Fullerene Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 11 hours ago, Granny Danger said: I reckon if she had turned around and punched him in the pus he would have crumbled. Whatever I think of Soubry I would have liked to see her doing that. Then putting the boot in a few times. Some people on here tie themselves in knots when it comes to Anna Soubry. "She is a Tory therefore I can't say anything nice about her." I don't have the same problem. Anna Soubry thinks Margaret Thatcher was a wonderful person, a wonderful leader, a wonderful prime minister and a wonderful role model. I suspect I would disagree with her on a lot of things. However her role in the EU debate is not about me or people like me. She thinks it would be better if we stayed in the EU and so do I. Maybe for completely different reasons - it doesn't matter. Her target audience is Tory voters, people who have no problem with a lot of the things that people on this forum oppose. She wants those Tory voters to support a second referendum and then vote Remain. A Tory voter voting Remain is just as useful as any other voter voting Remain. Some people still get upset. "If I agree with her on one thing, then I agree with her on everything." - No. The only person who agrees with me on everything is me - and even then I sometimes change my mind. If Winston Churchill was willing to sign a pact with the Devil to defeat Hitler then I would say the same about Anna Soubry regarding to EU. Not sure if she would like the comparison. 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 30 minutes ago, Fullerene said: Some people on here tie themselves in knots when it comes to Anna Soubry. "She is a Tory therefore I can't say anything nice about her." I don't have the same problem. Anna Soubry thinks Margaret Thatcher was a wonderful person, a wonderful leader, a wonderful prime minister and a wonderful role model. I suspect I would disagree with her on a lot of things. However her role in the EU debate is not about me or people like me. She thinks it would be better if we stayed in the EU and so do I. Maybe for completely different reasons - it doesn't matter. Her target audience is Tory voters, people who have no problem with a lot of the things that people on this forum oppose. She wants those Tory voters to support a second referendum and then vote Remain. A Tory voter voting Remain is just as useful as any other voter voting Remain. Some people still get upset. "If I agree with her on one thing, then I agree with her on everything." - No. The only person who agrees with me on everything is me - and even then I sometimes change my mind. If Winston Churchill was willing to sign a pact with the Devil to defeat Hitler then I would say the same about Anna Soubry regarding to EU. Not sure if she would like the comparison. Totally agree. I am sure even the most obnoxious person I could name has at one time made a statement that I could agree with. Agreeing with somone on a specific issue does not make them any more correct on other matters, nor does it compromise you in your ability to disagree with them on anything (or everything) else. Brexit will only be defeated in Parliament if enough Tories vote against it. Unpalatable but true. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Shit's hitting the fan in the Commons. https://twitter.com/Steven_Swinford/status/1082953242127028224 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harry94 Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 27 minutes ago, welshbairn said: Shit's hitting the fan in the Commons. https://twitter.com/Steven_Swinford/status/1082953242127028224 There were some names on it which surprised me. I half wonder if the government are kind of daring it forward in the hope that it makes May's deal more likely. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Bercow refusing to confirm or deny that this procedure is a one time only deal. As soon as he refuses an amendment to a business motion in the future he'll have to step down. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonwell Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 So the Gov now need to publish ‘Plan B’ within 3 sitting days (a week) rather than 4 weeks in the event of the Gov losing the meaningful vote. Government arses will be going like the clappers. I’ve been of the opinion for a while that we’re heading to a second EU Ref, but as ever it’s a fool who makes a prediction on these things. The questions with a 2nd EU ref start with, what’s on the ballot paper? How will the inevitable need to extend article 50 tie in with EU elections and the muddy waters that brings? Fun times 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonwell Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 2 hours ago, harry94 said: There were some names on it which surprised me. I half wonder if the government are kind of daring it forward in the hope that it makes May's deal more likely. It doesn’t make Mays deal more likely. It got voted through with a majority of 11, if anything it shows that the idea her deal will get through is pretty fanciful. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lofarl Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Tell you what UK politics are fucking brilliant eh. Much rather have independence referendums, EU referendums, snap elections, raging gammons, people’s votes and stealing maces from parliament than the boring mundane shite that probably happens in Swiss politics. Probably debating new public lavatory dimensions or something. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glasgow-sheep Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 Do they Swiss not have referenda every other week? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zidane's child Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 24 minutes ago, Londonwell said: So the Gov now need to publish ‘Plan B’ within 3 sitting days (a week) rather than 4 weeks in the event of the Gov losing the meaningful vote. What's the bet there is no Plan B? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 4 minutes ago, Lofarl said: Tell you what UK politics are fucking brilliant eh. Much rather have independence referendums, EU referendums, snap elections, raging gammons, people’s votes and stealing maces from parliament than the boring mundane shite that probably happens in Swiss politics. Probably debating new public lavatory dimensions or something. They had a referendum on that back in 2005. Don't tell me they are having another one. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 15 minutes ago, zidane's child said: What's the bet there is no Plan B? If/when they are defeated the government will surely just say the plan B is to renegotiate. The only way we don't leave at the end of March is if May performs the ultimate U turn. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zidane's child Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 5 minutes ago, Detournement said: If/when they are defeated the government will surely just say the plan B is to renegotiate. The only way we don't leave at the end of March is if May performs the ultimate U turn. Fair point but the EU's stance has always been that May's current "deal" is the only option and cannot be amended/renegotiated. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 (edited) 4 minutes ago, zidane's child said: Fair point but the EU's stance has always been that May's current "deal" is the only option and cannot be amended/renegotiated. All the Grieve amendment requires is a plan of action, whether it's practical or possible doesn't matter. Edited January 9, 2019 by Detournement 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NotThePars Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 33 minutes ago, Lofarl said: Tell you what UK politics are fucking brilliant eh. Much rather have independence referendums, EU referendums, snap elections, raging gammons, people’s votes and stealing maces from parliament than the boring mundane shite that probably happens in Swiss politics. Probably debating new public lavatory dimensions or something. Denying women the vote and working out how best to distribute Nazi gold presumably. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonwell Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 (edited) 2 hours ago, zidane's child said: What's the bet there is no Plan B? Well let's look at their options (if meaningful vote fails): General Election- Doesn't really solve anything and fixed term parliament act means it needs 70% parliamentary support. Another deal- EU have said they won't budge, May has tried and failed since postponing the initial meaningful vote to renegotiate parts of her deal. Doesn't look good. No deal Brexit- There isn't the support for this in Parliament as shown by the vote yesterday, but it is a default if nothing else happens. I think Parliament would move hell and high water to avoid this scenario. and that leaves us with... 2nd EU Ref. This is far from not having obstacles or questions around it either but imo the most likely outcome. Edited January 9, 2019 by Londonwell 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 45 minutes ago, glasgow-sheep said: Do they Swiss not have referenda every other week? I will ask them. 42 minutes ago, zidane's child said: What's the bet there is no Plan B? There’s barely a Plan A. It took May almost two and a half years to negotiate a plan that is universally unpopular amongst Brexiteers and Remainers alike. Corbyn could have done better. (Yes I really mean that). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted January 9, 2019 Author Share Posted January 9, 2019 Do they Swiss not have referenda every other week? Nah, that's the Irish 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londonwell Posted January 9, 2019 Share Posted January 9, 2019 14 minutes ago, John Lambies Doos said: 1 hour ago, glasgow-sheep said: Do they Swiss not have referenda every other week? Nah, that's the Irish Direct democracy is a key point of Swiss politics. They do have referenda on a much more regular basis than we do. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted January 9, 2019 Author Share Posted January 9, 2019 Direct democracy is a key point of Swiss politics. They do have referenda on a much more regular basis than we do. Agree, but the Irish have a few per yr too. Any change to their constitution must be ratified by the people. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.