gaz5

I can tell you with absolute certainty that these discussions still happen in dressing rooms right up to premiership level. Ultimately players over riding desire to win sees them look for every advantage possible, it's just less overt than in Souness/Keane era's because people don't like it. I don't condone it personally and there are those in these dressing rooms who won't pay it any heed (I certainly never did, albeit far far lower level), but there are others who will absolutely take the opportunity to test any perceived weakness should the opportunity present itself. It rarely comes from managers/coaches BTW, it's the players themselves. For clarity. Boyd has basically said what his experience reflects from being in these dressing rooms because he's too stupid to realise it's not talked about outside them these days. It's not like he's smart enough to come up with it himself, what we heard from him was his experience as a player coming out.

Exactly my thinking. He's an arse who I'd have no issue being off the punditry and quite clearly an idiot for saying it out loud, but there's no doubt at all this conversation happens in dressing rooms up and down the country, in every country, every week, at every level.

I can confirm at least some of that is true of Denver airport. The artwork is fucking bizarre throughout, but particularly in arrivals and the demon horse outside is weird AF. Never noticed the runway configuration or Illuminati signs, from memory.

You boys and blue don't half take observations by interested observers against your beloved boys in blue personally. [emoji1787] "Attack him", really, you think posting that question is attacking him? Wow. Is it possible he didn't have a work permit on the Sunday but did for Monday morning? If course it is. Is it possible he did, but didn't want to intervene for the reasons you suggest (not having worked with the players)? Also yes. Given the result would Ross Wilson day he didn't either way to deflect from those questions? Of course he would, that's how the games played. We'll never know the reality. All I can say is that there are plenty of managers out there who would have found some way to make some impact, particularly after the first half, work permit issues or not. FWIW it's too early to tell if GVB is going to be a good manager for Rangers or not, that'll be answered in whether he can win the league or not. And he does seem like a fairly likeable guy. Unusual for them both to have likeable managers at the same time. But it's not too early to say that the early signs of his tenure aren't great either, especially after the winter break. Before then he tweaked a few obvious things but was mostly a continuation. Since the break, when he's had the time to work with them more and implement more of the style he wants, it's been really poor and that style looks, quite frankly, duller than a dull thing and not suited to the players he has. 5 points from 12 in 2022 over 3 poor performances and an absolutely abysmal performance in getting hosed by your biggest rival. And at a time where most would concede Celtic had the tougher run of fixtures but picked up 12 from 12. Jury is definitely out on GVB the next 14 games.

Well, he would say that after the fact though, wouldn't he, regardless of whether or was true or not, based on the outcome. I mean, I don't have a skin in this game, but those Government agencies arent exactly renowned for working weekends to process work permit applications for him to start training on Monday morning. But yeah, if I was Ross Wilson, that's exactly what I'd have said as well.

Really? I thought it was confirmed at the time that he was fine to be involved but he chose not to, but Makaay wasn't. Seems a bit odd he wouldn't have a work permit on the Saturday/Sunday but did on the Monday morning to start training.

I'm going to point back to when he decided not to intervene in the cup semi final, either before the game or at half time when they were getting a shoeing from Hibs. It was a bizarre decision at the time, but the passive, timid, fairly weak displays we've seen from his team since then suggest that may have been the first warning sign for Rangers fans. I tend to agree that he looked utterly rattled after the game last night and did something that, to be fair to him, Gerard never did. How many times did we hear a Gerard say "that's on me". He tended to take it on the chin publicly for the players, while presumably saying his piece behind closed doors. GVB was quite clearly blaming the players least night for not implementing his game plan, without acknowledging that game plan was crazy. Had a hint of the latter day Mourinho interviews about it, when things weren't going his way. Just a touch, not full Jose box office or anything.

Personally, I'm not talking about just Celtic games. My view is across all games I've watched Rangers the last 3 and a bit years. And also I don't think anyone is suggesting it's "all" Rangers players, that would certainly be absurd. But I do think it's an issue with some of your key players and that's where your problems lie. For example: Morelos, Jack, Arfield, Helander, McGregor, McLauchlin, Hagi don't seem to be affected by the pressure of fans to me, their levels are much the same before, during and after. They've got a bit about them, basically. Kent, Tavernier, Barasic, Goldson, Wright, Kamara all seem to struggle with the expectation/negative feedback. They were all at a level prior to Covid similar to that which they are now, but during Covid, with no pressure from the stands so can approach like a training session, they looked different players entirely. Aribo and Bassey are examples of players who have improved, last night's poor performed excluded, over the period. Given that list includes 3 of your first choice back 4, one of your key midfielders and your key attacking outlet of last year it's having an impact, IMO. To break it down to it's base level, I just think they lack a bit of mental strength. They're a bit weak on that front, despite being talented footballers.

Same. As much as it's unusual for OF managers in particular, he does come across as a "guid c*n't", to give him both his Scottish and Aussie standard designation. [emoji846]

It seems stupid to Rangers fans, sure, but to the rest of us who observed your performances before, during and now after empty stadiums it's most certainly a valid challenge. It's fine if you choose not to see or acknowledge the glaring differences in both performance and returns (you even point it out yourself in your stats) over the period along with the single constant over that time, that's fine, I'd expect that given your partisan position. But assuming other people stupid who can, independently and without that bias, observe that as an absolute possibility isn't a strong position to take. I conceded on Aribo already this season, Old Firm games aside where he's regularly below his own levels. But that's 1 from what, 8 or something I mentioned specifically. It's my view, and only my view you don't need to agree with it, that the current Rangers group of players lacks, among other things, a bit of character (a few players aside). You're soft. Celtic may or may not win the league this year (I think they're favourites at the moment), but even if they don't it's clear that in Postecoglu (sp?) they've got a manager who looks like being more successful, from a worse starting position in a shorter timeframe, than Gerard and on current evidence GVB as well, who appears to have slammed Rangers in reverse from what was already a season they'd gone backwards under Gerard.

That's probably fair. He's been your best player in the games I've seen this season by a distance and I said in a post will before last night he really had to carry Rangers on the night for you to get a result, given others form. I'd still stick by my, albeit subjective as a neutral, view though that he disappears in the heat of the Old Firm games. I can genuinely only remember 1 he's played in he hasn't been among Rangers poorest performers and that was the 4-1 game at Ibrox last year, with no fans. Boy has real ability, but I think that question mark over where he goes in the biggest games is what stops him going to a top end EPL side down the line and prohibits the crazy £20m+ figures Rangers fans talk about. IMO anyway.

Individual perception is an individual's reality, is the unfortunate truth of life. As much as us plebs would see footballer as some sort of dream job, if it's all you've ever done for work and it's been your actual job rather than your pastime then it's likely you just think of it same as anyone else does their job. If we were in it, we'd probably see it the same way. Think it's pretty unfair to think footballers would be any different to the rest of us in that regard.

I think that's always been a fans thing more than a players thing TBH. Certainly this century anyway. You'll get the odd player who grew up a fan, or came through the youth setup or some such, but I genuinely think that to most footballers these days it's just a job and they care about their employer and their employers customers about as much as the rest of us do at our own jobs. As much as we need to and making whatever noises are expected in order to keep getting paid.

Aye, they were brutal all over the park to be fair. Aribo rarely turns up for Old Firm games. I can only remember 1, the 4-1 game at Ibrox, where he wasn't poor. Kent I don't think wants to be there. He's been poor, when he's been fit, every time I've seen him this season. Dialo I said during the game was never a £40m player as long as he has a hole in his arse. Rabbit in the headlights tonight. Roofe I feel for a bit. I know some Rangers fans disagree, but I don't think he's a 9 at all. He's better playing off a striker, which under Gerard was coming from left or right as an inside 10. GVB doesn't play that way so I expect, personally, he'll move on in the summer. I do think he's a good player, just doesn't fit the new system. Tavernier is possibly one of the most over rated players I've ever seen in Scotland. I was ridiculed earlier in the season for pointing out his goals and assists numbers this year were akin to Ralston, but Ralston didn't take pens. For me, that's his level. OK, but makes stupid mistake defensively (like the third goal tonight, he has to pay attention and stop that throw cheaply going to Hatate). Juranovic and Ramsay are now the two best RB's in Scotland and I'm definitely one who thinks Rangers sold their best all round right back. Kamara I thought was harsh taking off tonight, but having watched the highlights he's at fault directly or indirectly for 2 goals, so I can see that. Goldson is another who's been there too long IMO. Jack and Arfield for me the only two who come close to pass marks. Celtic on the other hand, not a failure.

Abada. For me. Game was won between Juranovic, Abada, O'Reilly and Hatate first half. Barasic is still trying to figure out what the f**k was going on

It really is bizarre that when you consider the teams he played in and how they played. Hell, he played as an attacking fullback for one of the best club sides ever and his country. Barasic, for me, is a player that's been there a season too long and one who last season, like many Rangers players, played above themselves. He was particularly bad tonight, but even before VanBronckhorst changed the style he was poor this year. Arguably if Helander/Balogun hadn't got injured earlier in the season Bassey would have been in for a prolonged spell long before now.

Fair on the Gerard warning signs as well. I actually think that's one of the reasons he jumped to Villa when he did, could likely see this coming as Celtic were on the rise and he was struggling to recreate the previous seasons form. I think the post above (I can't figure multi quote on a phone) is pretty on point. He seems to be trying to change too much and one of those things, how you press and defend, he doesn't have the players for. The group he has its built for a high press and winning the ball high. Not for sitting in and trying to soak up pressure. It's been obvious since the turn of the year you've not got that in your locker. Aberdeen and Country were warning signs, yet tonight you could see when before Celtic scored the first that's how you were setting up. Also got to question you playing into Celtics hands trying to play out every goal kick when their strength is the high press and you've been poor at playing through even a half decent press all season. That seemed stubborn to me. Start with Bassey at LB and get him pushed high, at least give yourself a chance to get out by having him as a target. Teams know Rangers are always going to try to play out at they don't even bother setting up to defend that ball, the let you give it to Goldson, who will then go to Tavernier then they cut the options right side and squeeze you in. So obvious, Celtic did it all night but I don't remember once you trying to just go beyond the first press.

Not having that, Lubo was playing against a better team and we now know was one of the best players to grace the Scottish game ever. [emoji1787] Impressive Old Firm debut all the same. Mentioned you earlier, in that you took it well when most of us thought in August Ange wouldn't see Xmas (you included at times!). Don't think you could have dreamed that Celtic would comfortably be the best team in Glasgow by February, but bet you're delighted by it.

I thin the performances were showing plenty of warning signs as he was still winning games, the results are now just catching up with those warning signs. How many of those wins did they actually play well?

Going to pick you up on this one. His run then reverse into Abada for the second goal was superb. Without it, no goal. Looks easy, but Abada is so close he has to be perfect there, less than a minute after Aribo messed up a far simpler pass. And his movement to continuously move to the Rangers left and concise the hell out of/make a 2 on 1 v Barasic largely led to Barasic being hooked for looking like he'd never played football before. [emoji846] Taylor, agreed. Very good game tonight. Defo deserves more credit than he gets. Both Celtic fullbacks were excellent tonight.

Ignoring the issue you have with the words "behind closed doors", you surely must be a bit concerned by the number of your players who clearly do look like they lack the character to play consistently to the same level that did in empty stadia when in front of fans. Tavernier, Goldson, Barasic, Kamara, Kent, Roofe, Aribo all look a shadow of themselves from last season and have done for a while. Or rather, last season, with no fans, they looked well above their previous levels, which they're back to now with the fans in. Anyway, on Celtic, very impressive again. Have watched them a few times recently and IMO they're comfortably better than Rangers, which I said before tonight. Good brand of football, great movement, great rotations/fluidity and play at a real tempo going forward and when pressing. Once they figure out how to get that through 75-90 minutes instead of 60 they'll be untouchable. Rangers on the other hand are heavy in reverse. Hear a lot of Rangers fans talking about a game of two halves and Rangers were better second half. Never had a shot inside the box and Celtic had already won the game. Who cares for good Jack was, Celtic had the slippers on in cruise control.

GVB looks a bit rattled here does he not.

Ah, fair point well made. [emoji106]

There are a good few of that Rangers team don't look like they want to be there and a bunch of others nowhere near good enough to be. Seems Gerard left a hand grenade of "his boys" when he left.

Who? Hearts?