welldaft

For me it hinges on the Livi game. Unless we get absolutely hammered in the two games preceding. Whatever we get next two games is absolutely a bonus. But to lose at home to the team at the bottom of the table assuming they do not get points away to Aberdeen and Celtic is where the board have a decision to make. Just before the window opens and the winter break. That is unless the Board feel that they will wait and see how things pan out after the window assuming he gets funds / players to strengthen. But lose to Livi at home and probably going bottom of the league in the process means the noise from the fans will be louder than at any point before. I still want him to succeed. We probably deserved to just edge the game yesterday. But I might think and ultimately decide his tea is oot if we lose on Dec 30th at Fir Park.

In summary he came across as a Grade A asshole. Sure he was upset they lost a last minute goal. But to come out with that amount of pish in a short interview is some going. To label your players as 100 times worse than a league 2 side is some motivational tactic. Not sure I have seen that strategy before. Clearly I have a vested interest in this going tits up for County. Yesterday was a good start…..

All time top league points table. Do keep up. Although that may be quite difficult as the Buddies are a whole 1000 points behind Motherwell. A 1000 points…………..not to mention the goal difference (in significantly less games)

What an utter pile of shite. We only got the chances because St Mirren were peak Real Madrid. Thank Christ we did not concede 6 goals at the point you were overwhelming us with your slick attacking football. At one point I thought the team in black and white were Juventus they were that good. We have scored 20 goals to your 21. Face facts. Motherwell merited a draw today. Could have had a winner if we had been more clinical. St Mirren are having a decent season. They are a better team than Motherwell at the moment. But by the law of averages that is going to happen once every 20 years.

Thought the team played reasonably well in atrocious conditions. Should have taken one of the 3 good chances in the last 15 or so minutes. Kelly was very good. Penalty save aside he coped well with the wind and made a couple of other decent saves. I know it is another game without a win. But with a wee bit more composure / luck we would have had that today. Actually imho it was better than scoring an IT equaliser to show the players battling qualities. Away from home to a battle hardened and physical side with a very good home record. If anything 2nd half you would have thought we were the team in the top half not St Mirren. Next two games are tough and we will probably take nothing from them….but u just never know.

Not winning in 14 is a riddy, BUT hard to criticise the players today. They fought hard and penalty aside created the better chances 2nd half. Spittal and Bair had the best of them. Spittal just hits it low and hard straight at goal and that is in the net. Sadly he is quite a skilful wee player so tried to place it in the corner. Bair also was a great effort but I will credit the goalie for a good save more than criticise Bair for not scoring. Finally special mention to our Goalie. I have lambasted him of late. But he never put a foot (glove) wrong today

Yup. The St Mirren penalty was the best chance but after that we have had two 1 on 1s and Spittals opportunity.

St Mirren bullies fouling Motherwell players at every opportunity - no real surprise there.

Nah - Slattery was on his way down before Gogic touched him. If he just stayed up then Gogic and the ref has a decision to make !

Spittal really should have scored there. Just hit the target and it is probably a goal.

Excellent post @crazylegsjoe. When you have 26 players leave the building and replace them with 9, then it would have been more surprising to see us in the top half of the table winning more than we are losing. I think the start to the season gave us all some false hope that would be the outcome. That is why I think the Board will give him as much time as they can before pulling the plug. It would hypocritical in the extreme to expect miracles when you have substantially cut back the playing budget from previous seasons. As I have said in previous posts we only need half a dozen injuries / suspensions to struggle to put out an experienced 11 on the pitch. That is bare bones territory. If we lose the next 4 games inc Livi then enough would be enough probably even for the current Board. But pick up 4 or more points and I think they give him the window and beyond to turn things around. Which again I hope he manages to do. “The scenario where we finish 10th every season” is more likely than not regardless of who the Manager is. If you have the 9th or 10th smallest budget then logic dictates that is where you will end up more often than not. Unless you sign incredibly well and you get top 6 or incredibly poorly and our run in the top flight comes to an end.

Hopefully you will have sore guts come 5pm this Saturday…….although I very much doubt it.

It is a 3 maybe 4 way tussle between ourselves, Livi, St Johnstone and Ross County. Dundee and Killie have assembled decent squads with strong battling qualities and with some decent players to boot. St Mirren are similar but probably even a step up in terms of individual quality. I thought Ross C with Adams at the helm would motor away. And they possibly will once Uncle Roy gives him to spend in January. That said I thought they looked poor in the highlights v St Mirren. Granted that could be down to how good St Mirren were but suggests they may not be out of it yet.

I said it before I reckon he will get until the Livi game regardless of what happens over the next 3 games. Lose those (most probable) and then lose at home to Livi and that would be game over as far as I am concerned. 5 points from 51 and no wins in 17 is not survivable nor should it be. Of course I hope we somehow pick up some points before the Livi game, then win that game and we can get back on track from there. Hopefully result in getting some more distance between us and Livi.

No worries at all . I probably should have phrased it better. We all want what’s best for MFC. I also get your point or points as we are the 6th most successful Scottish League side in history. But I tend to be more of a realist rather than pessimist or an optimist. In your response you stated that there was no reason for us to accept being in a lower division. My point is that sadly there are many reasons. We might not like it. We might not want it. But again larger city clubs (badly run or not) have been relegated with vastly bigger budgets. St Mirren who you mention above have spent many seasons in the lower leagues whilst we have been in the top flight. Falkirk and Dunfermline. Arguably (historically) similar size clubs to Motherwell have been languishing in the lower leagues for a considerable time now. When you start reducing budgets in line with bottom 8th, 9th, 10th place etc. When you are not being run as efficiently and effectively as possible (as would appear the case now) then relegation becomes a distinct possibility. Again I certainly hope we can avoid that fate for many more seasons to come.

Your interpretation of my comments is not what I meant. No issues with that at all. But for the avoidance of doubt what I meant is that if the alternative was another administration. I would rather have a club to support than no club at all, even if that meant we ended up in a lower division. I don’t want us to be in a lower division anymore than anyone else. However the reality is that with a significantly reduced budget that is becoming a more increasingly likely outcome sooner rather than later. We have done a fantastic job for nearly 40 years avoiding relegation whilst teams with much bigger budgets (Hibs, Hearts + DDee Utd) have not which kind of dispels your argument around the bigger city clubs. Killie do have a reasonably wealthy backer. Maybe not super rich but able to subsidise the club more than we can with the Well Society funds. I would be very surprised if St Mirren have not backed their Manager with more funds than we have this season and last. That leaves us, Livi, Ross C and St Johnstone. We all know that Ross C have a wealthy backer. So probably between the other 2 clubs and us. Which is the way it is panning out so far this season. If Livi get relegated (hopefully) and United come up then next season will most probably be an even tougher task.

I am not disagreeing but how do you know that we don’t have a plan ? It is a difficult balancing act. In order to raise revenues you need to invest in quality staff and an improved service offering. That takes money. Hospitality for example. I have experienced this many times. And at best it is fairly average. But if you only have 70 or 80 people at best each Saturday what more can you do. There is only so much you can charge before people decline the opportunity. I don’t envy DW or the board at all. I am sure there are areas that could improve with a bit more guidance and support and little cash investment. But until we get a FT CEO I guess keeping us cash neutral or a small deficit and in the league is the absolute priority.

Like I said there are no doubt areas of the club (such as media) that could do with extra attention and support. I guess the real issue is that every £ you spend on a salary within the non playing side is a £ you take away from the playing side / budget. If the current Board and DW have said the budget is unsustainable and we need to make cuts. It is no real surprise if they try and keep as much for the 1st team squad and Manager and maybe try and take shortcuts elsewhere. Which is why we are probably are lacking in certain areas. In a perfect world we have a stellar experienced CEO. Experienced heads of departments. Extra resource in Media, Hospitality etc etc. But at a rough guess that would add as much as £250k or more to the wage bill or the equivalent of say 3 1st team additions. This is especially true if as we suspect we will need to make additions in January to keep us in the league. The decision has been made to cut our cloth accordingly. It may be and is proving painful but if it protects the long term future of the club then so be it. Even if that means in lower league .

I don’t want to encourage a pile on - as they are no doubt trying to do the best they can given limited experience and it would appear managerial oversight. It cannot be easy coming up with original titles when you have a handful of videos every week. But the most recent one highlights we are short in the media dept. Not sure if I mentioned this before or it has been mentioned on here but I heard that Derek Weir has a hands off approach. As in each department has a Manager let them get on with it. Not because he cannot be bothered. Far from it, but because he believes he should give people their place and let them do the job they are paid to do. To me that is wise management. If you have someone who is second guessing everything you do that can be demoralising and annoying. However it is clear that there are some areas within the club that could do with some attention / support as discussed above and before. I did wonder if he wanted the job permanently ? But the latest WS update would suggest otherwise. Probably does not pay enough .

I think if the current Chairman and stand in CEO were from a Marketing, PR or Communications background we would possibly have seen more updates and info to keep the fans onside and informed. The fact they are both from a Finance / Investment background to me says a lot. Neither have really sought the limelight and both come across as likeable but quite introverted. Clearly were happy to let Flow do all the communicating whilst he was CEO. Then he leaves and we are where we are. As to the comms side. The most recent YouTube video / match day summary has the title “Not going down without a fight”. I mean really. I assume the Manager and players never helped with that particular title .

I think it is very much along these lines. I mean who in their right mind would think that cutting the budget drastically would realistically lead to us competing comfortably for top 6 and Europe. Derek Weir is from a Finance background. I understand he had a look at the finances and said - nope. Not sustainable. Not unless we want to flirt with Admin all over again. There is your budget Stuart. Not a penny more. That being the case the Board will rightly feel that if he has (for the sake of argument) 25/30% less wages to play with than previous Managers then our predicament is hardly a surprise. A lot of fans will understand that. A lot simply won’t or won’t care. Likely we will be bumping along the bottom for the forseeable if our budget is that of a 9th or 10th place team. If the alternative is we go bust then we probably have to accept that…..

I have every expectation that he will get at least until the Livi home game regardless what happens over the next couple of weeks. Livi have lost every game since they beat you know who. And in saying that it was against a 10 man Motherwell. If Livi continue to lose games up until the 30th Dec and then come to Fir Park and beat us. That would be it for me. Unless we do the unlikely thing and pick up a win beforehand. Davor was ok yesterday. Nothing great but imho Paton has gone backwards the past few games. But still expect Paton to get the nod for more physical St Mirren game if he is available ? The bigger Q for me is whether Kettlewell will ever drop Kelly. Oxborough must not be showing anything in training. I get Kelly is the Captain, but any other player would probably have been dropped based on form. His nonsense in his interview about Kelly making the choice to come for the ball to try and help us or whatever is blatant pish. I know he has to come out and say it. But if he genuinely thinks it then that is a huge concern.

I actually thought we were OK today. We battled well and had the better of the chances before Kelly threw in his usual clanger. Dropping Kelly is imho a bigger need than changing the Manager. The team are playing for him. That much is clear. You simply don’t score as many late goals if they are not. Again this is a long way away from the last few Hammell performances. St J did not look any better than us and have a new Manager. I think we will finish above them defending on what happens in the Jan transfer window. Them and Livi. Finish 10th or higher and regroup. Definitely doable even with the mess we have got ourselves in.

The only mistake Kettlewell is making at the moment is not taking the decision to relieve Kelly of the captaincy. It is affecting his performances. If it is not that he needs dropped. He needed dropped weeks ago and a decent performance v Celtic does not change my mind. I thought we were OK today. Not very good but better than I thought. St Johnstone even with a new Manager did not look up to much at all. We need to finish 10th or above. With Livi in the league that may come down to us and St J. 50/50 imho before the transfer window opens. I would not sack the Manager. The team even with its limitations are clearly playing for him. I have never known us to score so many last minute goals.

Live football tickets. Largest dedicated UK based online football ticket platform. They have their sources. Not without problems if you read Trust Pilot but 80% 5 star review and only 6% 1 star. No doubt I will end up being the 6% . They do offer 100% money back guarantee + 50% credit towards tickets on their site if they fail to deliver. Hopefully it does not come to that. Last I looked Category 3 tickets were £260 + £70 odd booking fee. Expensive especially as I paid slightly more .