FuzzyAffro Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 JMO clearly doesn't have a scooby as to what actually constitutes Left-wing politics; he's an absolute fucking disgrace. He really is, people like that are killing the Labour party. Jmo is a moderate Tory, that's what he is he just hasn't realised it yet. All his politics fits perfectly with that definition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I am left-wing. I am moderately left of centre. We probably have differing opinions of what left-wing constitutes, but you went to a world top 200 university to study politics so I guess we are all supposed to bow down to your superior insights. You are a typical Labour Party member. That is not a compliment. Perhaps they are not but I haven't seen anything yet to refute that. I did say that I consider the SNP to be a social democratic Party (non caps) and as such there is no room for a SLP under the same banner. The capitalisation was due to my iPad not me. The SNP, of which I'm a member, are in government in Scotland. It's the one forum where they have real power. Their policies have not been nearly as redistributive as they could have been. Hopefully that will change. I find it hard, nonetheless, to have a SLP to the left of the SNP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I am left-wing. I am moderately left of centre. That's like saying a Left back and a Left footed centre half are the same thing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 No you're not. Read your first two sentences "I am left-wing. I am moderately left of centre." They are not the same thing, you can't be both. And its nothing to do with opinions, it doesn't matter what anybody's 'opinion' of what left-wing politics are is, there is an actual answer to that. You can think left-wing means anything you want, it doesn't change what it actually means. And you clearly just don't know what it means, that's why you use the term in relation to you, Labour and Tony Blair, none of whom are remotely close to being left-wing. Seriously, go to google, type 'left-wing politics' into the search bar and spend ten minutes doing some reading. You will quickly find neither you, Blair or Labour are remotely left-wing. Not even the SNP are left-wing, they are centre-left, and they're left of Labour. I couldn't agree more with the phrases in bold. How anyone could think a Blair government could be left wing is frankly unbelievable. Surely that is the problem with Scottish Labour. At one time they were left-ish leaning but that was no good for the English Labour Party. So they changed to a poor imitation of the ELP....and that was no good for the SLP (and Scotland). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jie Bie Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Labour MSP and councillors must be shitting it big time next year Just the MSPs I am afraid, the Council elections aren't until 2017... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Just the MSPs I am afraid, the Council elections aren't until 2017... Also you'd have to be pretty hardcore to vote along party lines in a council election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Also you'd have to be pretty hardcore to vote along party lines in a council election. Seriously? Whatever you think the majority of folk will vote in council elections the sme way s they vote in ny other election. You my disagree with their reasons for doing so but to suggest that's 'hardline' shows how little thought you put into the post. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
~~~ Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Just the MSPs I am afraid, the Council elections aren't until 2017... Ah shite. I'm desperate to get rid of our Labour council Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 The capitalisation was due to my iPad not me. The SNP, of which I'm a member, are in government in Scotland. It's the one forum where they have real power. Their policies have not been nearly as redistributive as they could have been. Hopefully that will change. I find it hard, nonetheless, to have a SLP to the left of the SNP. Fair doos but I am talking about after independence. I would like to see a left-wing political party. Whether it is called the SLP or SSP or anything else is for the future to decide. I'm still a wee bit unsure of where the monarchy and the house of lords would sit in an independent Scotland. IF the SNP post independence accepted the monarchy and all it's baggage then I would hope to see a radical left political party that I could support. I ken the SNP cannae just abolish privilege (I suppose they could) just like that but a start would be to tell that woman that in Scotland she is the first Elizabeth and that bye-the-way there will be nae mair Lords & Ladies frae Scotland in thon big hoose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Seriously? Whatever you think the majority of folk will vote in council elections the sme way s they vote in ny other election. You my disagree with their reasons for doing so but to suggest that's 'hardline' shows how little thought you put into the post. Council elections are traditionally more to do with personal votes and local issues than the colour of rosette. That's why independents are far more likely to be elected to councils than they are to parliament. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crùbag Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Eh? Findlay has long been open about his opposition to Trident. Findlay is an idiot. Separating from UK Labour and lurching to the far left would be catastrophic for the party. It would alienate a decent chunk of Labour supporters and voters. Findlay is twisting the knife in his attempts to get a leftist party. From what I can tell the majority of people who want Jim to resign in the Labour Party are the same people who wanted Findlay to win in the first place. A left-wing Labour Party? Imagine that... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmothecat Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 That's like saying a Left back and a Left footed centre half are the same thing I disagree. 'Left-wing' is broader, and not an absolute phrase. I have views far to the left, and views on the right, as well as those more centrist. Overall, on balance, I find myself roughly where New Labour found themselves. I believe strongly in certain left-wing principles that people far to the left of me would also support, but find that in others, in the era we live in, I take a more pragmatic view. I don't support mass nationalisation (though I do support limited nationalisation of certain industries), I don't believe equality is realistically achievable, however I am in favour of the welfare state and creating equality of opportunity, I do believe in big government and using government to reduce poverty and help the worst off in our society. I disagree with some left wing views and support others, but believe 'left-wing' encompasses the beliefs I hold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Also you'd have to be pretty hardcore to vote along party lines in a council election. I must be hardcore. Last Thursday as well as voting for an MP there was a bye-election for a council seat. When I was given my council voting paper (I think there were 7 names), the guy said you can vote for one or for as many as you want as long as you number them 1,2,3, etc. I just put the one number on the paper and I'm glad tae say my guy won. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmothecat Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Council elections are traditionally more to do with personal votes and local issues than the colour of rosette. That's why independents are far more likely to be elected to councils than they are to parliament. There might be an element of that but I would guess most people vote for the party they support in council elections. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 I disagree. 'Left-wing' is broader, and not an absolute phrase. I have views far to the left, and views on the right, as well as those more centrist. Overall, on balance, I find myself roughly where New Labour found themselves. I believe strongly in certain left-wing principles that people far to the left of me would also support, but find that in others, in the era we live in, I take a more pragmatic view. I don't support mass nationalisation (though I do support limited nationalisation of certain industries), I don't believe equality is realistically achievable, however I am in favour of the welfare state and creating equality of opportunity, I do believe in big government and using government to reduce poverty and help the worst off in our society. I disagree with some left wing views and support others, but believe 'left-wing' encompasses the beliefs I hold. It works like this Far Left --- Left Wing --- Centre-Left --- Centrist --- Centre Right --- Right Wing --- Far Right Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jmothecat Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 It works like this Far Left --- Left Wing --- Centre-Left --- Centrist --- Centre Right --- Right Wing --- Far Right Everything left of centre I would put under the umbrella of 'left wing'. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Council elections are traditionally more to do with personal votes and local issues than the colour of rosette. That's why independents are far more likely to be elected to councils than they are to parliament. That used tae be the case pre SNP but councils are increasingly becoming political and personal votes are oot the windae. I voted last Thursday in a council bye-election and my guy won. I couldnae tell ye his name as all I looked for was the SNP symbol. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wee Willie Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Everything left of centre I would put under the umbrella of 'left wing'. Fair doos. So wid I. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Bairn Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 That used tae be the case pre SNP but councils are increasingly becoming political and personal votes are oot the windae. I voted last Thursday in a council bye-election and my guy won. I couldnae tell ye his name as all I looked for was the SNP symbol. That's your choice, and probably extrapolated a bit in the case of a by-election that coincides with a national poll, however in the case of a council election where people actually need to be motivated to go and vote the clear trend is that personal votes are vvvvvv relevant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jim McLean's Ghost Posted May 12, 2015 Share Posted May 12, 2015 Council elections are traditionally more to do with personal votes and local issues than the colour of rosette. That's why independents are far more likely to be elected to councils than they are to parliament. The majority don't really care about council elections so you would think it would be easier for a personal vote to be a factor. However with the current Scottish Council elections it is more important to be at the top of the party list on the ballot with some councillors going as far as changing names and rigging which more junior party members are in their ward. It is very much a still voting for a political party. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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