Well Well Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I don't agree with that either. So its ok to support a Govt system that is already doing it but not because the Scottish Govt may do the same..?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 So its ok to support a Govt system that is already doing it but not because the Scottish Govt may do the same..?? I don't support either system if you've been paying attention. I've also said to the doubters that I'll post a photograph of my ballot on the 19th to prove it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well Well Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 but you were quick to point out it was the SNP position without mentioning the fact that Westminster have been doing it since the discovery of oil but to try to balance it out by saying you are against anyone doing it. So why didn't you just say that Westminster have been exploiting Scottish Oil since 1970s to solve their current expenditure problems and you don't think Scotland should go down the same route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 but you were quick to point out it was the SNP position without mentioning the fact that Westminster have been doing it since the discovery of oil but to try to balance it out by saying you are against anyone doing it. So why didn't you just say that Westminster have been exploiting Scottish Oil since 1970s to solve their current expenditure problems and you don't think Scotland should go down the same route. Because, like the rest of the NO's on here he would have to agree with an ardent YES like myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 but you were quick to point out it was the SNP position without mentioning the fact that Westminster have been doing it since the discovery of oil but to try to balance it out by saying you are against anyone doing it. So why didn't you just say that Westminster have been exploiting Scottish Oil since 1970s to solve their current expenditure problems and you don't think Scotland should go down the same route. There's enough folk here that do that. Their seems to be an unhealthy avoidance of the tough issues by Yes campaigners - a complete unacceptance that there might be problems and issues to be dealt with. If we are talking about a post iScotland then I thinks it's only right to highlight an issue that needs addressed. I have said elsewhere that an iScotland could have a successful economy given the right economic policies. What concerns me is the the SG seem to be making the same mistakes that previous governments (especially Labour) at Westminster have made. If we were to be independent then we'd better make it work and not rely on optimism to see us through. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Because, like the rest of the NO's on here he would have to agree with an ardent YES like myself Not a No - as I will prove on the 19th. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Well Well Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 There's enough folk here that do that. Their seems to be an unhealthy avoidance of the tough issues by Yes campaigners - a complete unacceptance that there might be problems and issues to be dealt with. If we are talking about a post iScotland then I thinks it's only right to highlight an issue that needs addressed. I have said elsewhere that I iScotland could have a successful economy given the right economic policies. What concerns me is the the SG seem to be making the same mistakes that previous governments (especially Labour) at Westminster have made. If we were to be independent then we'd better make it work and not rely on optimism to see us through. I agree in that we should be avoiding the same issues as Westminster but I do have faith in that Scotland will get more right than wrong. A written constitution is a great start as everyone will have a say in what it will contain not just the politicians. So the people of Scotland will contribute to the policies of a future independent Scotland. If anything I think the Scottish Govt have corrected a fair few mistakes of WM including tuition fees, no tolls, free prescriptions, Community charge freezes, Free care for the elderly all things that are different to WM and all paid from the block grant that is reluctantly provided by WM. Scotland have already went down a different road from WM and for me it is a much better road. There are things I do not support but feel we are heading in the right direction. Labour unfortunately are completely in bed with the Tories and it pains me when I see them providing completely different response up here than down south, The NHS privatisation is a perfect example of their duplicity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Not a No - as I will prove on the 19th. You certainly didn't come in behind me on the occasions that I've had to defend this position from the worker on short hours. And don't under any circumstances feel the need to provide proof of your vote, people will just need to trust that I'm voting YES coz I'll be proving nothing, democracy shouldn't require anyone to provide proof. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 You certainly didn't come in behind me on the occasions that I've had to defend this position from the worker on short hours. And don't under any circumstances feel the need to provide proof of your vote, people will just need to trust that I'm voting YES coz I'll be proving nothing, democracy shouldn't require anyone to provide proof. Can please clarify that first sentence - no idea what you are on about. I'm proving it because some people here - including you - have consistently accused me of voting No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ayrmad Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Can please clarify that first sentence - no idea what you are on about. I'm proving it because some people here - including you - have consistently accused me of voting No. Are you 4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Confidemus Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 DTID's certainly quite engaged for a man who's not engaged. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thumper Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 I'm proving it because some people here - including you - have consistently accused me of voting No. That's mostly just to wind you up. Your vote is stupid and indefensible, probably even less intellectually sound than the dumbest No vote, but if you want to smear shite on your ballot paper then go for it. Hell fucking mend you though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Casual Bystander Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Commenting on the recent reports of improved predictions for oil deposits and recovery along with possible offshore fracking Murdo Fraser (Scottish Conservatives) said: It's remarkable an organisation whose founder sits on Yes Scotland's board has discovered £300bn worth of oil just weeks before the referendum” Yet strangely enough he was more than happy to believe Sir Ian Wood's comments when it dismissed SNP figures (even though they were found to be contradictory just days later). Funny that really, isn't it? I wonder if, as a child, Mr Fraser enjoyed Woolworths Pic'n'Mix. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
doulikefish Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Another disaster http://www.cityam.com/1409541753/blackstone-500m-north-sea-investment Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaven Posted September 4, 2014 Share Posted September 4, 2014 Has Dee commented on this yet? http://yes2014.net/2014/09/04/media-called-us-conspiracy-theorists-right/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Has Dee commented on this yet? http://yes2014.net/2014/09/04/media-called-us-conspiracy-theorists-right/ Sorry to burst your bubble but that's still talking about potential revenues over time - there's nothing there about revenue per annum which is the crucial point. As I keep saying - oil is not going to run out soon. The issue is that production has fallen particulatly as the cost of extraction has risen 5-fold - that's why investment is at high - focussed in 4 medium fields and nowhere else. Irrrespective of more additional finds we can't extract oil fast enough - not unless there is a major technological breakthrough. Also whilst I believe it is absolutely correct to create a Scottish Oil Fund I just can't see when or how when the SG plans to not only spend oil revenues in the first 3 years of government but have additional borrowing to increase expenditure by 3% per annum. And that's not taking in to account potential share of national debt - but that's a whole different debate. I think the SG are tryng to eat their cake and keep it - making the very same mistakes as Westminster. I have also said elsewhere that an iScotland economy could be very successful given the correct policies - I just don't think at the moment that the SG's economic policies are going to be that earth-shattering. As for the alternative - Scottish Labour as the iScotland government - I wouldn't trust them with the grandkids' piggy banks. And I just don't see a serious other alternative emerging. So you might wonder why I keep banging the same drum? If we were to become independent I want it to work - repeating past mistakes needs to be avoided. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Antiochas III Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 But right now you're happy for those that made the mistakes to be allowed to carry on as is? The only chance past mistakes have a chance of not being made is with independence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
milton75 Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 That link won't open here for me, is it this story? http://www.scotsman.com/news/politics/top-stories/scotland-set-for-300bn-oil-boom-new-study-shows-1-3531035 Scotland set for £300bn oil boom, new study shows AN additional £300 billion in oil and gas tax revenues remain in the North Sea, a report from business organisation N-56 has claimed. The study stated that there are “remaining conventional reserves of around 24 billion barrels”. It said there are North Sea oil and gas revenues of up to £665 billion - more than double the total taxation from oil and gas received to date of £313 billion. SNP energy spokesman Fergus Ewing, welcomed the report that Scotland is in line for a new “black gold bonanza” from innovative proposals to recover offshore unconventional oil and gas under the North Sea. He said: “This new report shows the strong possibilities in offshore unconventional and hard to reach oil and gas, and shows that when combined with existing reserves Scotland could have almost double the oil and gas reserves we previously thought. “We welcome the report and are interested in exploring the huge potential benefits for the industry and the country that it represents. “It’s particularly interesting to note that the report suggests that both the UK and Danish Governments are taking this opportunity very seriously.” Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaven Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 Sorry to burst your bubble but that's still talking about potential revenues over time - there's nothing there about revenue per annum which is the crucial point. As I keep saying - oil is not going to run out soon. The issue is that production has fallen particulatly as the cost of extraction has risen 5-fold - that's why investment is at high - focussed in 4 medium fields and nowhere else. Irrrespective of more additional finds we can't extract oil fast enough - not unless there is a major technological breakthrough. Also whilst I believe it is absolutely correct to create a Scottish Oil Fund I just can't see when or how when the SG plans to not only spend oil revenues in the first 3 years of government but have additional borrowing to increase expenditure by 3% per annum. And that's not taking in to account potential share of national debt - but that's a whole different debate. I think the SG are tryng to eat their cake and keep it - making the very same mistakes as Westminster. I have also said elsewhere that an iScotland economy could be very successful given the correct policies - I just don't think at the moment that the SG's economic policies are going to be that earth-shattering. As for the alternative - Scottish Labour as the iScotland government - I wouldn't trust them with the grandkids' piggy banks. And I just don't see a serious other alternative emerging. So you might wonder why I keep banging the same drum? If we were to become independent I want it to work - repeating past mistakes needs to be avoided. You OK Dee? Think your ego has over self inflated of late. I was only asking if you had made a comment on it yet. Reason I asked was because I have become guilty of flicking past a fair few of your post of late. Repeat. Repeat. You OK Dee? Think your ego has over self inflated of late. I was only asking if you...................... Repeat. Repeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blaven Posted September 5, 2014 Share Posted September 5, 2014 How much revenue does Scotland get from exporting oil and gas to the rUK? Does Scotland get any money from the tax revenues from petrol sold in the rUK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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