Groups E and F: The Final Countdown

[1320Lichtie]

Northern Ireland I agree though.

[Need2Speak2Caesar]

No

ROI have a better team. It's so fucking easy to see its scary you can't.

That's debatable mate.

Head to head we took 4 from 6 against them.

Yes ,they took points from the Germans and we never.

They got a win in Georgia and we messed it up.

There is not a lot between us and the ROI.

[Ira Gaines]

Hahaha now I know you're trolling

Their manager is a massive part of their success and his assistant. Both have openly repeatedly said that the team is good enough to do anything. Neither has bemoaned quality and both have been nothing but confident.

That runs through the team and the way they win games and win points is proof of that. They're an example of a team who play beyond their limits because there's people there who bring that out.

[Ira Gaines]

Ireland are around our level btw. They're not so much better at all. The only reason this myth is being pushed is for the Scotland fanboys to defend Strachan.

[1320Lichtie]

Ireland are around our level btw. They're not so much better at all. The only reason this myth is being pushed is for the Scotland fanboys to defend Strachan.

They're not that much better but they're definitely better.

Strachan doesn't need defending. He has the fans backing.

[Ira Gaines]

They're not that much better but they're definitely better.

Strachan doesn't need defending. He has the fans backing.

Which is because there's so many fucking thick fanboys defending him. Defending failure. Accepting mediocrity.

[1320Lichtie]

Which is because there's so many fucking thick fanboys defending him. Defending failure. Accepting mediocrity.

Nobody is accepting it

People are just being realistic. You would've taken every single result we got before the qualifying campaign started minus Georgia away.

I'm not a fanboy either. If he left in the next half hour I wouldn't bat an eyelid. But changing manager will solve absolutely nothing well still have the same mediocre players to pick from.

We were one win off Georgia from a near perfect campaign.

[Ira Gaines]

You're a fanboy. And I don't accept five points from Georgia, Poland and Germany. Would never have taken that.

[1320Lichtie]

You're a fanboy. And I don't accept five points from Georgia, Poland and Germany. Would never have taken that.

Anything off Germany a bonus. In a similar way that a Spanish team getting anything off Barca or Madrid would be a bonus. They're the world champions and a million miles better than we are all over the park.

Poland. Again. Better team than us. Could've easily taken 2 defeats. Not letting them get the better of us was ok, could've been better could've been worse.

Georgia. Should've been 6.

Eta: how much do you think we should've taken off Germany and Poland? If you add that amount to the 3 that I agree on we should've taken off Germany then we would've probably won the group.

You're being very realistic.

[Savage Henry]

Which is because there's so many fucking thick fanboys defending him. Defending failure. Accepting mediocrity.

I'd suggest the tide is turning in that regard.  Whether that's fair or not, clearly there's not going to be agreement.  But I don't think the ordinary punter has the same trust in Strachan than they did when he took over.  He was, of course, an upgrade over Levein. 

 

Scotland will need to over perform to ever qualify for anything again.  Those who apologise for Strachan basically accept that we can't qualify for tournaments. 

 

McGregor/Marshall/Gordon

 

Coleman

Duffy

Martin

Robertson

 

Ritchie

Morrison

Fletcher

McCarthy

Anya

Long

 

 

You could argue one or two positions, but that seems a reasonable composite side.  I'd say that's a tie there.  There's a baw hair between the two sides, but on the whole I'd take the Scotland squad over the Irish squad.  

Edited to include the right player.

[1320Lichtie]

I'd suggest the tide is turning in that regard. Whether that's fair or not, clearly there's not going to be agreement. But I don't think the ordinary punter has the same trust in Strachan than they did when he took over. He was, of course, an upgrade over Levein.

Scotland will need to over perform to ever qualify for anything again. Those who apologise for Strachan basically accept that we can't qualify for tournaments.

McGregor/Marshall/Gordon

Coleman

Duffy

Martin

Robertson

Phillips

Morrison

Fletcher

McCarthy

Anya

Long

You could argue one or two positions, but that seems a reasonable composite side. I'd say that's a tie there. There's a baw hair between the two sides, but on the whole I'd take the Scotland squad over the Irish squad.

:lol:

That team.

[Savage Henry]

I don't think the draw against Poland at home was a good result at all.  Or the draw in Ireland.  Six points from those two games and a point in Georgie (at least, and probably another win) would have been a good campaign.  Anything on top of that would have been a bonus - and it requires teams to get bonuses to qualify.  

[Ira Gaines]

Lots of bonuses going to teams who didn't lose to Germany in qualifying. Poland aren't great shakes. Ireland are poor. Yet Germany basically use us to qualify because we're the ones they can beat.

Miles ahead. f**k off. They were poor in qualifying and if we had belief, we could take something. But Strachan believes we're limited and lack quality. So the team believed it too

[Savage Henry]

:lol:

That team.

Great insight.  Marvellous stuff. 

[1320Lichtie]

I don't think the draw against Poland at home was a good result at all. Or the draw in Ireland. Six points from those two games and a point in Georgie (at least, and probably another win) would have been a good campaign. Anything on top of that would have been a bonus - and it requires teams to get bonuses to qualify.

Would've left the group

Germany 22

Scotland 22

Poland 20

Ireland 16

Georgia 6

Gibraltar 0

Suppose finishing on the same points as Germany would qualify as 'good'...

Just the 6 from 6 against Ireland, Georgia, Gibraltar and 4 from 6 against Poland.

Delusional

[Savage Henry]

Would've left the group

Germany 22

Scotland 22

Poland 20

Ireland 16

Georgia 6

Gibraltar 0

Suppose finishing on the same points as Germany would qualify as 'good'...

Just the 6 from 6 against Ireland, Georgia, Gibraltar and 4 from 6 against Poland.

Delusional

 

Yup.  Scotland got a point in Poland which was arguably unexpected.    Chalk that down as a loss.  Germany, of course, dropped points to Ireland and took six off Scotland.  

The point is, over performing is the only way Scotland will qualify for anything.  In that group, Germany underperformed, Ireland over performed, Poland did roughly as well as you'd expect and Scotland underperformed.  

[1320Lichtie]

Yup. Scotland got a point in Poland which was arguably unexpected. Chalk that down as a loss. Germany, of course, dropped points to Ireland and took six off Scotland.

The point is, over performing is the only way Scotland will qualify for anything. In that group, Germany underperformed, Ireland over performed, Poland did roughly as well as you'd expect and Scotland underperformed.

Scotland did under perform. In one game only IMO. And that's how small the margins are when you're a team like us.

There's no point arguing this too much cause it could last all day.

Absolutely nobody, definitely not me anyway is accepting what happened. It was disappointing, however a variety of things has made this seem a lot worse than it is including, they 2 pointless run abouts we got from Italy and France, the other nations all qualifying, the other nations all then getting to the last 16 and the fact we haven't been anywhere near a tournament for 20 year.

If you break it down logically into a single campaign, a single group and took it result by result, it wasn't too bad. Just my opinion.

Strachan wins in Georgia, none of this would be getting spoke about.

[Jamaldo]

We could start by playing regular friendlies against the likes of Macedonia, Lithuania, Georgia etc. These are the games that completely undo our campaigns. But no, the SFA and Strachan would rather get horsed by France in a pointless match that has almost no benefits whatsoever.

[Diamonds are Forever]

I'd suggest the tide is turning in that regard. Whether that's fair or not, clearly there's not going to be agreement. But I don't think the ordinary punter has the same trust in Strachan than they did when he took over. He was, of course, an upgrade over Levein.

Scotland will need to over perform to ever qualify for anything again. Those who apologise for Strachan basically accept that we can't qualify for tournaments.

McGregor/Marshall/Gordon

Coleman

Duffy

Martin

Robertson

Ritchie

Morrison

Fletcher

McCarthy

Anya

Long

You could argue one or two positions, but that seems a reasonable composite side. I'd say that's a tie there. There's a baw hair between the two sides, but on the whole I'd take the Scotland squad over the Irish squad.

Edited to include the right player.

Brady is a better player at left back than Robertson. He kept him out the team a lot of the time at Hull and then got a move back to the Premier League when they got relegated. Albeit Norwich are now back down, but Brady will get a move back up if he wants it. Martin would never be in the team. Ireland's back 4 is significantly better than ours, look at the goals conceded in the last campaign compared to ours, that is what really matters at international level. They were able to grind out results against Germany and we weren't because our back line is so poor. Even Northern Ireland's back 4 is better than ours.

[Lex]

I don't remember anyone calling it the Group of Death when the draw for qualifying was made.

Aye. The draw thread was bumped a few months ago.

The reaction on here at the time was it was a pretty good draw and we should be getting at least third.

It only became the group of death when it was clear we were getting papped out.