Dev
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Posts posted by Dev
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3 hours ago, Dylangt7 said:
Hard to assess the rights or wrongs of the vote without knowing the details of both applications.
If St Pats aim to apply again, would hope they maybe share some of the vision and aims for the future. With ground sharing with existing league clubs in the area ruled out (DFC already sharing and the pitch being a LT issue and presumably The Vale not wanting to ruin one of the best pitches in the West) their options were obviously limited. My only guess was that they would try to copy what Drumchapel have done with the Donald Dewar at OLSP High School. Basically just another cage with mesh to restrict outside viewing..longer term there really is no other solution.
The other missing piece of the infrastructure missing was likely the pathway, with only the 1st and 2nd teams at adult ages. I recall Dumbarton Academy FPs trying to run U21s and 19s for a while but cant remember St Pats ever trying it. I presume that would have been part of the plan for a U20s at least. But the area is already saturated with teams at all levels, even taking over an existing team would have its challenges. (see the stupid discussion on here regarding assumptions of religion etc.)
Funnily enough there are more than a few Dumbarton based boys and coaches involved in Knightswood's teams at various levels so they would be competing with them as well as existing Dumbarton, Vale, Clydebank and Yoker youth teams.
I hope they apply again as its a club with a fantastic history in a hotbed of football. Although ideally from a personal perspective I'd prefer a Dumbarton "United" team in the WOSFL.
It has been previously posted that St Pats are moving to the new Athletics facility in Dumbarton so they should be OK by next year at that ground.
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Maybe there's a compromise? Issue an "interim" set of figures with no figure in for the missing match or put in an average figure for the club. Make it clear what it is and then issue the finished list whenever that is ready.
It takes a lot of effort and perseverance to do what has been done throughout the divisions covered. Shame that the leagues in the pyramid don't do this anyway.
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1 hour ago, Arthurlie1981 said:
Members were told at the AGM that the club felt it was better to hold an EGM where this is the only item for discussion as it would, rightful, generate a lot of discussion which might have been curtailed at the AGM. As someone who was involved in 3 previous discussions looking at moving ground, I am sceptical when it comes to East Renfrewshire and their motives but will see what is being said this time.
If this has not been done already, the first thing that the club MUST do is to get an independent valuation of Dunterlie carried out by a Chartered Surveyor who specialises in assessing the development potential and values of sites in Glasgow. Only then can the Council's proposal be judged on its' merits. In any case there is no need to lose the freehold of the new location as part of any deal. That's the Council trying it on as it makes little difference to the current value of that site and does not need to be part of any deal.
The club needs to be able to compare the value of Dunterlie with the value of the new site with all works completed (if the Council are doing the works as as part of any deal. Who is to carry out the works and bear the costs of planning, design, supervision, etc etc?
In any case no relocation until the new site is finished and complies with all requirements and is signed off as completed.
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6 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:
Right now there's room for 7 teams (16-16-16-18) without perhaps thinking outside the box. That's years of room to work with and the EoS has shown itself to be more than capable to accomodate numbers with non-traditional formats.
This isn't the WoSFL where they've kicked around the idea of capping numbers.
I hope that you turn out to be right. The EoS's conferences idea was good. It should be considered by other leagues e.g. SPFL with Divisions 1 and 2 merged and enlarged into two parallel conferences with clubs re-allocated annually in order to freshen things up.
You shouldn't overlook the fact that the WoS did wish to regionalise the lowest tier of its' league but that was stopped by the SFA. Quell surprise!
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Weren't St Pats moving into the new athletics facility at Dumbarton? Maybe that won't be 100% ready or suitable just yet and that caused an issue with some voting clubs?
If that's the issue then maybe next time around that will be out of the way and there will also be space in the WoS for them i.e. with eventually the Champions getting promoted to the LL and no west clubs coming down at the same time.
Let's hope they get in next time.
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9 hours ago, FairWeatherFan said:
Not really something that's upto them. Lowland still favours EoS area teams might see additions coming top down. Everything else is dependent on applications. As seen with Linton Hotspur getting in, meet the criteria it should be a formality.
Plenty of suggestions will no doubt be thrown out there over the next year. All the usual suspects to make an appearace: Cupar Hearts, all the Borders towns with former EoS sides, as well new kid on the block Tullibody St Serfs.
A Livingston club (not named) was on here a while ago making general enquiries about what would be involved in stepping up at some time ahead. Then from the Lothian & Edinburgh Amateurs there's Kirkliston South Queensferry who also showed future potential interest.
(Depending on what, if anything, comes of a conference league) There must be a chance that the balance of power in the Lowland League will change quickly and the relegation/promotion situation with Tier 6 meaningfully altered. The window of opportunity to move up into the EoS could closed or be more difficult to get through soon, so Linton Hotspur's move could be very good timing, indeed.
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Glensmad was right. He said Glenafton, Creetown and ........ Carluke Rovers, so there's still a licenced club in the Fourth Division, after Threave Rovers' promotion. Good luck to them. Lots of hard work and commitment rewarded. SFA Cup this coming season. Hope they get a home draw.
Rovers to play in the senior Scottish Cup We are delighted to announce to our supporters that the Scottish FA have approved Carluke Rovers as a member club, having met their licence requirements. Full Story at http://carlukerovers.co.uk/rovers-to-play-in-the-senior-scottish-cup/…Tweet
On Tuesday 6th June at the SFA Agm at Hampden , Garry Simpson, Carluke Rovers match secretary accepted the SFA Licence Certificate from Michael Mulraney the SFA Chairman on behalf of Carluke Rovers Fc.3 -
18 hours ago, Jan Vojáček said:
I think everyone already knows anyway, but just to confirm that St Patrick's FPs have applied to be in the Fourth Division next season.
EXCLUSIVE: Dumbarton's St Patrick's FPs apply to join West of Scotland League
Earlier in this(?) thread there was mention of Knightswood FC having applied too. Haven't check with their web-site or facebook but there are links on the net.
www.facebook.com/knightswoodfootballclub/?locale=en_GB
www.knightswoodfootballclub.com
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21 minutes ago, Blue Brazil Forever said:
Fixed it for you.
Why is it that Cowdenbeath seem to think that it's them against the world? Or is it just a few posters on P&B who are out of touch with the club that they seem to support?
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2 minutes ago, CambieBud said:
According to BBC website:
Maxwell said “ We wanted it to be overwhelmingly supported. From a board perspective, we didn’t want it to go through 51-49. We need to reflect on what’s happened and understand the best way to take that forward and make sure that the next proposal that comes is supported overwhelmingly across the game.”
so it ain’t going away
That depends on just what is tried next. maybe with a new man at the top he will see an opportunity to come up with a decent restructuring proposal. Can only hope! However, more of the same is only going to cause more embarrassment for the clique that currently controls matters and could lead to bigger changes at the top.
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16 minutes ago, Burnieman said:
Not really. The Conference proposal would never have happened had the SPFL agreed that the other two options ie expansion of L2 or a new L3, were a goer. They weren't. The SPFL instead indicated that an independent Conference would be supported and they agreed to administer it, new company set-up etc. If anything, the SPFL encouraged the SFA/Maxwell to continue down the Conference route as they would have thought the SPFL clubs would back it without too much fuss, and it kept B teams away from the SPFL in the meantime.
The non-league clubs were the ones that were a certainly to vehemently oppose the Conference and started making the fuss from the outset along with their fans/followers of the non league game [inc the twitter account and petition], that then caught on with fans of SPFL clubs once they understood what was going on, and the momentum gathered pace to the point where the media took more than just a passing interest. It made SPFL clubs sit up and take notice once their fans started making a noise.
If at the outset non-league clubs had said nothing, sat back and accepted it was a "done deal", we'd have a Conference League today.
That is it in a nutshell.
Now the SPFL clubs supporters need to be activated to sort out the promotion/relegation mess between the league and the LL/HL.
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15 hours ago, Burnieman said:
Many new members are being denied a vote purely to maintain a balance in favour of SPFL clubs, that's frankly corrupt, but it's the SFA here. There were a number of resolutions tabled today which underlined & solidified that denial of voting rights.
The SFA are not interested in devising a fair, weighted system where every club (not the Pupils though as they are not SFA members) has a vote, and after being humiliated with the Conference proposal they're not exactly going to rush to restore voting rights for everyone.
I would be more inclined to expect that they will seek to remove "granfathered" rights from members below tier 5 eg. Hawick, Coldstream, Golspie etc.
It just need one more foul-up by the SFA for radical changes to happen and to be brought about by those clubs which already have a significant block of votes i.e. the majority of SPFL clubs who are unhappy about the sFA being run by a tiny minority of vested interests.
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15 hours ago, virginton said:
1) Some members quite clearly are more equal than nonsense outfits like Broomhill who have slithered into the pyramid.
2) There is a clear distinction in interests between football clubs that are run primarily as a business - a (supposedly) professional, commercial operation and those that are not. That's not to say the latter shouldn't have a voice - they absolutely should - but the idea that the voice of Campbeltown Pupils is just as relevant to decisions that might decide how millions of pounds of money is divvied up to a club in the professional ranks runs against reality.
It is important to remember that the SFA is there to serve ALL clubs. It isn't just about the few who shout loudest.
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From the Lowland League “National Conference League” thread:
Highland ITFC – 7th June, 2023
It also involves clubs having a policy of giving younger players the opportunity to play First Team football. You can look at football at all levels & will see some clubs / managers that relish the chance to give young players the opportunity to progress, & equally you'll see as many, if not more, that will always prefer to rely on 'experience'. There is of course a place for that as well, but more clubs using more younger players - & not just as lip service by having them in the squad / warming the bench - has to have a place in a strategic approach to player development across the game in Scotland.
Dev
This all goes back to the decision to have small divisions of just 10 or 12 clubs each. This may make for a situation where "every match counts" BUT in say 16 club divisions there will be more matches where coaches/managers will feel more comfortable fielding young and up and coming players. This is simply because there is less pressure, fear of relegation or fighting for promotion. The same principle applies to the concept of having play-offs as these could affect virtually every club in each division - so heightening the risks associated with fielding less experienced players.
Small divisions with play-offs may be more exciting but it's turning down the tap which controls the flow of talent. It is little surprise, therefore, that the national age group teams get less successful as they get older. One thing leads to another!
Another benefit of larger divisions is that there is more Diversity. More clubs playing in various differing styles with more and different types of players. There's also more opportunity for Scottish-qualified players and coaches/managers to operate at a higher level within the SPFL set-up.
At the end of the day the same clubs will be at the top of the Premier Division so what is there to fear for them from bringing in such improvements?
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52 minutes ago, Highland ITFC said:
It also involves clubs having a policy of giving younger players the opportunity to play First Team football. You can look at football at all levels & will see some clubs / managers that relish the chance to give young players the opportunity to progress, & equally you'll see as many, if not more, that will always prefer to rely on 'experience'. There is of course a place for that aswell, but more clubs using more younger players - & not just as lip service by having them in the squad / warming the bench - has to have a place in a strategic approach to player development across the game in Scotland.
This all goes back to the decision to have small divisions of just 10 or 12 clubs each. This may make for a situation where "every match counts" BUT in say 16 club divisions there will be more matches where coaches/managers will feel more comfortable fielding young and up and coming players. This is simply because there is less pressure, fear of relegation or fighting for promotion. The same principle applies to the concept of having play-offs as these could affect virtually every club in each division - so heightening the risks associated with fielding less experienced players.
Small divisions with play-offs may be more exciting but it's turning down the tap which controls the flow of talent. It is little surprise, therefore, that the national age group teams get less successful as they get older. One thing leads to another!
Another benefit of larger divisions is that there is more Diversity. More clubs playing in various differing styles with more and different types of players. There's also more opportunity for Scottish-qualified players and coaches/managers to operate at a higher level within the SPFL set-up.
At the end of the day the same clubs will be at the top of the Premier Division so what is there to fear for them from bringing in such improvements?
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According to a West of Scotland League thread on club licencing we should be sending congratulations to Creetown FC for gaining their licence. Good news. Hopefully the club will be making a statement before long.
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2 hours ago, Burnieman said:
Is it beyond the ken to have all tier 5 and 6 leagues, the SPFL, and the SFA round the table, along with two or three clubs from each league as well as the league reps themselves, along with that dreaded word "consultants" to lead it, and actually find a constructive way forward.
Have a number of sessions over the course of the next 6 months, even bring in fans groups to speak at it, and find common ground on promotion/relegation, on B/Reserves, league size, licencing, voting rights, the whole shebang, and work from there.
No topic off the table.
If the SFA were serious about consultation and engagement, be open about it and involve as many voices as they can. We can have Mulraney sticking Post-Its to the ideas wall, Maxwell serving the coffee, Doncaster wibbling in the corner.
Sky would be interested.
Sounds like an idea for a d.mn funny TV comedy series. Who would be chosen to play the main roles? i.e. the OF, Maxwell, etc. There must be stacks of comedians who could play parts from the audience of clubs, fans, etc present. Just imagine the One-Liners!
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5 hours ago, ICTChris said:
The magnitude of this can't be understated. This will kill many people, people are likely dying now. It will destroy the environment in the area. It will destroy wildlife in this area. It will destroy agricultural land, impacting world food supply. The deliberate destruction of dams is named specifically as a war crime in the Geneva Convention.
We are also seeing some Russian soldiers making videos boasting blowing up the dam - this is similar to after they shot down MH17, loads of Russian boasting that was then shut down when they realised that they'd made a major f**k up. The men behind the MH17 haven't been brought to justice yet, this is orders of magnitude worse.
According to Ukraine Pravda the dam was "allowed" to fill to unprecedented high levels before being destroyed so as to cause maximum destruction i.e. used as a tool of War.
The Dam also provided cooling water to the Zaporizhzhia Nuclear Plant, about the largest there is. That is the next immediate issue.
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What Russia cannot have it destroys. There's a long track record for such manic behaviour.
Ukraine will go straight through to the Sea of Azov - access between Melitopol and Mariupol is already dangerous for the invaders. Maybe that was the trigger. Russia smelled the coffee and decided to sacrifice every gain that they had made west of Donetsk Oblast. Crimea is a sitting duck as is what remains of Kherson "under its control."
The gloves are off. Russia is in real trouble. Some of its' own territory will now be lost and used as a bargaining tool by the Ukraine to regain the remainder of the invaded land. There'll also be a military free zone around Ukraine against Russia. Belarus will go too.
Admittedly I hope that the worst happens to Russia, in any case, due to their invasions but this terrorist controlled nation needs to be dealt with or else the same will happen again somewhere in the future and that's only a question of where and when and how bad it is. Whenever that happens lots of innocent people will be lost or permanently damaged and this must be prevented now. It will get truly nasty in the meantime if Russia is to be sorted out (if it can be?).
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18 minutes ago, Blue Brazil Forever said:
Please please no. The Scottish Government are notoriously anti Scottish Football.
It's Ok. It's the UK Government which is bringing in regulation/a regulator to the English Football scene. It can do the same elsewhere too if needs be. That would take to parochialism out of the matter.
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1 hour ago, approximately dave said:
Just over 10 years ago it was a return to a 10 team top flight.
I'm also sure they would love to have a breakaway top flight back again.
The OF priority is not the national team it is the OF. Plain and simple.
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2 hours ago, ICTChris said:
B teams are one of these zombie ideas that are constant talking points. They will never go away.
Other zombie ideas in Scottish football are:
Summer football
16 team top flight
Old Firm going to England / some sort of British cup
16 team top division would increase the numbers of teenagers/ early 20's getting experience in the division.
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3 hours ago, HorseyGhirl said:
Here's a novel idea why don't they start a cross-league discussion group that meets at regular intervals. They can talk openly about the future of the pyramid, encourage suggestions from across the system and put forward proposals to the Board which can then be voted on by the members.
What could we call it?
Keep it simple I suppose;
Pyramid Working Group
PWG.
Good idea but not organised by the current SFA top people. Not called PWG as that has too many bad things associated with it.
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3 hours ago, Bestsinceslicebread said:
Think we are all in agreement about that.
The thing is, Maxwell is that much out of his depth he thought that it would be a quick turnover and shows you just not him. Brora Rangers director David Dowling was part of the SFA team who created the plans and didn't even realize his own fans would go against it. There will be a lot of underhanded stuff going on to get many onside and committee men and women, Chairmen and fans must realize that all the time this was being discussed and debated by fans, on here, twitter, facebook etc, the SFA were not sitting on their ass they were doing their best to get others onside.It is wrong, out of date, it holds no water and would have and will be a failure if implemented. The only best way, is a reserve league and the experience these lads will gain playing against first team players coming back from injury or needing match fitness is immeasurable
Needs to go further. Increase the size of the Premier Division to 16 so more lads get the opportunity to gain experience at the highest level available in Scotland. If they are to play for Scotland they will be good enough, as teenagers/early 20's, to deal with this. The less talented lads will need to come through e.g. via a Reserves league.
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New clubs in the West of Scotland
in West of Scotland Football League
Posted
Indeed but the facility was needing to be finished not long ago, having been subject to long, expensive, delays. Having said that it isn't as much fun as banging on about perceived grievances!
Nevertheless, unless there is an 80 club limit in the WoS rules St Pats should have been allowed in [a] because they did meet the criteria and the league is partly there to foster football at the level its' at in the region. Surely one or two extra clubs could have been shoe-horned in i.e. with mid-week matches already being lined up for the first part of the season in order to ease late season fixture pile-ups.