Big Rangers Administration/Liquidation Thread - All chat here!

[hellbhoy]

I wasn't suggesting that Newco was straightforwards for Green for the reasons you suggest (and because players can walk away). Far from it. Where I was going with the above was that CVA is almost assured so that route is unlikely if H&D have indeed contracted with him on those terms [since HMRC would be in the public eye for making people redundant for no visible benefit]

In other words, Green may haver his easy preferred passage in the bag.

So in essence then the TAXMAN are going to give the Gers a gift only to kill them off wi the EBT fiasco ?.

Wouldn't be the first time the HMRC have closed down what is a profitable business but the directors were crooks.

I may add toooooooo many fecking financial wizards and loophole lawyers on here.

The only thing MAJOR here ! if they kill the tax dodging beast will the ORCS go nuclear wi rioting and sending immediate family in intensive care,storm Hampden,smash creditors shops up for not agreeing a CVA,send parcel bombs to the HMRC and anyone else they see fit for punishment coz the list would be endless there.

So not as much liquidating them more like avoiding a MANCHESTER mark 2 times a hundred

[Claymores]

In that regard if HMRC and other creditors reject the deal we may see court proceedings to either stop the sale of assets and remove Duff and Phelps as administrators. That could get really messy and a whole new set of unknowns open themselves up.

Craig Whyte's floating charge is a key component to this too. Green's CVA might have Whyte forgo his floating charge or only take a small percentage of it. Green is going to put his money where his mouth is but there is still a good few questions and issues outstanding.

But your 1st point pre-supposes that £8.5m (plus any additions) as being an ureasonable sum to let the assets go in a pre-pack liquidation.. I happen to think that if the business was to be broken-up, then D&P are correct with their assessments of the prospects for Murray Park and Ibrox without a fitba team. Put simply, Ibrox has no inherant value on the open market due to the costs/difficulties in doing anything else with that specific piece of ground in Govan

I see few grounds to think HMRC or anyone else would press to stop the pre-pack sale or contemplate action to remove the Administrators.

[Claymores]

So in essence then the TAXMAN are going to give the Gers a gift only to kill them off wi the EBT fiasco ?.

Nope - if you read above, my part 1) suggests that the BTC could already have been found against them. The total of the debt is irrelevant where the value of the CVA proposal and the receipt from the pre-pack liquidation are equal.

Edited May 14, 2012 by Claymores

[Jim McLean's Ghost]

Claymores: I think my point was more that if HMRC felt the CVA was derisory they will act to ensure they get more money and the only way to do that is by pursuing Duff and Phelps in court.

hellbhoy: Outstanding tax liabilities don't usually follow a company after changes of ownership. That was the reason why Whyte got his hands on the club because he was willing to take on the tax burden unlike the Blue Knights. Brian Kennedy made it clear in his press conference that he didn't see the BTC as a problem as it would be taken care of by a CVA.

[Claymores]

Oh, oh - does any of this sound at all familiar!:

GREEN ALREADY HAS A WAR-CHEST FOR ALLY

CHARLES GREEN'S consortium will hand Ally McCoist a multi-million pound war chest this summer – if the Scottish Football Association can be persuaded to drop their transfer embargo.

Express Sport spoke to one of Green's backers, former Sheffield United owner Mike McDonald, and he admitted that their group have serious wealth that has been put together from the medical worlds of Kuwait, Abu Dhabi and Singapore alongside major investment from European and UK property developers.

Top football agent Paul Stretford will also have a major involvement in the football operation, helping the club to buy and sell players.

McDonald admitted that once Green's consortium complete their takeover and sort out the debts they are willing to plough significant amounts into the team to help McCoist's team to become big players in Scotland and the Champions League.

That investment, however, may have to be delayed unless Wednesday's SFA appeal against their one-year transfer ban is overturned.

"It is pointless to get involved if we weren't going to invest in the playing side right away," McDonald stated.

"We see that as a major priority, although, obviously, that is dependent on the Scottish Football Association's transfer embargo. We know that Ally McCoist needs to strengthen his team and also to keep some of the players he already has at the club.

"We have got all our funding together for every aspect of the take over and now it is just a case of sorting it out. Charles has had a good conversation with Ally McCoist and we want him to carry on managing the team. Charles has brought significant funds to the table because we know we need hundreds of millions to be successful at this level.

"There are a lot of people who are in this game for the publicity and think they can run a football club on a shoestring but it just isn't possible, I know that. We will not be throwing silly money at things like Manchester City but we know we have to have enough money to carry our plans out."

It was McDonald who advised Green to get a group of businessmen together if he was really serious about buying Rangers.He admitted: "That is the reason why there is a consortium involved because unless you are a sheikh or you have extreme wealth then it is very difficult for one person to fund a big-name football club, like Rangers.

"I told Charles that if he wanted to do it then he would need to go down the road of a consortium so we would have the financial clout that Rangers needed. Charles has gone away and done that and that is why we will have money coming from Europe, the UK, Kuwait, Abu Dhabi and Singapore."

McDonald has also assured the Rangers fans that Green's consortium are the real deal. They have the funds and the backers and they also know the football world and are committed to the club in the long-term – with the Champions League success their ultimate goal.

"Every one of the consortium wants to get Rangers back where they should be," McDonald admitted. "It is a massive club and it should be at the forefront of British and European football. Why can't that be done? I know it can't be achieved overnight but we have a long-term plan to achieve that goal. We have to sort the club out and to get them back on a stable and sound financial footing. Charles is definitely in it for the long haul."

Green has been given the green light from Duff and Phelps to take Rangers out of administration and they hope to have their deal completed by next month.The new owners plan to go down the road of a Creditors Voluntary Agreement although they have put a fall-back newco plan in place should they fail.

They are also aware many of McCoist's first-team can also leave this summer as a result of clauses put into contracts when they agreed wage cuts with the administrators.

http://www.express.c...ts/view/320185/

Edited May 15, 2012 by Claymores

[~~~]

"It is pointless to get involved if we weren't going to invest in the playing side right away," McDonald stated.

So if the SFA uphold (or extend) the band they won't bother getting involved in Rangers?

[Kyle]

That seems like pressure tactics to drop the embargo.

Unbelievable - you'd hope they would learn.

[hellbhoy]

Claymores: I think my point was more that if HMRC felt the CVA was derisory they will act to ensure they get more money and the only way to do that is by pursuing Duff and Phelps in court.

hellbhoy: Outstanding tax liabilities don't usually follow a company after changes of ownership. That was the reason why Whyte got his hands on the club because he was willing to take on the tax burden unlike the Blue Knights. Brian Kennedy made it clear in his press conference that he didn't see the BTC as a problem as it would be taken care of by a CVA.

I could see the point if it was a few million they only owed but my GOD tens and tens of millions,I really don't see the HMRC agreeing to literally pennies in the pound.

HMRC will probably be concerned letting them off then a whole lot of indebted British football clubs trying the same fiddle by screwing them over then selling the club on.All other debt ridden clubs would then say but you let Rangers off wi pennies in the pound so we will offer the same.

I do think there will be a Rangers of sorts but this Rangers will liquidated for sure as a deterrent to other debt ridden clubs.

Edited May 15, 2012 by hellbhoy

[Claymores]

Claymores: I think my point was more that if HMRC felt the CVA was derisory they will act to ensure they get more money and the only way to do that is by pursuing Duff and Phelps in court.

Well, I'm sure HMRC won't be impressed about talk of big 'War Chests' if they're being offered a pittance! (that Express article!)

[Jussy]

Hang on a second...

Express Sport spoke to one of Green's backers, former Sheffield United owner Mike McDonald

Did we know McDonald was in prior to this? I've read a few things on Green and recall something covering the idea that McDonald is the man pulling all the strings and he tends to use Green as a sort of frontman for his operations. He sounds like a right dodgy b*****d. Now if only I could remember where I'd been reading about him and if someone could be bothered digging the dirt on him...

[deerokus]

It also mentions Stretford's close involvement in the football operation. Shepherd is involved too. Starting to sound like it's going to be a takeover by the Triple S Sports agency, essentially. Very shady sounding, reminds me of MSI's involvement with Corinthians.

Edited May 15, 2012 by deerokus

[orco]

Well, I'm sure HMRC won't be impressed about talk of big 'War Chests' if they're being offered a pittance! (that Express article!)

My thoughts exactly.

I'm sure if I was a creditor being asked to take a pennies in the £ agreement and read that big money was available for transfers further down the line I would be looking at the administrators and asking if they really had got the best deal.

[akredz]

It absolutely stinks.

Green makes a bid for a fraction of the debt due, and then proposes to spend untold millions on new players, if they can bully the Tribunal into repealing the embargo.

I was feeling reasonably confident that morality and right would win out in this case and that Orcs FC would be liquidated and if they were lucky, allowed back in \to Div 3. Latterly, I'm beginning to have some doubts and can only hope and pray that the palpable sense of outrage is strong enough to motivate those in power to do the right thing.

[jester]

I take it the CVA pot will reach its quantum by the sale of live assets?

How come The Green Brigade can pick up the club for under £10 million, when the playing staff alone could bring in more?

[cowden0]

We should get T Shirts made. Profit to a deserving charity of us diddies choosing. Div?

great idea i would proudly wear the shirt

[RB-Scotland]

McDonald admitted that once Green's consortium complete their takeover and sort out the debts they are willing to plough significant amounts into the team to help McCoist's team to become big players in Scotland and the Champions League.

I love this misuse of 'admitted', a real staple of West Coast red top 'journalism'.

[Savage Henry]

It also mentions Stretford's close involvement in the football operation. Shepherd is involved too. Starting to sound like it's going to be a takeover by the Triple S Sports agency, essentially. Very shady sounding, reminds me of MSI's involvement with Corinthians.

Given that Paul Stretford is Celtic's agent of choice as well, you can't really claim any moral high ground.

[MEADOWXI]

As this green mob have sailed in at the last minute to steal and pillage what they can i wish to propose that this consortium is offically titled

The Green Brigands

[double0pie]

I might be wrong but from Livingston's point of view, while the original punishment was handed down by the SFL they did take the case (eventually) to the SFA which upheld it. If the SFA were to reverse the decision on Rangers then Livingston would ask why they weren't granted the same leeway. To be honest they don't really have a case since the rule they broke was based off the fact they went insolvent, however if Rangers eventually hit the same path and come out clean via appeals then they might have a case.

[Musketeer Gripweed]

That Express article is absolute bullshit on so many levels> if any Rangers fan reads that (a bit too long for most, I know) and believes any of, they deserve all that is coming to them.

I'm not surprised many of the consortium are staying private at the moment. When they pull out in the next few days, I daresay they could do without the inevitable death threats which will be coming.