xj2011

they quite clearly shot their load on the big game at hampden

They just want us to brush it all under the carpet though, not talk about it anymore, not have our opinions, because for one reason, the whole thing is one massive and undeniable stain on their history (broken or unbroken), and one that will be pointed and laughed at for years to come. They should probably take note though, that it was partly down this very same sweep under the carpet mind-set that got their clumpany into this sorry mess in the first place.

finally a bear who admits the horrendous error in the claim... well, sort of admits it Back on topic, and what was mentioned earlier by the Thistle supporter (apologies for forgetting your alias and I can't be arsed scrolling back), I too have never once viewed my club to be owned by a separate company. When Save the 'Ton was a thing back in the late 90's, we wouldn't probably have fought so hard to raise funds if we just knew we could simply let our chairman at the time run us into the ground, and start all over again in division 3. Even if that was an offer on the table, it would have been a bit too easy, and I am sure we would have rather continued trying to save our club (by raising funds for it), to not only salvage our history and identity, but also retain some dignity. Something which many Rangers people seem incapable of understanding

The = definite article Here is a wee link to help you: http://learnenglish.britishcouncil.org/en/english-grammar/determiners-and-quantifiers/definite-article You really could do with learning the Queen's English before you type it on a message board

fair enough, and thanks for the comparatively adult discussion (fellow bears take note) As for me, I'm off to my scratcher to dream of a fairer world

that is simply not true, I would be raging if it was Celtic or any other team also The level of debt CW racked up in his short time in charge was more than any other non OF club in Scotland could ever dream of though, and seemed like wilful suicide. I'm also disgusted that other commercial companies do it too, but I just don't get to hear about them doing it. Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it is right either. I hate how big companies in London avoid tax etc. because at the end of the day if they are not paying tax, then it means you and I are covering their deficit. I'm glad you agree their actions were contemptible though, but don't you realise that you are now reaping the benefits from their doomed regime?

fair enough, if that is what you want to believe, but I am sure the blatant non payment of tax under CW just pushed the HMRC over the edge. Was almost daring them to pull the plug, which the eventually did. DM surely knew about CW before he sold the club for a quid, and the whole thing stinks of a set up And I wouldn't be too sure about your current people who have the club's best interests at heart either, as why on earth would any of them got involved with Mike Ashley in the first place? Certainly they are better than CW etc, but I would keep an eye on them if I were you.

fair enough, you personally don't hold the queen in high regard, but a lot of your fellow bears surely do Look, if Rangers was really just another everyday company (if that is how you want us to view you) that ran up a £20M HMRC bill, went bust, and yet started trading again a few weeks later, as the same company with the same name, yet all of a sudden were absolved of their debts, I wouldn't be happy about it either. This is nothing personal about my dislike for your football team, this is just basic morality.

i didn't "duck" any question. if you gave me a minute to reply you'd see I already have

my honest answer is no why? because they at least tried to pay off their debts, albeit at a reduced rate. Admin can happen to anyone at anytime and for a number of reasons. It happened to my own club, due to an idiot chairman who tried his best to do a CW on us. But our fans rallied and saved our club. We regret not being able to pay all of our creditors fully, but we did what we could under the circumstances. What your club did under CW was suicidal, blatantly manufactured to achieve the outcome desired, lining the pockets of those involved, whilst knowing fine well the legal way around it was to start a new company and transfer the assets, which they eventually did. Utterly contemptible unethical behaviour I am sure you will agree. Proving it in a court of law might be another matter.

and yet they still wonder why we hold them in such contempt? enjoy supporting your faux rangers, we will always know the truth

so what about all the debt you owe the queen?

Genuine question. If Celtic did what your club did, in the exact same way, would you be so accepting of it? It might be legal, but is it ethical?

I also agree with this, it is obvious, we all know rangers will be back in the premier, singing from their old song book, as if nothing ever happened, apart from having an even bigger chip on their shoulder than before. But the question remains, should they be let off the hook so easily? This is pretty much where my interest lies with the whole thing, and I find the arguments, and potential implications intriguing. I presume, the big tax case aside, there are still question marks over the legal and ethical transfer of assets from the defunct company to a new company that has basically the same name, and operates in the same way as the old one? So my questions are, is there any possibility that the courts could decide that sevco/newco need to pay up for their other bills, for example the £20M or so tax bill that was ignored by CW? How about the list of smaller creditors? It also appears that CW and CG worked together to run the old club, sorry company, into the ground in order to start again, debt free. (not to mention then having the audacity to try and continue playing in the SPL after all of that, haha!). Is that takeover, and all its shadiness, still being investigated? I have not been following the court cases, so I genuinely don't know where we are at with them.

I must have missed that one. Care to quote so I can engage?

Overuse of really was a bit much I agree But, what do you mean by "disengage"? I am interested in scottish football, and the rangers story of decline and deceit is something worth looking into, at best for learnings sake, at worst for having a good old chuckle. the constant ignorance/deflection from your fellow supporters just adds to the intrigue tbh

well, that was simply stating a fact. In my time here the vast majority of Rangers fans have been avoiding talking about anything remotely negative surrounding their club/company. I admire your input, I really do, but really, your team's fans in general are a joke, and everyone knows it. p.s: celtic too before you jump to any conclusions about my sympathies

a decent and honest response, and one your fellow bears could do with imitating I assume the ridicule sometimes comes (in my case anyway) because many of your fellow fans are seemingly unable to hold a decent conversation, especially one that requires self examination of your club's current plight.

I have realised that trying to find meaningful answers from Rangers fans is a useless exercise. Either they ignore, deflect, accuse, retaliate to, slander, or simply 'walk away' from difficult questions, much in the same style as they always have. what a dreary and pitiful mob

...and shouldn't that CURRENT regime be taking on the financial responsibilities of the old regime?

more evidence of not giving a f**k about his own club/company

fair enough

sounds like a David Murray thing to say

Regardless of that story, what an absolutely farcical establishment, from top to bottom they are. A laughing stock for Scotland and the wider world (if they indeed chose) to behold. The men in charge do not have the common Rangers fan in their heart, and that is a fact that the brainwashed masses will simply fail to accept. As a result, from their super loyal fan base, there has been not one iota of dignity nor contrition for their past mistakes, nor any sign that they are willing to investigate or ask questions of their currently doomed regime either. They deserve all that is coming to them. For shame

If I recall he said that at their AGM last year... but on what basis could he make such a claim? And don't tell me, the zombies lapped it all up, without question, just like the good loyal dogs that they are?