Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[wunfellaff]

It doesn't say in the link posted - they 'look" like figures posted earlier in the thread though !

Just remembered - he was a St Johnstone fan !

Well done for not clicking on it though, you're super !

The link was from someone taking it on from the St J's fans figures - http://saintinasia.wordpress.com/2012/08/09/how-are-sevco-affording-sandaza/

Personally I think there will be more concessions and child tickets.

[wunfellaff]

Now I have no idea which team this blogger supports and I don't care but here is another wee insight to the dodgyness of their applications of EBTs, to people not 'employees'.

So I was doing a study on the EBT'ers or the Tax dodging b*****ds as I like to call them when I happened to stumble across some information that took me by surprise.

First of all we must understand the difference between being Employed by (a football club) and being Loaned to (a football club) are two totally different things.

Employment is a contract between two parties, one being the Employer and the other being the Employee.

In football the Employer is the Parent club which means the club who holds the players full contract registration.

A loaned player is one who is Employed by a football club and his services are Loaned to another club. This club becomes the Loaning club not the Employer.

For more information please use the link below;

http://www.football-league.co.uk/regulations/20110629/section-6-players_2293633_2125731

Now lets look at Employee Benefit Trusts.

The Employer establishes the trust, making contributions of an equivalent value to the deferred remuneration and the trustees will at a later date distribute the trust funds to employees or ex-employees.

The basic idea is that the trustees can distribute the trust fund when it is tax advantageous to do so perhaps when the employee is retired or non-UK resident.

The ideal is that there is no employee tax charge until the trustees distribute benefits which may be many years after those benefits have been earned.

The tax charge may be theoretical rather than real the employee or ex-employee may have moved to a ‘low tax jurisdiction’ or ‘tax haven.’

Further information can be found on the link below;

http://www.contractoruk.com/ebt/

Now it is going to get really tricky for David Murray to explain this one.

Gregory Vignal receive £173,000 via an EBT when he wasn't an Employee of Rangers.

He was loaned from Liverpool to Rangers 2004-2005. His Employee Benefit Trust is subject to Tax and National Insurance as he wasn't an Employee of Rangers Football Club, he was an Employee of Liverpool.

Federico Nieto receive £24,500 via an EBT when he wasn't an Employee of Rangers

He was loaned from Almagro to Rangers 2005. His Employee Benefit Trust is subject to Tax and National Insurance as he wasn't an Employee of Rangers Football Club, he was an Employee of Almagro.

Both players were not contractually Employed by Rangers but received the benefits of being Employed by Rangers.

Now surely the very fact that they are called Employee Benefit Trusts should have told the powers that be at Ibrox that these players were not entitled to and could not receive payments through them as they were not Employees.

Or did they know and done it anyway.

I'm sure we will find out in time but this is a 'clear a sign' yet that Rangers knew exactly what they were doing.

They never thought they would get caught, but they did.

Then he gets fired into McLeish

Of the EBT beneficiaries list on the BBC's website Alex McLeish is responsible for signing 26 of the players on the list.

The total amount paid to these 26 players was £16,684,328

Including Big Ecks £1.7M the total paid via EBT's during his tenure is a staggering £18,384,328

http://thedemiseofrangersinpictures.blogspot.co.uk/

Well worth a perusal........

[Boghead ranter]

Haven't been on this thread for a while.

Judging by this drivel being posted, I haven't missed much.

most of my pages now predominantly show

This post is hidden because you have chosen to ignore posts by******view it anyway?

[zurcher]

There may be obsession, like there is with dead Elvis. People still go on about him, others still make money from tribute acts, others may wonder what could have been if it didn't all go wrong. He didn't leave a mountain of debt then get replaced by a lookalike pretending he was the same Elvis as far his success was concerned but a different one when it came to any liabilities. Nor, as far as I am aware, did he cheat his way to success. His legacy is one of inspiration, not debt - though, possibly, also a warning about health problems from over-consumption - too big to fail, too fat to live.

The Elvis name is exploited, as is the Ranges name. People with an emotional attachment have parted with their cash to keep the memories alive. Shame on those at Ibrox for such cynical, false hope.

This is brilliant, that's exactly what's happening here, Sevco Franchise are a Rangers Tribute Act.

[GLESGABOY]

Now I have no idea which team this blogger supports and I don't care but here is another wee insight to the dodgyness of their applications of EBTs, to people not 'employees'.

Then he gets fired into McLeish

http://thedemiseofra...blogspot.co.uk/

Well worth a perusal........

What a lot of shite. Regardless of which team the original blogger supports his understanding of employment and contract law is so far off the mark it`s frightening. Add that to his crude understanding of the EBT system and you`ve got a realllllllllllllllllllllllllly long post that means next to f**k all.It`s a joke. I think it`s called playing to the crowd.................... The so called tax experts and legal minds should stop making complete tits of themselves and wait until tribunal is concluded and secondly they should stop posting on a 3rd Div football forum...ffs....

[wunfellaff]

What a lot of shite. Regardless of which team the original blogger supports his understanding of employment and contract law is so far off the mark it`s frightening. Add that to his crude understanding of the EBT system and you`ve got a realllllllllllllllllllllllllly long post that means next to f**k all.It`s a joke. I think it`s called playing to the crowd.................... The so called tax experts and legal minds should stop making complete tits of themselves and wait until tribunal is concluded and secondly they should stop posting on a 3rd Div football forum...ffs....

So Vignal was employed by Rangers then?

Edited August 23, 2012 by wunfellaff

[HTG]

Didn't take too long before that mask slipped, did it? Plastics just can't shake that chip off the shoulder

I knew it was 'Shite and Eat' and not the lemony pup that Henrik tried to sell.

Weren't you meant to be the clever one?

What mask? You are losing the plot Bendarroch.

For the avoidance of doubt, do you think my "chip" - apparently an issue for "plastics" - is the result of my being (a) catholic (b) a celtic supporter or © both?

Since this whole episode started, I have wanted Rangers properly dealt with for their refusal to pay over the tax they had taken from their players. The finance chap confirmed there was money available to pay it. But he was instructed not to as a tactic in the wider struggle over the other tax bill and the EBTs.

It all comes back to the behaviour of the trustees and others in positions of responsibility. One man cannot act alone where a board is in place. The rest are guilty.

Rangers chose administration. It was their opt out from paying the bills every other club paid.

That sort of choice deserves a hefty boot in the balls.

What followed was a farce. But Rangers wriggled every step of the way. They were well backed by the media and those in charge of the spl and sfa. Some club chairmen made arses of themselves.

I don't have a mask or a hidden agenda (Tedi). When they went into the liquidation process their assets should have been broken up and sold for the benefit of creditors. If they wanted to start again they should have applied for central league division 2 and found themselves a place to play (follow them from the pavements). It was good enough for Clydebank and Gretna - nobody tried to shoehorn them into the spl. Livingston were booted to SFL3 and their CVA was successful - unlike yours. When a club disappears as Rangers did at the end of May, there is no process for enabling them to start again either in the top flight or half way up (SFL3). They worked their way round that and are now claiming all the good stuff but none of the bad. I

Mask? Not me. I've said all of this before along with many other posters on this thread. You don't have to agree with any of that (and you don't). I couldn't care less. But instead of simply disagreeing, you have to find a reason for why I think the way I do.

For the avoidance of any doubt, I can't stand Celtic FC. I understand your default position of labelling me as one of their supporters or having a crack at my faith (not a catholic btw). It's the last refuge of the bigoted wee scone you undoubtedly are. Unfortunately you are far from alone. .

Edited August 23, 2012 by HTG

[Bendarroch]

What mask? You are losing the plot Bendarroch.

For the avoidance of doubt, do you think my "chip" - apparently an issue for "plastics" - is the result of my being (a) catholic (b) a celtic supporter or © both?

It's the last refuge of the bigoted wee scone you undoubtedly are.

The mask that allowed you to pretend you were something other than a base hater of all things Rangers. First you started with the 'c**t' business and now, inevitably and without prompting, you want to know if it's because you are a catholic? How on earth could I possibly have known if you were or not?

There's that chip on your shoulder I was talking about right there.

I couldn't care if you are a complete rocket. Oh, wait...and this was the clever plastic

Edited August 23, 2012 by Bendarroch

[HTG]

The mask that allowed you to pretend you were something other than a base hater of all things Rangers. First you started with the 'c**t' business and now, inevitably and without prompting, you want to know if it's because you are a catholic? How on earth could I possibly have known you were or not?

There's that chip on your should I was talking about right there.

I couldn't care if you are a complete rocket. Oh, wait...and this was the clever plastic

Define "plastics".

[BinoBalls]

Green Calls For Creation of Sevcoland

UN Considers New Nation-State For Persecuted Rangers Fans

CHARLES Green last night championed a revolutionary plan to partition Scotland in two, establishing an independent nation where Rangers fans can live in harmony, free from the hurt and discrimination they have suffered in the last six months.

Proposals submitted to the UN centre around the birth of a new nation-state called Sevcoland, covering south-western Glasgow, extending down into East Renfrewshire and much of East Ayrshire.

“This will be the official homeland for all followers of Rangers,” proclaimed an enthusiastic Charles Green. “No more shall we suffer from others’ bigotry and discrimination. We’ve applied for a 600 square mile area of land to call our own.”

“Catholics aren’t allowed.”

The Chief Executive of The Rangers went on to outline the reasons for the separation, citing a long list of discriminatory activity, including:

• The vote to put Rangers newco into Division 3, even though that’s where his own fans wanted to be placed.
  
• Supporters of other clubs laughing when Rangers got liquidated.
  
• Neil Simpson’s leg-breaking tackle on Ian Durrant in 1988.
  

“Fans of other clubs need to understand that We Are The People,” said Rangers supporters spokesman John Longshanks. “When people laugh at us, it makes us feel silly, and we’re not used to that, so it’s perfectly reasonable we should lash out at everyone, threaten boycotts, and go crying to the United Nations.”

The controversial blueprint, which is expected to be heavily opposed from non-Sevco supporters, was handed in to the United Nations Secretary-General by Sandy Jardine on Friday.

Critics have expressed concerns over the new nation’s plans to evict anyone that doesn’t own a Union Jack, outlaw smiling, and appoint Lee McCulloch First Minister.

“I’ve lived in Stewarton since 1936,” protested East Ayrshire resident Margaret Innes, 83. “But last week I got a leaflet through the door informing me if I didn’t buy a season ticket for Ibrox, I would be forced to surrender my house to a family from Northern Ireland.”

“They’re going to move me to Cowdenbeath. I’m absolutely terrified.”

[Bendarroch]

When they went into the liquidation process their assets should have been broken up and sold for the benefit of creditors.

In re-reading, I noticed firstly your claim to be a non-plastic and then this.

As things stand, we are not in any liquidation process. Damn the facts. How long have you been trotting out this particular invention?

[HTG]

In re-reading, I noticed firstly your claim to be a non-plastic and then this.

As things stand, we are not in any liquidation process. Damn the facts. How long have you been trotting out this particular invention?

I'll take it from that response that you are unable to define "plastics".

[beermonkey]

Wow, so it appears a few of you have went crying to the teacher and complained about me enough to get my other account banned.

Oh dear. :lol:

Didn't a similar thing happen to that falkirk announcer when he made a wee joke ?

Who was it that complained about that ?

BTW - for the record, i don't complain about anyone on forums.

[Bendarroch]

Define "plastics".

It's a common enough epithet for supporters of 'rasellik.

[Bendarroch]

I'll take it from that response that you are unable to define "plastics".

I take it from that response you are unwilling to correct your inventions on The Rangers liquidation process and what should have happened as a result?

[wunfellaff]

"They're going to move me to Cowdenbeath. I'm absolutely terrified."

:lol:

[Bookies Love Me]

"They're going to move me to Cowdenbeath. I'm absolutely terrified."

Superb

Sorry ran out of "greenies"

[HTG]

I take it from that response you are unwilling to correct your inventions on The Rangers liquidation process and what should have happened as a result?

I have nothing to correct. If you seriously believe that HMRC have rejected the CVA with no intention to force liquidation of the old Rangers then you are deluded (but we knew that).

Portion of the statement from Rangers administrators:"We have been informed by HMRC they will not support the proposal for a Company Voluntary Arrangement at the meeting of creditors on Thursday, June 14.

"As a result of this decision, the Sale and Purchase Agreement in place with the consortium led by Charles Green will take effect and Rangers Football Club will continue within a new company structure.

"HMRC has taken the view that the public interest will be better served with the liquidation of The Rangers Football Club plc as a corporate entity. The Club will continue to operate as it has always done but within a new company structure.

"HMRC consider that the decision will enable a liquidator to instigate a wider investigation into all of the financial affairs and management of the Club in recent years and to bring to task those they believe are responsible for its collapse.

"Furthermore, HMRC believes there will be an enhanced recovery of funds for creditors by pursuing those individuals who they believe are responsible.

"The consequence of the rejection of a CVA outcome is that sanctions will be applied to the Club by UEFA and that the Club will not be able to participate in Europe for three years and the new company will need the consent of the other SPL clubs to the transfer of the share in the SPL, in order for Rangers to continue playing in the SPL.

"We would like to thank the staff and supporters at Rangers for their great determination and professionalism during a very difficult period for the club. While the club will continue to face difficulties in the short term, it will survive and continue to play at Ibrox."

Do you not have a meaning for the word "plastics" then? Is it something you heard a big boy say and thought it sounded cool. I'm intrigued to know why I might be a "plastic" when it's quite clear from my posting history on here that I can't possibly be assumed to be a Celtic supporter. I know I've said it before but I really and truly can't stick Celtic.

So if the definition isn't based on religion or which football team I support (Linlithgow Rose ... you may have noticed) what are "plastics".

Edited August 23, 2012 by HTG

[Bookies Love Me]

Anyway, Crazy Frog MUST be a wind-up merchant.

No self-respecting rangers fan would ever name themselves after a little, irritating, blue, slimy toad with no balls.

On the other hand, if the cap fits etc.

Never thought I'd be able to use the phrase self-respecting and rangers fan in the same sentence.

Dead clever me, perfect use of an oxymoron I've managed in a long time.

[CityDave]

Do you people honestly believe anything you don't agree with is written/said by a Celtic sympathiser?

Pretty sad really.

Its a RM default reply.

Also deflects and is meant to distract the other poster away from the original discussion point so the accuser doesn't have to answer the 'difficult' question or just doesn't agree with a post because it criticises someone or something about Rangers.

I wouldn't get bothered by it, all it means on this forum is that the poster and its is one of the Rangers newbees who says that is struggling for an answer and uses that default in the hope that those of similar mind will come up with a clever retort or answer the question directly but rarely do they do that and it kind of leaves that Rangers newbee hanging out to dry.

Its laughable and tedious at the same time because on this forum that Rangers newbee is not really defending his/her position very well which might not be called into question over on RM.