The wonders of austerity

[Confidemus]

You can't go a day without making a complete spectacle of yourself, can you Parp?

Which part of this wasn't clear?

“I give parliament the assurance today that if the DWP says no, the Scottish Government will put in place a scheme to make this additional £12m available to social landlords so that we need not see any evictions in Scotland this year as a result solely of the bedroom tax

You and your inept chum Adlib shouted from the rooftops about how Holyrood had it in their power to reverse the effects of the Bedroom tax.

More fibs from you two. Tut tut.

[H_B]

You and your inept chum Adlib shouted from the rooftops about how Holyrood had it in their power to reverse the effects of the Bedroom tax.

Eh, they do champ.

Perhaps you are struggling with this fairly straightforward statement.

I give parliament the assurance today that if the DWP says no, the Scottish Government will put in place a scheme to make this additional £12m available to social landlords so that we need not see any evictions in Scotland this year as a result solely of the bedroom tax

[Confidemus]

Eh, they do champ.

Perhaps you are struggling with this fairly straightforward statement.

I give parliament the assurance today that if the DWP says no, the Scottish Government will put in place a scheme to make this additional £12m available to social landlords so that we need not see any evictions in Scotland this year as a result solely of the bedroom tax

They don't, champ. Simply repeating a quote isn't aiding your cause. Look, I can do it too:

Commenting, East Kilbride MSP and member of the Welfare Reform Committee Linda Fabiani said:

“The Bedroom Tax is an unfair, iniquitous policy which targets the most vulnerable people in society. It is absolutely ridiculous that the Scottish Government ever had to use scarce resources to mop up Westminster’s mess and help people suffering under a policy that Scotland comprehensively rejected.

“However, it’s even more ludicrous that Westminster is able to stand in the way of the Scottish Government’s attempts to help victims of the Bedroom Tax – perfectly demonstrating the limitations of the status quo and the necessity of independence."

[H_B]

They don't, champ. Simply repeating a quote isn't aiding your cause. Look, I can do it too:

Commenting, East Kilbride MSP and member of the Welfare Reform Committee Linda Fabiani said:

“The Bedroom Tax is an unfair, iniquitous policy which targets the most vulnerable people in society. It is absolutely ridiculous that the Scottish Government ever had to use scarce resources to mop up Westminster’s mess and help people suffering under a policy that Scotland comprehensively rejected.

“However, it’s even more ludicrous that Westminster is able to stand in the way of the Scottish Government’s attempts to help victims of the Bedroom Tax – perfectly demonstrating the limitations of the status quo and the necessity of independence."

In Scotland, Labour says even if the DWP rejects the Scottish Government request, other ways can be found to neutralise the impact of the bedroom tax north of the Border.

Finance spokesman Iain Gray says a system already operating in Renfrewshire could be replicated across the country which sees councils simply “write off” cash owed by tenants as a result of the welfare reform

[Confidemus]

In Scotland, Labour says even if the DWP rejects the Scottish Government request, other ways can be found to neutralise the impact of the bedroom tax north of the Border.

Finance spokesman Iain Gray says a system already operating in Renfrewshire could be replicated across the country which sees councils simply “write off” cash owed by tenants as a result of the welfare reform

You appear to be missing the point.

Why should any of this even have to happen? Say there were a million loopholes to get round bedroom tax, why should Holyrood have to dip into a budget that isn't all that massive to simply negate the effects of a crippling, unfair tax on the poor?

Why can't you accept that the buck stops firmly at Westminster on this one?

[H_B]

Say there were a million loopholes to get round bedroom tax, why should Holyrood have to dip into a budget that isn't all that massive to simply negate the effects of a crippling, unfair tax on the poor?

Why can't you accept that the buck stops firmly at Westminster on this one?

Oh and again, after you are completely owned on the issue for the second day in a row, you try and shift the goalposts.

The SNP doesn't "have to" do anything about the bedroom tax. The point is it can if it chooses to under existing powers and existing budget. It's just a question of priorities.

And how much they want to inflame gullible idiots like you.

[AUFC90]

Oh and again, after you are completely owned on the issue for the second day in a row, you try and shift the goalposts.

The SNP doesn't "have to" do anything about the bedroom tax. The point is it can if it chooses to under existing powers and existing budget. It's just a question of priorities.

And how much they want to inflame gullible idiots like you.

The point is they should not have to prioritise. A yes vote will ensure that Scotlands has policies that suits Scotland and not Westminster. We have Tories who implemented it. We have liberals who helped them. Then we have Labour who could not be arsed getting rid of it. The SG have to deal with the fallout from our already stretched budget. The blame lies to solely with Westminster.

[vikingTON]

In Scotland, Labour says even if the DWP rejects the Scottish Government request, other ways can be found to neutralise the impact of the bedroom tax north of the Border.

Finance spokesman Iain Gray says a system already operating in Renfrewshire could be replicated across the country which sees councils simply “write off” cash owed by tenants as a result of the welfare reform

Labour

Iain Gray

Also, in case you haven't noticed, the SNP doesn't control all local authorities, and has already exacted major limits on council budgets as a result of the council tax freeze. Given those three 100% comprehensive flaws, just a terrific Sherwood-esque fail from yourself.

[Burma]

Oh and again, after you are completely owned on the issue for the second day in a row, you try and shift the goalposts.

The SNP doesn't "have to" do anything about the bedroom tax. The point is it can if it chooses to under existing powers and existing budget. It's just a question of priorities.

And how much they want to inflame gullible idiots like you.

HB being schooled on this for the second day in a row. Just accept your fail and move on.

[Confidemus]

Oh and again, after you are completely owned on the issue for the second day in a row, you try and shift the goalposts.

The SNP doesn't "have to" do anything about the bedroom tax. The point is it can if it chooses to under existing powers and existing budget. It's just a question of priorities.

And how much they want to inflame gullible idiots like you.

Owned? You actually said owned? Good lord.

Speaking of which, I look forward to your comeback from Vikington "owning" you just above.

[Ad Lib]

Also, in case you haven't noticed, the SNP doesn't control all local authorities, and has already exacted major limits on council budgets as a result of the council tax freeze. Given those three 100% comprehensive flaws, just a terrific Sherwood-esque fail from yourself.

Oh imagine the sheer horror at a central government denying a subsidiary level of government the fiscal power to be able to provide a higher level of support to the most vulnerable in their communities. That would be just scandalous.

Oh wait. That's exactly what the Scottish Government are doing. They are bullying local government into freezing the council tax on mansions by threatening to cut their block grant if they do so. Cheaper mansions for the rich prioritised by Bute House over giving real local power to give support to the most vulnerable who can't afford their own shelter.

[H_B]

Also, in case you haven't noticed, the SNP doesn't control all local authorities, and has already exacted major limits on council budgets as a result of the council tax freeze.

So you are actually defending the SNP with their own fail policy?

Be very clear here, are you or are you not, saying the Scottish government doesn't have the ability to completely deal with the so called bedroom tax using existing powers and budgets?

Yes, or No?

[Burma]

Oh imagine the sheer horror at a central government denying a subsidiary level of government the fiscal power to be able to provide a higher level of support to the most vulnerable in their communities. That would be just scandalous.

Oh wait. That's exactly what the Scottish Government are doing. They are bullying local government into freezing the council tax on mansions by threatening to cut their block grant if they do so. Cheaper mansions for the rich prioritised by Bute House over giving real local power to give support to the most vulnerable who can't afford their own shelter.

Yes it's only mansions that get the council tax freeze.

[AUFC90]

So you are actually defending the SNP with their own fail policy?

Be very clear here, are you or are you not, saying the Scottish government doesn't have the ability to completely deal with the so called bedroom tax using existing powers and budgets?

Yes, or No?

Are you or are you not a repetitive Sadact who answers 0 questions ? Yes or no ?

[vikingTON]

So you are actually defending the SNP with their own fail policy?

Be very clear here, are you or are you not, saying the Scottish government doesn't have the ability to completely deal with the so called bedroom tax using existing powers and budgets?

Yes, or No?

It doesn't, for the very obvious reasons already covered. The Scottish Government has no power to override the decision of, say, Inverclyde Council when it comes to collecting or writing off its debts - the local party doesn't control the council. Therefore Iain Gray's theory sinks rather dismally.

So what was the point you were trying to make, other than Labour being completely hopeless?

[vikingTON]

Oh imagine the sheer horror at a central government denying a subsidiary level of government the fiscal power to be able to provide a higher level of support to the most vulnerable in their communities. That would be just scandalous.

Oh wait. That's exactly what the Scottish Government are doing. They are bullying local government into freezing the council tax on mansions by threatening to cut their block grant if they do so. Cheaper mansions for the rich prioritised by Bute House over giving real local power to give support to the most vulnerable who can't afford their own shelter.

Bzzzztt, sorry champ, but the socially progressive Scottish Government isn't in the business of receiving rap lectures from the Orange Book roasters who failed to tackle major issues in bed with Labour at Edinburgh until 2007, then slithered into government with the Tories; directly contributing to a massive upsurge in direct policy attacks upon the poor and those in receipt of welfare. Nor are you in a position to comment on delegating "real local power" given your party's entrenched British nationalist policy, as shown by its lockstep affiliation with BT.

Your imminent crash into political oblivion will be immensely pleasing; it'll make Thatcher dying seem like a sombre and respectful event.

[Ad Lib]

Yes it's only mansions that get the council tax freeze.

*sigh*

The point is you don't have to increase the council tax for every single band in your local authority, nor do they have to be value-linked to one another. You could concentrate a council tax rise on the high value properties in your local authority and use the proceeds to provide supplementary support to housing benefit claimants affected by the under-occupancy penalty.

ETA: in fact, the power to do this rests with the Scottish Ministers and not the local councils themselves! They can pass a statutory instrument altering the proportions in which council tax falls under s74(3) of the Local Government Finance Act 1992.

That power transfered from the Secretary of State for Scotland in 1999, as the exception to the reserved matters under Head A in Part 2 of Schedule 5 of the Scotland Act. It's the reason the Scottish Parliament would have had the power to replace council tax with a local income tax had it voted for it in the last Parliament. Alex Salmond could table a statutory instrument tomorrow if he wanted, imposing in effect a local mansion tax on the top 1 or top 2 council tax bands.

But the SNP don't want to do that. They don't want to lose the votes of the affluent middle-class, who own homes with more than 4 bedrooms in nice estates with double-garages. Cool. But they probably shouldn't adopt the moral high ground on "being denied powers" when they do exactly the same thing to local councils.

[Ad Lib]

Bzzzztt, sorry champ, but the socially progressive Scottish Government isn't in the business of receiving rap lectures from the Orange Book roasters who failed to tackle major issues in bed with Labour at Edinburgh until 2007, then slithered into government with the Tories; directly contributing to a massive upsurge in direct policy attacks upon the poor and those in receipt of welfare. Nor are you in a position to comment on delegating "real local power" given your party's entrenched British nationalist policy, as shown by its lockstep affiliation with BT.

Your imminent crash into political oblivion will be immensely pleasing; it'll make Thatcher dying seem like a sombre and respectful event.

Nice analysis and engagement with the issues there. I can definitely see how ad hominems about my party affiliation discredit the arguments I made which weren't contingent on supporting any party.

[git-intae-thum]

Bzzzztt, sorry champ, but the socially progressive Scottish Government isn't in the business of receiving rap lectures from the Orange Book roasters who failed to tackle major issues in bed with Labour at Edinburgh until 2007, then slithered into government with the Tories; directly contributing to a massive upsurge in direct policy attacks upon the poor and those in receipt of welfare. Nor are you in a position to comment on delegating "real local power" given your party's entrenched British nationalist policy, as shown by its lockstep affiliation with BT.

Your imminent crash into political oblivion will be immensely pleasing; it'll make Thatcher dying seem like a sombre and respectful event.

Sums up the fib dems pretty well though.

[vikingTON]

*sigh*

The point is you don't have to increase the council tax for every single band in your local authority, nor do they have to be value-linked to one another. You could concentrate a council tax rise on the high value properties in your local authority and use the proceeds to provide supplementary support to housing benefit claimants affected by the under-occupancy penalty.

You're all over the place here. The SNP's policy - as clearly supported with an electoral mandate (perhaps something a LibDem needs to look up) - is a unilateral freeze. A unilateral freeze is also a measure that can be easily implemented. What can not be easily implemented is a series of horse-trading with 32 local authorities about which bands should be increased by x or y% each year, nor does the Scottish Government possess sufficient power to dictate the discretionary spending of any single local authority. For someone crying their eyes out about the undermining of local authorities, it really is utterly bizarre for you to set this straw man attack up, based as it is on, err, completely overriding all the significant autonomy of local councils.

But the SNP don't want to do that. They don't want to lose the votes of the affluent middle-class, who own homes with more than 4 bedrooms in nice estates with double-garages. Cool. But they probably shouldn't adopt the moral high ground on "being denied powers" when they do exactly the same thing to local councils.

Local councils haven't been denied powers, they have the same powers subject to fairly minor checks by central government upon their utterly feckless management. They are free to spend their considerable budgets in whichever way they wish, which given their penchant for funding shit like flowerbeds and statues of horses is already a power that should require a greater degree of scrutiny from the centre.

There is a decisive difference between the mandate for a national administration to run its own affairs, as supported by a popular mandate to do so, and that of arbitrary local, glorified tuck-shop funds to do so. If you and the remaining half-dozen LibDems can't deal with this, then you should probably avoid modern politics altogether, seeing as that's the hegemonic model across the world.