Tubbs Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 So we are now in the position where the yes camp are not actually saying there has ever been a groundswell of opinion for independence; but that if there was it would have been ignored ! Staggering. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 That's vague as f**k. Do you think anyone actually believed that? So, how has the current referendum come about? Was there a mechanism in place at Westminster that said "If the Scottish Parliament return an SNP government, there will be a referendum" ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 And you keep dodging this question... "The SNP mantra in 1992 was 'Free by 93' - what did they possibly mean by this"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 And you keep dodging this question... "The SNP mantra in 1992 was 'Free by 93' - what did they possibly mean by this"? You tell me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 You tell me. No, I want your take on it. You have made it clear that there wasn't a mechanism for Scots to vote for Independence through a General Election in the 1990s. You are a supporter of Independence. The SNP ran with a slogan , in a General Election campaign, of "Free by 93". What did they mean by this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Its aw aboot the snp again today aswell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 This gets curiouser and curiouser... Alex Salmond (in 1992) :- Speaking to reporters before the start of the conference Mr Salmond said: ''The central message which will emerge from this conference is the transition of the SNP from a party of protest to a party of power, ready to form the government of an independent Scotland after the coming General Election. Quite clearly Mr Salmond believed that an SNP victory in Scotland in 1992 was a possibility, as he concluded his statement by saying: ''All that is required is for the Scots who believe in independence to vote for it by voting for the SNP at the coming General Election Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 So we are now in the position where the yes camp are not actually saying there has ever been a groundswell of opinion for independence; but that if there was it would have been ignored ! Staggering. Not the yes camp, just me. Please stop trying to conflate individual opinions with some kind of party line that we all tow. In my opinion, 30 SNP MPs would not necessarily have been seen as sufficient groundswell - after all, HB would argue that returning a majority SNP government to Holyrood is not necessarily a groundswell for Indy either =, and depending on the government of the day could have been ignored, or kicked into the long grass. It's much harder to ignore a majority government in a Scottish legislature than 30 MPs in a majority westminster government. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 There are countries with higher living standards than Scotland. There are an awful lot more countries with much poorer living standards than Scotland. Your Scottish cringe isn't welcome here. When you lose an argument, do you just try to deflect and bore everyone to tears so much so they forget about it? Or are you just one of these people who can't stand losing an argument at any cost? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 No, I want your take on it. You have made it clear that there wasn't a mechanism for Scots to vote for Independence through a General Election in the 1990s. You are a supporter of Independence. The SNP ran with a slogan , in a General Election campaign, of "Free by 93". What did they mean by this? No, you have a point to make, so fucking make it. I'll then respond to your point with my own argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 No, you have a point to make, so fucking make it. I'll then respond to your point with my own argument. I've already made it. Just to be clear here, when Alex Salmond stated :- ''All that is required is for the Scots who believe in independence to vote for it by voting for the SNP at the coming General Election" He was lying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 just get it out your system just call him a fat b*****d like the rest of the mungos Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I've already made it. Just to be clear here, when Alex Salmond stated :- ''All that is required is for the Scots who believe in independence to vote for it by voting for the SNP at the coming General Election" He was lying? It's a vague enough statement that it's hard to pin any particulars to point to a lie or a truth. It doesn't say, for example ''All that is required is for the Scots who believe in independence to vote for it by voting for the SNP at the coming General Election which will trigger an automatic referendum which we all know is law if we get over a certain number of MPs" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 When you lose an argument, I've actually been proven to be perfectly correct. Really, you should just stick to cutting and pasting GIFs and bits from Facebook. That is your level. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 It's a vague enough statement that it's hard to pin any particulars to point to a lie or a truth. It doesn't say, for example ''All that is required is for the Scots who believe in independence to vote for it by voting for the SNP at the coming General Election which will trigger an automatic referendum which we all know is law if we get over a certain number of MPs" You haven't explained to me yet how the current referendum came about. What mechanism at Westminster did the SNP election win trigger? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 I've actually been proven to be perfectly correct. Really, you should just stick to cutting and pasting GIFs and bits from Facebook. That is your level. So it's the win argument at all cost route you do down, hopefully you'll grow out of it when you leave school Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
H_B Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 So it's the win argument at all cost route you do down, hopefully you'll grow out of it when you leave school Have you got a Facebook update that says this which you could cut and paste a picture of? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Im amazed hb claims to have voted for the snp with the amount of seethe they obviously cause to him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 Have you got a Facebook update that says this which you could cut and paste a picture of? You really are a sore loser, this is embarrassing even for you HB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
renton Posted June 20, 2014 Share Posted June 20, 2014 You haven't explained to me yet how the current referendum came about. What mechanism at Westminster did the SNP election win trigger? not a formal mechanism but any attempt by Westminster to stop them holding a referendum themselves would've back fired, even if said referendum was outside their competency to hold. It would have stood as a popular vote of the people, even if it didn't lead to anything, the result would still be there, and Westminster would still have to deal with it. By allowing the referendum to occur under their auspices, and recognising the vote as binding, Westminster can fight against it and if they win can kill the whole thing dead. Simply by existing, the Scottish parliament acts as a platform to organise from - an infrastrucutre that would allow them to hold a refernedum in a way 30 MPs wouldn't, with a legitimacy from a popular vote of the people that 30 MPs could never command. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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