DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Bantabairn said: Another churlish, childless and non factual remark from another football expert, the recent SFA fans survey seen a huge percentage vote for change/reconstruction within our game. Naive/stupid ? Your from Dunfermline matey No, nothing churlish, childish or non factual about what I said. That's you trying to discredit the poster to discredit the debate, as you don't want debate, shown clearly by your childish and churlish 'football expert' remark. You just want to vent and want a total echo chamber of concurrence. Fans want change, I never said otherwise. But I pointed out that change, real changes that would make a difference, won't happen through altering the league structure. You've completely ignored that point for some reason. Incidentally, do you have a link to this survey? I'd be interested in reading it. Yes, massively naive and/or stupid if you genuinely think that Deans is wanting reconstruction 'for the good of Scottish football' and not just to get Falkirk promoted. You must think the timing of his comments to just be a total coincidence. As to your last part, I'm not from Dunfermline and have never lived there, but what is the relevance? Edited July 7, 2020 by DA Baracus 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumswall Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 Reconstruction wouldn't have had us in the complete shambles we're in just now for a start.No it would have kicked the can down the road for us to deal with at a later date. The proposals were temporary were they not? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Ecosse83 Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 21 minutes ago, grumswall said: 1 hour ago, Shadwell Dog said: Reconstruction wouldn't have had us in the complete shambles we're in just now for a start. No it would have kicked the can down the road for us to deal with at a later date. The proposals were temporary were they not? No! Stop making excuses. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 31 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: No, nothing churlish, childish or non factual about what I said. That's you trying to discredit the poster to discredit the debate, as you don't want debate, shown clearly by your childish and churlish 'football expert' remark. You just want to vent and want a total echo chamber of concurrence. Fans want change, I never said otherwise. But I pointed out that change, real changes that would make a difference, won't happen through altering the league structure. You've completely ignored that point for some reason. Incidentally, do you have a link to this survey? I'd be interested in reading it. Yes, massively naive and/or stupid if you genuinely think that Deans is wanting reconstruction 'for the good of Scottish football' and not just to get Falkirk promoted. You must think the timing of his comments to just be a total coincidence. As to your last part, I'm not from Dunfermline and have never lived there, but what is the relevance? We've been backing reconstruction for years now its not just a recent thing. This was a chance to get a bigger tip flight but it'll now disappear off the agenda for another good while. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AL-FFC Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 29 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: No, nothing churlish, childish or non factual about what I said. That's you trying to discredit the poster to discredit the debate, as you don't want debate, shown clearly by your childish and churlish 'football expert' remark. You just want to vent and want a total echo chamber of concurrence. Fans want change, I never said otherwise. But I pointed out that change, real changes that would make a difference, won't happen through altering the league structure. You've completely ignored that point for some reason. Incidentally, do you have a link to this survey? I'd be interested in reading it. Yes, massively naive and/or stupid if you genuinely think that Deans is wanting reconstruction 'for the good of Scottish football' and not just to get Falkirk promoted. You must think the timing of his comments to just be a total coincidence. As to your last part, I'm not from Dunfermline and have never lived there, but what is the relevance? The intimidation/bullying part wasnt debunked though except for a statement from Doncaster saying there was no bullying. Its pretty much the same on them doing the internal audit and them finding there was nothing wrong with the voting process (like there was ever going to be any other finding). 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Shadwell Dog said: We've been backing reconstruction for years now its not just a recent thing. This was a chance to get a bigger tip flight but it'll now disappear off the agenda for another good while. How does a bigger top league help Scottish football in general? What good is that to Annan or to Brechin or Clyde etc? Shuffling the league set ups doesn't address the real issues (inequality of finance being the most prominent). 6 minutes ago, AL-FFC said: The intimidation/bullying part wasnt debunked though except for a statement from Doncaster saying there was no bullying. Its pretty much the same on them doing the internal audit and them finding there was nothing wrong with the voting process (like there was ever going to be any other finding). More than one Championship chairman said the bullying claims were pish. The SPFL didn't do an internal audit. An outside company did that. The documents will be poured over by Hearts and Partick for the arbitration, so we'll see what comes of that. At worst I think we'll see incompetence. I very much doubt we'll see corruption and intimidation. The nonsense conspiracies against certain teams will be shown to be just that; nonsense. No such devious plots exist. Edited July 7, 2020 by DA Baracus 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AL-FFC Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 1 minute ago, DA Baracus said: How does a bigger top league help Scottish football in general? What good is that to Annan or to Brechin or Clyde etc? Shuffling the league set ups doesn't address the real issues (inequality of finance being the most prominent). More than one Championship chairman said the bullying claims were pish. The SPFL didn't do an internal audit. An outside company did that. and more than one SPFL chairman said there was funnily enough the other chairman that said the bullying claims were pish were your own as he had been accused of being one of them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumswall Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 No! Stop making excuses. Wasn't making any excuses. It was a question hence the question mark... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
roman_bairn Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 Be very careful any more than 10 minutes can cause severe retina burns and cognitive impairment.Can only assume the Morton posters spend a lot of time there too?..... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 25 minutes ago, AL-FFC said: and more than one SPFL chairman said there was funnily enough the other chairman that said the bullying claims were pish were your own as he had been accused of being one of them. No, one person, Scott Gardiner, said that. He has been proven to be a liar. What could big bad Ross McArthur 'bully' another club with anyway?! What sort of power do you think he has?! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 27 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: How does a bigger top league help Scottish football in general? What good is that to Annan or to Brechin or Clyde etc? Shuffling the league set ups doesn't address the real issues (inequality of finance being the most prominent). More than one Championship chairman said the bullying claims were pish. The SPFL didn't do an internal audit. An outside company did that. The documents will be poured over by Hearts and Partick for the arbitration, so we'll see what comes of that. At worst I think we'll see incompetence. I very much doubt we'll see corruption and intimidation. The nonsense conspiracies against certain teams will be shown to be just that; nonsense. No such devious plots Something happened with dundee. They didn't suddenly change their mind without getting something in return. They were as there statement showed dead against it only to suddenly be for it. They've been promised something and hopefully that will come out in the wash but I won't hold my breath. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 Just now, Shadwell Dog said: Something happened with dundee. They didn't suddenly change their mind without getting something in return. They were as there statement showed dead against it only to suddenly be for it. They've been promised something and hopefully that will come out in the wash but I won't hold my breath. What have they been promised, and by who? Paranoid nonsense. Bear in mind that they're now experiencing financial difficulties. If they'd been promised something then surely they would have avoided that or had help with it. Also why couldn't they have just changed their mind? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 6 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: What have they been promised, and by who? Paranoid nonsense. Bear in mind that they're now experiencing financial difficulties. If they'd been promised something then surely they would have avoided that or had help with it. Also why couldn't they have just changed their mind? Come on they were that against it they put out a statement saying how they couldn't vote yes (https://dundeefc.co.uk/news/club-statement-24/) then suddenly they changed their mind. Different if they had been humming on hawing about it. As dundee admitted they held off their vote to get leverage so that being the case its common sense not paranoid nonsense that says they were given some kind of assurance on something or promised something so that they changed their mind. Edited July 7, 2020 by Shadwell Dog 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, Shadwell Dog said: Come on they were that against it they put out a statement saying how they couldn't vote yes and then suddenly they changed their mind. Different if they had been humming on hawing about it. As dundee admitted they held off their vote to get leverage so that being the case its common sense not paranoid nonsense that says they were given some kind of assurance on something or promised something so that they changed their mind. What though? What were they promised, and by who? The SPFL? What do they have to give to Dundee, and why would they care how Dundee voted? If Dundee could be so easily 'bought' then why didn't Hearts do it? Edited July 7, 2020 by DA Baracus 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 (edited) 2 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: What though? What were they promised, and by who? The SPFL? What do they have to give to Dundee, and why would they care how Dundee voted? If Dundee could be so easily 'bought' then why didn't Hearts do it? As I said hopefully it will all come out in the wash but I'm not overly confident. Anyone who thinks dundee changed their minds out of the goodness of their hearts is in cloud cuckoo land if you ask me. Edited July 7, 2020 by Shadwell Dog 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 Just now, Shadwell Dog said: As I said hopefully it will all come out in the wash but I'm not overly confident. Why not? If there's some incriminating evidence then it will have been turned over as part of the arbitration process. Unless you think this is somehow all a huge conspiracy that goes up to the legal system? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 6 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: Why not? If there's some incriminating evidence then it will have been turned over as part of the arbitration process. Unless you think this is somehow all a huge conspiracy that goes up to the legal system? This is an organisation that couldn't run a simple vote of 42 teams without making a complete arse of it. Why would anyone think that they will have documented everything properly and its been filed correctly ffs. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 7 minutes ago, Bantabairn said: Are you really serious, you find the situation with Dundee’s vote unconcerning. Something went seriously wrong and I suspect we will never find out. Dundee’s perilous financial situation is another example of living beyond ones needs, ( how many times on past 15 years ?) and a loyal support totally fcked off with their owners. Not really. I think they probably just changed their mind. There's a possibility that it's otherwise, but I can't see who would have bought their vote and for what. Why do you think we will never find out? As noted, the documents etc have been available. That will surely reveal anything dodgy. Or is that if nothing is found it actually suits your argument because it then fits in to the conspiracy theory? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DA Baracus Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 1 minute ago, Shadwell Dog said: This is an organisation that couldn't run a simple vote of 42 teams without making a complete arse of it. Why would anyone think that they will have documented everything properly and its been filed correctly ffs. They ran multiple votes that went fine. If the Dundee vote was simply a case of a changed mind then that was mostly fine save for the stuff with the quarantine email. The documents will mostly be online, and will be things like email communication. It can all be looked through. Also seems to me that they keep their files perfectly fine, unless you can give multiple examples otherwise (not including them not finding the Dundee email vote until later). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shadwell Dog Posted July 7, 2020 Share Posted July 7, 2020 5 minutes ago, DA Baracus said: They ran multiple votes that went fine. If the Dundee vote was simply a case of a changed mind then that was mostly fine save for the stuff with the quarantine email. The documents will mostly be online, and will be things like email communication. It can all be looked through. Also seems to me that they keep their files perfectly fine, unless you can give multiple examples otherwise (not including them not finding the Dundee email vote until later). Aye after they had fixed the feckups of the first vote. Total shambles. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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