Kev Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: Far too simplistic a view I'm afraid. We are 4th after having a commanding lead in 3rd. Our recent form is beyond awful, he looked like he'd lost the capacity to get a reaction from the players. He'd lost the support. Even a lot of our wins weren't good performances and could have went another way. He was backed heavily to open a bigger gap between 3rd and given the runs some of our rivals went on he should have seen us in a better position. His presence would have affected ST sales and if we invest in the summer, which we probably will, do you trust him to do the best with it? He also doesn't integrate youth players, and plays favourites. I wouldn't have been surprised to see the board keep him on, but it's far from a mental decision. Yeah fair enough, as I said in another reply I’ve not seen so enough to honestly give a full opinion. Getting sacked for being 4th instead of 3rd just seems harsh as f**k! If he had been kept on though did you see next season being a relegation battle? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wonder Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, Kev said: I’ll be honest I’ve not watched enough of your games to make an honest assessment I’m just commenting on the current league status. I know you could easily drop to 5th by next week but have performances actually been that bad?! It sets a precedent, can you’s really afford to be sacking a manager every time you’re on a poor run? Especially when you’re going to finish top 6 regardless? It's not like it's his first bad run, bear in mind he was under severe pressure after the Brora defeat and the club backed him. He's been in charge for nearly 3 full seasons. He's done pretty well overall but he's also constantly preaching about taking us to thw next level while making us markedly worse than we were last year. You can't insist in public that's what you're trying to do while serving up the pish he is. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Falcor Roar Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 10 minutes ago, kingjoey said: By the posts of folk on here, I really don't think so. I think it's that nobody cares. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AyrshireTon Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 Announce Gus. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 10 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: It's not like it's his first bad run, bear in mind he was under severe pressure after the Brora defeat and the club backed him. He's been in charge for nearly 3 full seasons. He's done pretty well overall but he's also constantly preaching about taking us to thw next level while making us markedly worse than we were last year. You can't insist in public that's what you're trying to do while serving up the pish he is. What were his other bad runs?! His two previous seasons were a promotion and then a 3rd place finish by a country mile ffs! Aye mangers that spout sound bites about the next level are cringe but wtaf do non old firm teams expect these days? Finishing 3rd is the absolute best you’ll achieve, (maybe a cup if you’re lucky) unfortunately you’ll always have the odd season with a dip in form, if that starts looking like heading to a relegation battle then yeah bag the manager. To sack a manger that’s had you 3rd all season then suffered a bad dip in form which can always happen is just embarrassing imo 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DC92 Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 7 minutes ago, Kev said: Sacked for sitting 4th before the split instead of 3rd is fucking mental regardless of the recent run! Unless you think that form is going to continue into the next season and result in bonifide relegation material then fair enough but imo it seems like the board heard ott fan reactions yesterday and utterly shat it! Can’t help but think some other usual merry-go-round name will be in charge and you’ll be in the same position next season regardless. If you look at everything purely on the surface level and only consider the question of whether he "deserves" to be sacked, then you could say it's mental. If you look at the trend in results and performances, analyse the reasons for that trend, and then consider the financial difference between finishing 3rd and not, it's a completely rational decision. No-one can look at our recent results and performances, the visible arguments between players and manager, and the atmosphere among the fans, and conclude that we're likely to turn things around in time to finish 3rd. Neilson has recovered from similar situations before, but he's needed a summer refresh to do so. On the other hand, we're 2 points behind Aberdeen and 5 of our remaining 7 games will be in Edinburgh. I think Aberdeen have 3 home games left and 2 of those are against the OF. It might well be too late, but the opportunity is definitely there if we can reset ourselves a bit. That would seem a very remote possibility under Neilson but it's plausible a new approach will give us the short-term boost needed, as it has done with Motherwell and Aberdeen recently. If that happens it'll be worth millions of pounds and would give us a good platform to appoint a better manager in the summer. If it doesn't happen then fine. Come the summer we'd have had to face the choice of binning Neilson or losing a chunk of fan revenue/goodwill anyway. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wonder Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, Kev said: What were his other bad runs?! His two previous seasons were a promotion and then a 3rd place finish by a country mile ffs! Aye mangers that spout sound bites about the next level are cringe but wtaf do non old firm teams expect these days? Finishing 3rd is the absolute best you’ll achieve, (maybe a cup if you’re lucky) unfortunately you’ll always have the odd season with a dip in form, if that starts looking like heading to a relegation battle then yeah bag the manager. To sack a manger that’s had you 3rd all season then suffered a bad dip in form which can always happen is just embarrassing imo In the Championship season we got knocked out the league cup to Alloa, had our worst ever SC result to Brora and either side of that game we picked up 2 points from 9 and his reaction to the Brora defeat was to lose in comical fashion at home to QotS. He was under huge pressure then and pretty much only survived because the club decided to stick with him. A lot of the fans didn't want him back and would happily have binned him then. This season we've lost 20 games. There have been mitigating circumstances for some of that, but it's really not good enough with the backing he's had. There was no sign whatsoever he could arrest this slide. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 30 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: It's not like it's his first bad run, bear in mind he was under severe pressure after the Brora defeat and the club backed him. He's been in charge for nearly 3 full seasons. He's done pretty well overall but he's also constantly preaching about taking us to thw next level while making us markedly worse than we were last year. You can't insist in public that's what you're trying to do while serving up the pish he is. The thing about it not being his first bad run cuts both ways given that the previous bad runs all came to an end so it’s entirely reasonable to suggest that this one was likely to finish soon as well 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wonder Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 3 minutes ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: The thing about it not being his first bad run cuts both ways given that the previous bad runs all came to an end so it’s entirely reasonable to suggest that this one was likely to finish soon as well I get that argument, but this felt different IMO. Fans had turned properly, last time they couldn't attend games. Also felt like watching yesterday he'd lost the players and he's really struggled to get a reaction. I also thought he looked beaten in his post match interview yesterday, like he knew it was time. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kev Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 11 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: In the Championship season we got knocked out the league cup to Alloa, had our worst ever SC result to Brora and either side of that game we picked up 2 points from 9 and his reaction to the Brora defeat was to lose in comical fashion at home to QotS. He was under huge pressure then and pretty much only survived because the club decided to stick with him. A lot of the fans didn't want him back and would happily have binned him then. This season we've lost 20 games. There have been mitigating circumstances for some of that, but it's really not good enough with the backing he's had. There was no sign whatsoever he could arrest this slide. Ooft fair enough that’s a damning stat for a team with Hearts’ budget 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1GregStewart Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 59 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: Far too simplistic a view I'm afraid. We are 4th after having a commanding lead in 3rd. Our recent form is beyond awful, he looked like he'd lost the capacity to get a reaction from the players. He'd lost the support. Even a lot of our wins weren't good performances and could have went another way. He was backed heavily to open a bigger gap between 3rd and given the runs some of our rivals went on he should have seen us in a better position. His presence would have affected ST sales and if we invest in the summer, which we probably will, do you trust him to do the best with it? He also doesn't integrate youth players, and plays favourites. I wouldn't have been surprised to see the board keep him on, but it's far from a mental decision. Would it really affect ST sales? Thought there’s a waiting list of thousands? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thenorthernlight Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 55 minutes ago, Falcor Roar said: I think it's that nobody cares. Meeowww 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VincentGuerin Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 (edited) Good news, and the right decision. Perhaps and encouraging sign that sensible voices can win out in our boardroom. He absolutely had to go, and now he has. Draw a line and move on. As well as the new Head Coach, there are other issues around the club that need to be addressed. FoH is a great concept, but we're not quite getting it right at the moment, and I hope that over the summer there can be a full reassessment of how we're organising and running the club. Recruitment and Youth Development need to be looked at, as do who exactly has a voice at boardroom level and how that is decided, as I don't think we're getting the best out of our club at the moment. Edited April 9, 2023 by VincentGuerin 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony Wonder Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 9 minutes ago, 1GregStewart said: Would it really affect ST sales? Thought there’s a waiting list of thousands? Yes absolutely. The group stage stuff this season created a demand and it was effectively the only way to guarantee a ticket. No danger we sell 16k ST's if we finish 5th this year and Robbie was still in charge. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 21 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: I get that argument, but this felt different IMO. Fans had turned properly, last time they couldn't attend games. Also felt like watching yesterday he'd lost the players and he's really struggled to get a reaction. I also thought he looked beaten in his post match interview yesterday, like he knew it was time. I’m on Holiday down south so I missed yesterday’s game it didn’t look so bad from the highlights but I know that can be deceptive Of course if this managerial change works out for the best I’ll claim to have actually been one of the ones who boycotted the St Mirren match, forcing Robbie out, saving the club and ushering in a new era of not finishing fourth 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ya Bezzer! Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 Interesting that Rangers, Aberdeen and Hearts, currently 2nd, 3rd and 4th have all fired their manager while St Johnstone, kilmarnock and Ross County currently 9th, 10th and 11th haven't. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VincentGuerin Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 5 minutes ago, Tony Wonder said: Yes absolutely. The group stage stuff this season created a demand and it was effectively the only way to guarantee a ticket. No danger we sell 16k ST's if we finish 5th this year and Robbie was still in charge. Aye. We sold almost 16k on the back of third in the league, a cup final, and guaranteed group stage fitba. Of course there's a drop off if the team goes backwards. I don't think we drop to 10k or anything, but letting things drop away quickly squanders a lot of good work. Hugely frustrating season. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Molotov Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 1 minute ago, topcat(The most tip top) said: I’m on Holiday down south so I missed yesterday’s game it didn’t look so bad from the highlights but I know that can be deceptive The highlights were very deceptive. St Mirren performed much better than what was shown. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
topcat(The most tip top) Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 2 minutes ago, Molotov said: The highlights were very deceptive. St Mirren performed much better than what was shown. Just as well I boycotted the game then 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
naegoodinthedark Posted April 9, 2023 Share Posted April 9, 2023 Sacking your manager because you drop below The Famous in the league is just lovely. How’s Elixir? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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