Zen Archer (Raconteur) Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 i slagged off his tracksuit. Truly despicable Rattle rattle, Jim couldn't fix it for you, alas. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 He was oppressive. He was unpleasant. Anyone who thinks Thatcher was oppressive and unpleasant is completely entitled to say so here too. What they shouldn't then do is go "ding dong the witch is dead". There's clear water between those two kinds of action.He's also a human being. Who you are calling unpleasant. Its all very well calling hm unpleasant when he's alive, but he's a dead human being. Show some respect! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 He's also a human being. Who you are calling unpleasant. Its all very well calling hm unpleasant when he's alive, but he's a dead human being. Show some respect! You can call the dead unpleasant without disrespecting them. I have no objection to people calling Thatcher unpleasant. Once again, with the mentality of a 14-year-old who's never seen porn before, you've shot your load too soon here. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Archer (Raconteur) Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 He's also a human being. Who you are calling unpleasant. Its all very well calling hm unpleasant when he's alive, but he's a dead human being. Show some respect! It depends on how much the cadaver has decomposed, they really fucking reek after a while. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paulo Sergio Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 I displayed total indifference to Chavez' death. At no point did I say I would dance on his grave or that I was glad he was dead. ETA: Indeed it's entirely consistent with what I've said of Thatcher. You can criticise her politics and her record, absolutely. But glorification of death is a different matter. You can "not mourn" without being unpleasant. ^^^^^ Backtracking ferociously IMO. ^^^^^ 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Next time you're at a funeral go up to the kids/widow etc on the way out and shrug. Or if someone texts you with news of a death, text bag *shrug*. See how respectful people consider that to be. The reality is everyone is de-sensitised to death when it comes to public figures. The ones demanding people respect Thatcher because of the enduring tragic nature of death and her list of not even particularly admirable attributes like 'being divisive' are just greeting because deep down, they agree with her politics. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supras Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Very fair and balanced documentary from BBC Scotland. Typical Scotland victim mentality. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Next time you're at a funeral go up to the kids/widow etc on the way out and shrug. Or if someone texts you with news of a death, text bag *shrug*. See how respectful people consider that to be. The reality is everyone is de-sensitised to death when it comes to public figures. The ones demanding people respect Thatcher because of the enduring tragic nature of death and her list of not even particularly admirable attributes like 'being divisive' are just greeting because deep down, they agree with her politics. Posting on a football forum expressing indifference at the death of a public figure = Not disrespectful Turning up to a funeral and trying to get a reaction out of the family of the dead by deliberately going out of your way to look indifferent = Disrespectful Openly celebrating at someone's death posting "ding dong the witch is dead" and saying "I hope she rots in hell" and similar = Disrespectful I don't demand that people be nice or be silent about Thatcher. I simply say that I think openly celebrating (note, not the same as "not mourning" or "not caring for" her death) are both morbid and disrespectful. I don't agree with a great deal of her politics: her stance on equal rights, on apartheid, on council houses, on immigration, on criminal justice, and in several respects on broad macroeconomic policy. And insofar as I disagree with those things I say so. There is a fucking chasm of difference between being indifferent about the death of a public figure and celebrating or glorifying that death. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 You can call the dead unpleasant without disrespecting them. I have no objection to people calling Thatcher unpleasant. Once again, with the mentality of a 14-year-old who's never seen porn before, you've shot your load too soon here. Do you never worry about just how often you seem to end up on the same side as Reynard and HB? That is not a side you really want to be consistently on...in the case of Reynard in particular, its very much gilt by association. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Do you never worry about just how often you seem to end up on the same side as Reynard and HB? That is not a side you really want to be consistently on...in the case of Reynard in particular, its very much gilt by association. In what way have I associated myself with Reynard's remarks either in respect of Chavez or Thatcher? Has H_B even *said* anything on either of these issues? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Uncle Psychosis Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Feels very strange to (mostly) agree with The Telegraph http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/margaret-thatcher/9984619/Margaret-Thatcher-This-is-a-state-funeral-and-thats-a-mistake.html 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paranoid android Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 I'm afraid I'm not going to respect a dead person that I didn't respect when they were alive. Why the f**k would I? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Supras Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Good point on the Telegraph, the event is needless obviously. And if Thatcher got one Attlee definitely should have. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 (edited) Posting on a football forum expressing indifference at the death of a public figure = Not disrespectful Turning up to a funeral and trying to get a reaction out of the family of the dead by deliberately going out of your way to look indifferent = Disrespectful Openly celebrating at someone's death posting "ding dong the witch is dead" and saying "I hope she rots in hell" and similar = Disrespectful I don't demand that people be nice or be silent about Thatcher. I simply say that I think openly celebrating (note, not the same as "not mourning" or "not caring for" her death) are both morbid and disrespectful. I don't agree with a great deal of her politics: her stance on equal rights, on apartheid, on council houses, on immigration, on criminal justice, and in several respects on broad macroeconomic policy. And insofar as I disagree with those things I say so. There is a fucking chasm of difference between being indifferent about the death of a public figure and celebrating or glorifying that death. People hated, chastised and publicly jeered Thatcher in life but shouldn't do so after her death because erm, death is sad, right? Why don't you find Chavez's death sad? There's nothing wrong with your judgement on someone affecting your emotional reaction to their death (happy, indifferent or sad). It's better to actually be honest about your opinions though, instead of this slightly hypocritical disingeniousness (*waves to Liberal Democrat*) Edited April 10, 2013 by SodjesSixteenIncher 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 In what way have I associated myself with Reynard's remarks either in respect of Chavez or Thatcher? Has H_B even *said* anything on either of these issues?Issue after issue, you seem to end up on the same side as those two... 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 People hated, chastised and publicly jeered Thatcher in life but shouldn't do so after her death because erm, death is sad, right? No, this is incorrect. You can hate, chastise and jeer Thatcher in death. But celebrating someone's death is inherently disrespectful. There is a line. Hating, chastising and jeering falls well short of celebrating someone's death. Why don't you find Chavez's death sad? Because he wasn't a personal friend and the circumstances of his death weren't particularly harrowing. The same reason I don't find Thatcher's death sad. They were both ageing people who I didn't know personally, who died from fairly common means of death. There's nothing wrong with your judgement on someone affecting your emotional reaction to their death (happy, indifferent or sad). It's better to actually be honest about your opinions though, instead of this slightly hypocritical disingeniousness (*waves to Liberal Democrat*) What is disingenuous about my position? All I have said is that people saying "ding dong the witch is dead" is tasteless and that they're a bit sad for doing it. Same as Reynard's post about Chavez was crass, tasteless and a bit sad especially but not entirely given there is no reason for him to feel personal animosity towards someone who has had negligible effect on his life. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ad Lib Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Issue after issue, you seem to end up on the same side as those two... Which "side" am I on in this issue? Perhaps you could clarify. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SodjesSixteenIncher Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Jeez, am I going to have to take this step by step? 1. But celebrating someone's death is inherently disrespectful. Why? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xbl Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 Which "side" am I on in this issue? Perhaps you could clarify.The side that says we shouldn't take any pleasure in the death of a woman who seemed to try her best to destroy Scotland forever. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jimmy85 Posted April 10, 2013 Share Posted April 10, 2013 But glorification of death is a different matter. Would it be fair to say that the celebrations that take place on the 5th of November are glorifying death? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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