a hissy fit...

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Truth is, Livingston have done nothing but make it tougher for everyone else.

Oh aye.

Obviously the Scottish lower leagues don't exist in a vacuum, but Livingston must have deprived clubs in divisions 1-3 of a rediculous number of players over the years, and would have driven up wage expectations and by-passed frugally run clubs in the process of doing so.

The unfortunate thing is that Scottish football was beginning to settle down after the chaos of the last 20 years. With few exceptions, most clubs are at their natural level and are spending sensibly. Should the rule change be pushed through, we'll set ourselves back 15 years at a stroke.

I'm old enough to remeber the cazy days of the late 80s to early 90s, where 1st division clubs habitually paid tranfer fees and wages that would make the likes of Hibs and Aberdeen turn pale these days. The example set this week is that it's OK to chase a dream in that manner again. That's the last thing Scottish football needs.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

How many Livi fans agree with the comments below?

The above appears on Livi Lions and perhaps sums up just how out of touch with reality many fans of that club still are. I have not an earthly if the poster, Liviforever, posts on P&B. I suspect it would be better for him if he didn't darken this board with such unfortunate comments.

I can only assume the chap(ess) is about 15, otherwise he/she is a bit of a fuckwit.

Livingston fans think they've had it tough?

:lol:

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Incidentally, David Longmuir's comments in the paper today are a laugh. Livingston couldn't be demoted to the third division as "McDougall and Rankine's business plan is based on them being a first division club".

Pretty much indicates that they won't be deducted points either in my view. What a joke.

Why not extend that principle?

If you're relegated from your division, perhaps reelegation can be reversed if you show the SFL a "business plan" that evidences your club's reliance on a certain level of ticket and sponsorship cash to balance the books?

Heaven forbid that clubs might have to cut their cloth accordingly when circumstances change.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

You know exactly what I mean. They made themselves look like c***s by letting it happen in a roundabout way. Doesn't matter how it's dressed up.

Aye, you're right. The whole liquidation jape was a right good laugh.

The loss of 114 years of history, our ground and league place was all part of the plan. The varios Airdrieonians puppet boards of the time were visionaries.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Absolute fuckin joke...

Clyde over the summer made 13 players redundant, released the rest of the out of contract players, and have had to employ a bunch of last chance saloon players on £20 p/w to play for us so we can pay off a shitload of money on stadium debt.

We'll suffer in the 2nd division for that exact reason and will keep us down for a while. Whilst those cheating c***s can spunk money all over the shop, not pay fuckin bills, and then get a wee scare and slap on the wrist by the SFL.

Fuckin joke. If those c***s continue Full Time and in the 1st division, then it's a complete fuckin joke.

f**k Livi and f**k the SFL. Shower of c***s the lot of them!

I've limited sympathy for Clyde given that we suffered as they contiunually outspent us on wages. For all that, I agree with you here.

Clyde (finally) have taken the correct action to reduce their outgoings and get the club on an even keel again. They, and their fans, will have to endure a good few barren years as a result, possibly leading to another relegation.

In future, all you have to do is spend well beyond your means then transfer control of the club to a shell company with no obvious links to the incumbent regime.

FFS.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

The Scottish Football League will continue to monitor the situation at Almondvale over the coming weeks and any sanctions against the club will be decided during this time.

What in the name of suffering fuck is that?

The use of the word "any" would suggest that the SFL are going to take no action whatsoever. 15 points or whatever Hamilton were fined for non-payment of wages should be the absolute least that Livingston escape with.

If Livingston finish ahead of ANY club this coming season, I hope to f'ck that the relegated club(s) consider legal action. This is unreal.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

I don't see how. He hasn't done anything illegal.

If Livingston are to escape with a fifteen point penalty it'll be one of the most incompetent - some would say corrupt - pieces of non-action by the SFL in living memory. Livingston are not going to be very popular after this.

I think corrupt is closer to the mark.

Hopefully Livingston go tits up 10 games into the season in order to show up the SFL as the tossbags they are.

If our own chaiman had any hand in this summer of disruption to our pre-season, it's an indictment on his stewardship of both the LMC and his club. Cowden and every other division three club are prefectly entitled to ask questions also.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Uhhhhhh it's upside down lads.

Another worrying aspect for anyone considering taking over this mess at such a late stage...

At two supporters rallies outside Almondvale plus yesterdays meeting, there's been a combined total of under 500 fans. In fact it's maybe nearer 300.

If Livi have a core support of 1000+ (mentioned somewhere earlier in this thread) then where the f**k are they, and why are they not showing those running the thing how much they want it to be saved. Sitting on your arse at home hoping for a miracle definitely won't achieve a thing.

Respect to those who have at least put in the effort however.

In fairness, standing in the middle of Glasgow on a weekday shouting abuse the the bad folk killing your club is a bit dull.

I joined our demo outside KPMG in 2002, and lasted around half an hour before heading for a pint.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

The scene at Hampden..

I quite fancy heading home early for a laugh now. An Airdrie top and a black tie would go down well amongst the mourners, I reckon.

.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

So, the meeting starts in the next 15 minutes, and Massone is nowhere in sight. Unless he makaes a last ditch phonecall, we're looking at any one of four scenarios:

1. SFL throw the book at "Livi", they're booted out and cease to exist.

2. SFL relegate "Livi" to Div 3, potentially chasing off interested investors, and set a tight deadline to give Massone/McGruther one last chance.

3. SFL deduct huge amount of points but "Livi" are kept in Div One with a tight deadline to give the parties one last chance.

4. SFL postpone decision in order to mull over McGruther's plea for an on-the-hoof rule change, allowing Massone to be sidelined, and MacDougall or Rankine to assume control. MacDougall's attendance at this meeting, along with Rankine, will see the old blazers connection leaned on heavily and any outstanding favours called in.

My money (virtual money, as tomorrow is payday) is on option 2 being taken. The club will pop it's clogs a few weeks on.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Without wanting to open another mouldy can of worms - the SFL and LMC have already allowed that to happen.

Really?

Who was that then, given that Airdrieonians lost their league place upon liquidaton, which was then followed by Airdrie United's application to the SFL being declined?

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

eh ? roll on Sat then.......

Tis a shame we don't inherit Lavvy's cup draw as well as their lleague position.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

Is that not the area just outside off stump?

Nope.

Tis the gap between a goalkeeper and his centre halves. A good centre forward will always gamble by attacking this area when a cross is delivered.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

You were right first time - number on-line at same time.

This is like waiting for the pall bearers to carry the coffin into the church.

The corpse is about to leap from the coffin, screaming "I'm alive!!".

Ach well, best of luck to everyone next season anyways. Hopefully see you in 2010, with a squad that can do a decent job.

[Livingston - all the threads merged]

I get that, but isn't his job to protect the interests of creditors? And aren't the council the biggest creditor (along with Massone himself)? How can he already say the club cannot operate under administration? What assets can be liquidated? Creditors will get feck all, whereas if the club continues to operate, there's the possibility of more than feck all.

If Massone takles the £25K and runs, there remains the possibility of a prospective new owner having enough cash to offer creditors a settlement after the liquidators' fees are paid.

If this is allowed to drag on, the liquidators' fees mount up and add to the overall debt pile, making a sale less likely unless all other debts are written off. In turn, that also means that intead of assets being sold to raise cash for the pre-existing creditors in the event of the club being wound up, it's likely that any fire sale wouldn't even cover the fees.

The creditors are f'cked one way or the other. The only thing that's certain is that the liquidators will receive their cash, or a portion of it, regardless of the outcome.