James Connolly

[Glenconner]

It actually didn't:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_Crisis_of_1918

A very "Irish" crisis, blown completely out of proportion by various competing shades of Irish Nationalism.

Even today everything is still a crisis.

Talk about political drama queens.

Conscription was never happening.

[NotThePars]

It actually didn't:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscription_Crisis_of_1918

All that really showed was just how close the Entente came to ruin if the war continued into 1919.

[Grim O'Grady]

Because we are taught at school to look at the Easter Rising in isolation then we can justify it's failure, the way that everyone has done so far.

The truth of the matter is that the whole of Europe during the 1st world war period & after was in socialist revolutionary turmoil. The actual failure was that the stronger organized working class nations did not support or follow what happened in Ireland & Russia. Had the British & German working classes revolted it would have been a completely different outcome. The ruling class's nationalistic fervor at the time won the war for war, with "your country needs you", had there been an equal force urging "your class needs you", then who knows what might have happened?

The best example of capitalism was the case of what happened in Russia a year after the Easter Rising. When the white armies were sent in to combat the red armies. The white armies were an unholy alliance of "allies", whilst the British & German armies fought bloody battles against each other in the Somme etc, over in Russia they fought side by side against the red army.

So to me at least, Connolly is a working class hero.

The lessons are there to be learnt.

Grimbo

[Elixir]

Jhames Chonnolly.

[LongTimeLurker]

Think what Grim is overlooking is that there was zero socialist content in the Easter Rising. All Connolly and co basically did was to provide some of the cannon fodder to the radical Irish nationalist movement that was setting the agenda.

[Jacksgranda]

Because we are taught at school to look at the Easter Rising in isolation then we can justify it's failure, the way that everyone has done so far.

The truth of the matter is that the whole of Europe during the 1st world war period & after was in socialist revolutionary turmoil. The actual failure was that the stronger organized working class nations did not support or follow what happened in Ireland & Russia. Had the British & German working classes revolted it would have been a completely different outcome. The ruling class's nationalistic fervor at the time won the war for war, with "your country needs you", had there been an equal force urging "your class needs you", then who knows what might have happened?

The best example of capitalism was the case of what happened in Russia a year after the Easter Rising. When the white armies were sent in to combat the red armies. The white armies were an unholy alliance of "allies", whilst the British & German armies fought bloody battles against each other in the Somme etc, over in Russia they fought side by side against the red army.

So to me at least, Connolly is a working class hero.

The lessons are there to be learnt.

Grimbo

Probably.

But had there been no Easter Rebellion it might have been a completely different outcome, too.

[RedRob72]

Recall there's a statue of him in Union Park, Chicago?

[Antiochas III]

Recall there's a statue of him in Union Park, Chicago?

You recall correctly.

[John Lambies Doos]

Recall there's a statue of him in Union Park, Chicago?

Should be one of him in Scotland also imo

[glasgow-sheep]

The Herald re-printed an article Ian Bell wrote about him recently. There was/is a plaque in Edinburgh somewhere but it was ripped down as quickly as it was put up by some upset Loyalists.

[Glenconner]

Probably.

But had there been no Easter Rebellion it might have been a completely different outcome, too.

Probably only difference from Easter 1916 would have been the guns would have came out later than they did.

[John Lambies Doos]

Had 2 days to live in agony before he died of gangrene and the brits shoot him in his wheelchair. What a bunch of fannies

[Grim O'Grady]

Had 2 days to live in agony before he died of gangrene and the brits shoot him in his wheelchair. What a bunch of fannies

The sick b*****ds you would have thought they could have at least aimed for his body?

Grimbo

[LongTimeLurker]

Probably only difference from Easter 1916 would have been the guns would have came out later than they did.

If WWI had been over by Christmas, things probably would not have gone over the brink where actually using weapons was concerned. Suspect Scotland would have been independent decades ago under that scenario in a customs union type arrangement with the other states of the British Isles. The self-governing Dominions of the empire would have been the precedent on that.

[Crùbag]

Connolly was a good man IMHO. From what I know, he sought to unite workers of both religions in Ireland against the bosses and had no time for sectarianism.

The British, like in many other places in the world, didn't cover themselves in glory in Ireland.

[Glenconner]

If WWI had been over by Christmas, things probably would not have gone over the brink where actually using weapons was concerned. Suspect Scotland would have been independent decades ago under that scenario in a customs union type arrangement with the other states of the British Isles. The self-governing Dominions of the empire would have been the precedent on that.

There might well have been an Easter Rising under those conditions probably in Belfast and not by Irish Nationalists.

Ulster Unionism would never have excepted Home Rule from Dublin.

[Jacksgranda]

There might well have been an Easter Rising under those conditions probably in Belfast and not by Irish Nationalists.

Ulster Unionism would never have excepted Home Rule from Dublin.

That's exactly what Ulster Unionists did.

[LongTimeLurker]

Ulster Unionism would never have excepted Home Rule from Dublin.

...which clearly would still have led to two legislatures of some description in Dublin and Belfast. The Liberals and Conservatives allowed the Irish Nationalists (making no concessions whatsoever to Ulster Unionist sentiment was never going to work, why not concede a reasonable level of constitutionally entrenched autonomy?) and Ulster Unionists (pains me to say it as I have some Donegal Unionist ancestry and grew up listening to the bitterness and sense of betrayal that resulted, but pushing for a nine county breakaway in 1912 was completely mental, because it involved taking in huge swathes of countryside that were overwhelmingly pro-Irish nationalist) to push their maximum demands at Westminster, because of the winner takes all nature of Westminster FPTP democracy once a majority is cobbled together.

Neither side really wanted war under the leaderships that were in place in 1912, so eventually, if negotiations had not been stalled by the Archduke getting shot and put on the back burner for the duration of WWI, somebody would have blinked and some sort of compromise would have been reached. Devolution all round would have been the answer to the WLQ and Scotland would have long since been independent by now within some sort of mini-EU customs union "Commonwealth".

[Phil1870]

Iconic figure in my eyes. His belief in Irish freedom from Britain resulted in his ICA being involved in the Rising. Sadly the Ireland he envisaged, or that of any of the executed leaders for that matter, has never materialised. Very little socialism in the Irish parliament.

[Ashman]

Iconic figure in my eyes. His belief in Irish freedom from Britain resulted in his ICA being involved in the Rising. Sadly the Ireland he envisaged, or that of any of the executed leaders for that matter, has never materialised. Very little socialism in the Irish parliament.

Let me tell you something . Revolutions always disappoint regardless .