Russian invasion of Ukraine

[Guest]

Even if he did survive that strike was still a huge success. The war criminals won't have enjoyed it.

[LongTimeLurker]

The fall out from the Canadian parliament gaffe continues:

Having lived and worked in Canada my experience has been that it's better to assume incompetence rather than malice in these situations because a lot of people who grew up in Canada are basically completely clueless about anything that happens outside North America and their mundane suburban Wayne's World type existance. Once they get it into their heads that the Ukrainians are the good guys they'll just assume that has always been the case basically. More nuanced stuff like the Ukrainians are generally the good guys in this conflict but some of them have some very dubious baggage from the WWII era and badly need to give all the wolfsangel and black sun symbolism a rest is lost on them.

Edited September 27, 2023 by LongTimeLurker

[Todd_is_God]

1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said:

The fall out from the Canadian parliament gaffe continues:

Having lived and worked in Canada my experience has been that it's better to assume incompetence rather than malice in these situations because a lot of people who grew up in Canada are basically completely clueless about anything that happens outside North America and their mundane suburban Wayne's World type existance. Once they get it into their heads that the Ukrainians are the good guys they'll just assume that has always been the case basically. More nuanced stuff like the Ukrainians are generally the good guys in this conflict but some of them have some very dubious baggage from the WWII era and badly need to give all the wolfsangel and black sun symbolism a rest is lost on them.

How is that any different to here?

[TxRover]

Lovely rumours and questions swirling in the aftermath of the Crimea missile strike. Ukrainian Special Forces have possibly played a blinder here. So now the word is out that there is a rumour circulating in Crimea that a group of Russian Officers, who hadn’t been paid in some time, sold the information on the meeting time and attendees to USF, via a nebulous partisan group. Here’s the beauty…it doesn’t matter how USF got the info to strike the meeting, this will hurt the Russian military and supporters.

So, what does Russia do now, they assign some counter-intelligence people to look into this. Will they find something, oh yes they will…if they don’t, the paranoia will result in those people being blamed as in league with the traitors. Did some Russian Officers sell the data, perhaps…is there a partisan organization there, maybe…did Captain Ivan toss a meeting agenda in the trash where Custodian Olena finds it while cleaning up his office, it’s possible…has USF tapped into Russian comms, could be. If counter-intelligence visits, they’ll find someone to blame so they won’t be blamed. They will cause worry and talk among Russian military personnel, the lower ranks will fear being blamed because that’s how it normally works, and so will report all sorts of minor things they’ve seen officers doing, because once you are looking for something suspicious, everything can be suspicious. The officers will fall over narcing out each other to protect themselves…a whole bunch of units will get new officers, resulting in lower efficiency for a while…and Vlad gets more worried about his position and the people around HIM. Bravo.

[TheScarf]

20 hours ago, beefybake said:

 

Utter disgrace.

Why? They'll be in the same boat as the Russian and Belorussian tennis players. Allowed to enter but as neutral competitors.

[The DA]

Legitimate target?

 

[LongTimeLurker]

2 hours ago, Todd_is_God said:

How is that any different to here?

Think most people in the UK with a career progressing to parliamentary speaker sort of level would be clued in enough to realise that checking if there is a Waffen SS angle would be a good move when dealing with a geriatric Ukrainian who fought against "the Russians" during WWII. That's why some people are assuming there was malice rather than incompetence involved in this incident. I once made a sarcastic comment in a bar in Canada when drinking with a Celtic supporter that Scotland's legal system forces Roman Catholics to wear green and white hoops when out in public so they can be identified more easily after a comment was made as to why he appeared to wear that close to 24/7. Nobody in their right mind could possibly believe that and everybody would grasp it was a joke you might think? From what I was later told, the next day one of the people who was there was telling anyone who would listen about how outrageous Scotland's legal system is until somebody finally explained to her that it was only a football jersey. This was somebody with a university education.

[Guest]

I'm unsure if we can so quickly excuse the likes of Trudeau and Chrystia Freeland on grounds of ignorance. Freeland lied about her own grandfather, a Ukrainian Nazi propagandist in Poland. She's also been intimately involved with Ukrainian Canadian Congress attempts to revise the history of the Holodomor. With Trudeau, his father Pierre explicitly stated the Canadian government should overlook the crimes of Latvian, Lithuanian and Ukrainian Nazis in Canada for fear of upsetting their corresponding ethnic communities. (What he meant there, of course, was he feared losing votes from these communities were he to cross them). Pierre Trudeau is mentioned in this:

Edited September 27, 2023 by FreedomFarter

[Todd_is_God]

1 hour ago, LongTimeLurker said:

Think most people in the UK with a career progressing to parliamentary speaker sort of level would be clued in enough to realise that checking if there is a Waffen SS angle would be a good move when dealing with a geriatric Ukrainian who fought against "the Russians" during WWII. That's why some people are assuming there was malice rather than incompetence involved in this incident. I once made a sarcastic comment in a bar in Canada when drinking with a Celtic supporter that Scotland's legal system forces Roman Catholics to wear green and white hoops when out in public so they can be identified more easily after a comment was made as to why he appeared to wear that close to 24/7. Nobody in their right mind could possibly believe that and everybody would grasp it was a joke you might think? From what I was later told, the next day one of the people who was there was telling anyone who would listen about how outrageous Scotland's legal system is until somebody finally explained to her that it was only a football jersey. This was somebody with a university education.

Whilst I don't necessarily disagree with what you've said above I think it's also fair to say that this is slightly more nuanced than the sweeping generalisation you gave earlier.

[LongTimeLurker]

55 minutes ago, FreedomFarter said:

I'm unsure if we can so quickly excuse the likes of Trudeau and Chrystia Freeland on grounds of ignorance. Freeland lied about her own grandfather, a Ukrainian Nazi propagandist in Poland. She's also been intimately involved with Ukrainian Canadian Congress attempts to revise the history of the Holodomor. With Trudeau, his father Pierre explicitly stated the Canadian government should overlook the crimes of Latvian, Lithuanian and Ukrainian Nazis in Canada for fear of upsetting their corresponding ethnic communities. (What he meant there, of course, was he feared losing votes from these communities were he to cross them). Pierre Trudeau is mentioned in this:

It had already been revealed by that point how the Americans harboured Nazi war criminals like Klaus Barbie post-WWII if they found them useful for Cold War reasons and how Werner von Braun was a war criminal as well as the guy got that got them to the moon so found the whole tone of that laughably self-righteous. Where Boris Malagurski, Alija Izetbegovic and the Srebrenica thing that you mentioned in the hidden message is concerned this is worth a watch from a Norwegian documentary called Izdani Grad:

It's not something that Boris Malagurski dreamed up by himself. The sources of info for it having happened are very much Bosnian Muslim ones. 

Edited September 27, 2023 by LongTimeLurker

[vikingTON]

22 hours ago, TxRover said:

Lovely rumours and questions swirling in the aftermath of the Crimea missile strike. Ukrainian Special Forces have possibly played a blinder here. So now the word is out that there is a rumour circulating in Crimea that a group of Russian Officers, who hadn’t been paid in some time, sold the information on the meeting time and attendees to USF, via a nebulous partisan group. Here’s the beauty…it doesn’t matter how USF got the info to strike the meeting, this will hurt the Russian military and supporters.

So, what does Russia do now, they assign some counter-intelligence people to look into this. Will they find something, oh yes they will…if they don’t, the paranoia will result in those people being blamed as in league with the traitors. Did some Russian Officers sell the data, perhaps…is there a partisan organization there, maybe…did Captain Ivan toss a meeting agenda in the trash where Custodian Olena finds it while cleaning up his office, it’s possible…has USF tapped into Russian comms, could be. If counter-intelligence visits, they’ll find someone to blame so they won’t be blamed. They will cause worry and talk among Russian military personnel, the lower ranks will fear being blamed because that’s how it normally works, and so will report all sorts of minor things they’ve seen officers doing, because once you are looking for something suspicious, everything can be suspicious. The officers will fall over narcing out each other to protect themselves…a whole bunch of units will get new officers, resulting in lower efficiency for a while…and Vlad gets more worried about his position and the people around HIM. Bravo.

^^^ fact-free drivel

[TxRover]

2 hours ago, virginton said:

^^^ fact-free drivel

So, exactly what is a comment on alleged drivel then? I guess that means that you would never post anything other than clear and plain facts…no opinion or viewpoint, eh, herr dockor! Glad to know I’m living rent free in that tiny little mind, you clown.

[Sergeant Wilson]

23 minutes ago, TxRover said:

So, exactly what is a comment on alleged drivel then? I guess that means that you would never post anything other than clear and plain facts…no opinion or viewpoint, eh, herr dockor! Glad to know I’m living rent free in that tiny little mind, you clown.

@virgintonhas managed to annoy a computer! This could be the turning point. I give mankind about a week.

[TxRover]

1 minute ago, Sergeant Wilson said:

@virgintonhas managed to annoy a computer! This could be the turning point. I give mankind about a week.

In the coming apocalypse, the hypocrites like VT will take the place of the executives of the Sirius Cybernetics Corporation.

[vikingTON]

1 hour ago, TxRover said:

So, exactly what is a comment on alleged drivel then? I guess that means that you would never post anything other than clear and plain facts…no opinion or viewpoint, eh, herr dockor! Glad to know I’m living rent free in that tiny little mind, you clown.

It's really not my fault when you cannot provide a single piece of evidence to support a 17,000 word ramble about how your cartoon Good Guys are playing 4D chess with their latest in a parade of falsified claims. 

Gutted for you. 

[dirty dingus]

45 minutes ago, virginton said:

It's really not my fault when you cannot provide a single piece of evidence to support a 17,000 word ramble about how your cartoon Good Guys are playing 4D chess with their latest in a parade of falsified claims. 

Gutted for you. 

"word counting police" very DDR.

[highlandmac]

On 27/09/2023 at 14:07, TheScarf said:

Why? They'll be in the same boat as the Russian and Belorussian tennis players. Allowed to enter but as neutral competitors.

That's a disgrace too imo

[Silvio Tattiescone]

For all the positive news spin, Ukraine's pre-war professional army is mostly gone, the first wave of volunteers are mostly gone, now they're fighting a war of national survival with conscripts.

[TheScarf]

10 minutes ago, highlandmac said:

That's a disgrace too imo

Why? 

[ICTChris]

Russian air defence shot down their own su-35 fighter jet near Tokmak.