EdTheDuck

wouldn't be as much riding on each individual half season translates as fewer attendees and fewer TV viewers and asks the question 'why bother then?'. As a matter of fact I think it would be pretty easy to crank up the stakes in apertura/clausura tournaments. The whole point of any change is to increase interest (i.e. excitement), not water it down. I do agree the chances of a non-weeg club winning an 18 team, 17 game championship is better but then again over the last 10 years after one round of games there has been one instance of a club other than rangers or celtic being top of the table (this last season, in fact, Hearts) and in fact twice in 20 years (Hearts again in 2006 IIRC) so maybe the brave new world wouldn't be everything I'd hope it would be.

SPFL attendances have increased for the fourth season in a row with 25 of 42 teams showing an improvement. Remarkable in the face of such drudgery.

Plod will never countenance a championship game between the Fugly Sisters. Christ, we can scarcely have one of the beauts win the title at their opponents place even though they're 12 points ahead and the 'league decider' is f**k all of the kind. Much as I'm a fan of apertura/clausura short seasons for all sorts of reasons an alternative decider would have to be found and in conservative Scotland that would probably mean adding together all the points over the two half-seasons thereby rendering the two 'separate' championships utterly worthless.

His ultimate boss wants to see "a strong Rangers" because "we need that for Scottish Football" His immediate boss patently plays 'the name not the game' Third is, consciously or unconsciously, the limit of our ambition.

No sir. The RDS was built during 92/93 and the average was around 11,000. The figure I quoted was for 93/94.

You might have a point-ish. Back then Season Tickets cost about the price of all the league games plus a couple extra. There was no discount. Sometimes you came out ahead because you might get 3 or 4 or 5 home cup ties, sometimes you lost out because there was no cup ties. It was a sort of gentlemen's agreement between club and fan, both accepted it was a case some you win, some you lose. However, it meant that clubs didn't sell nearly as many STs. I think in the early 90s Aberdeen had about 4,000 -5,000 ST holders. It also meant fans did a lot more pick and choosing of their games. In season 90/91 for example, when Aberdeen took it to Ibrox on the last day of the season their home gates ranged from 22,500 full house to 9,000, while genuinely challenging for the title. The current Season Tickets are a bit smoke and mirrors IMO. The whole point is to get as much money in as quickly as possible just in case the season goes down the shitter because that would see the numbers turning up to PATG absolutely plummet. The 'discount' is a sleight of hand too. It required the PATG cost to go through the roof to make the ST look like good value. This isn't just an Aberdeen thing, of course, it's a symptom of the Money is King view nowadays throughout football. Having said that there are a million more people attending Scottish league football these days than there were in 90/91 so...y'know...

Innit tho. Average attendance was 12,720! (Hearts 11,018 Hibs 9,718) - what was wrong with people back then?

And Bobby 'the blouse' Connor Fox ache

Back in time for the fitba The early 90s, lump it cross-field for Mixu charging in from the left to head it into "the mixer" (™ Craig Paterson) or more likely row k or miss it completely. Sitting in the newly opened RDS with the mannie behind screaming "MCKIMMIE" from warm up onwards. When he overhit it the mannie went apoplectic with fury. Aberdeen finished second. SECOND! So...y'know... Edit to add: disclaimer - there was also Steven Wright, Alex McLeish, Brian Grant, Lee Richardson, Paul Mason, Scott Booth, Duncan Shearer and Eoin Jess which might, just possibly, have had something to do with 2nds not just the long, crossfield hit-and-hope but y'know, don't knock it etc etc

I really don't know why this is even causing a problem. If the North Juniors and NCL set a new League called something imaginative like The North of Scotland League they do not have to have the criteria for the HFL unless they gain promotion to the HFL. Those clubs genuinely wanting to rise up the ranks can then put in place said criteria over a period of time. Those that don't don't. If a club without the criteria win the league they do not get promoted a la Bonnyrigg. Are all those ex-junior clubs in the EoSL (and the SoSL clubs) all full members of the SFA and meet LL criteria?

Good appointment for Scotland Personally have no interest in International Football so would have preferred him to stay at Killie cuz he really made it interesting and spoke more sense about the shite that goes on here than almost anyone else I've ever seen in Scottish fitba A' the best Killie, hope you can stay up the top end

I doubt there's many of the HFL clubs left that could flourish in the SPFL to be honest. Without 'backing' maybe the Locos, the Broch, Forres or Buckie could survive in League 2 but that's about it. I'm still waiting for Elgin to make the great leap forward. At the very least I expected them to yo-yo between League 1 & League 2

fox ache edit coming up

That's a pretty comprehensive playoff tournament for Cove. Four wins out of four, 12 goals for, one conceded. Congratulations.

You're mixing with the wrong Aberdonians. My ire is directed at the criminal neglect of Pittodrie over the last quarter century and the fact this has dovetailed into the necessity to move to the back of beyond. IF that neglect had been because we were spending money on the team and winning cups by financial doping I would probably be less inclined to heads gone (sic) about what the board have done over the last 25 years. But they couldn't even do that. They ran up horrendous losses, year after year to finish tenth out of ten for f**k sake. Kingsford is a lifeboat. It is the accumulation of terrible decision making, awful appointments and desperate papering over the cracks. If Aberdeen fans are a little cynical about the honesty of what is now being said I can't really say I blame them

f**k. I like trains and a sesh too. What the f**k am I doing sitting at home....

polarised debate response? Whatever. It's spot on, is what it is. If slightly exaggerated. When Milne tells the Happy Clappers the Mothership has arrived,, we have warn them, DON'T DRINK THE PUNCH! (exaggeration again in case you wondered)

Happy Clapper default response

What do you genius' suggest the protesters do? Withdraw support and money? Most are aware the gig is up for Pittodrie, but that doesn't mean swallowing the bullshit and singing Praise the Lord. If you think the club reps don't read read social media your really do have you heads in the sand. Lobby the club? Have you seen the snowjob whenever there is any suggestion of unrest? Oh oh we'll have to play games in Glasgow, , we'll have to reduce capacity to 300, there's no option but Kings Links/Loirston/Kingsford. Being absolutely raging about the utter fucking shambles that has transpired over the last quarter century should be the default state of every Aberdeen fan. It's actually far easier to follow the Great Leader and shout "remember Mark McGhee! Remember Steve Paterson". Fox ache.

Alas no. The cost is, allegedly, so high the numbers exist only in theoretical economics. Besides which the restrictions of the area mean that the total capacity would be less than the current capacity of the RDS apparently. And right on cue the party line is reaffirmed as a stand alone absolute truth. Sadly, the time for redevelopment of Pittodrie has probably gone. It should go down as one of the football crimes of the century. The word that the club had to move came out just as it had run up such horrendous losses, around the end of the 20th century, that selling the ground was an absolute necessity just to get the club back to a point where it started over debt free. At the time there was no other way of clearing the debts except maybe those who had incurred them doing the decent thing, but that's another story... Now, somehow, it is the fault of the city or the local council, holding the club back apparently. In the 50 years following WW2 Aberdeen won more trophies than any other non exOF club even if you strip out the Ferguson years. They won 8. Hearts won 7, Hibs 5. In the subsequent 22 seasons Aberdeen has won 1 trophy. Hearts have 3, Hibs have 2. They had their longest trophy free run since the second world war, nineteen seasons. Yes, it got tougher as the exOF spent stupid money but everything suggests during that nineteen year barren spell they should at least have been coming close to a cup win. 17 years without even a Scottish Cup Final appearance. Again, ignoring the Ferguson years 8 years was the previous longest. The truth is they never came close until 2014. Aberdeen have been hopeless, so badly run, so badly managed. It's the same city. It is pretty much the same council. In my opinion it is probably something else to blame, not the city or the council, and it's probably that same factor that left Pittodrie to fall apart until the point is reached where there's no longer any option but to move to the middle of nowhere. Picking the middle/late 90s as my cut off point isn't arbitrary, of course. The running of the club changed dramatically at that point and has led to the point it finds itself today, moving to the boondocks. Not as a planned, business decision, not as a way forward but as a means of climbing out of a self inflicted shit pit. Somehow though, it is the city and the council that holds the club back. Now though, the Happy Clappers see nothing but sunshine, lollipops and rainbows in the future. A new, improved and even larger debt than anything the club has endured before will not restrict the team and club at all. Suddenly the board have vision and insight, they will be inclusive and open. But because some of the fans ask questions of the board or about the whole Kingsford operation regarding transport and fan zones we are miserable c***s?

Yuh...visiting the clubshop or museum 19 times a season every season has limited appeal. The bar holds 400 - good luck getting in there ever. As for my attitude to the location I refer you to the Strichener's first point. There was no reason for AFC to move into the 'shire but for utterly hopeless mismanagement. I hope Cormack makes a difference to the way things are done because the previous quarter century prior to the arrival of McInnes was an unmitigated disaster.

You spoke about facilities. What facilities? What will the fanzones entail? Pop-up bars? Food? Cover? This is what I mean about making contingency plans now - if it's all in place in 4 years it will work. If it's all just wait and see it won't. Besides which any number of folks on here have been suggesting Westhill has loads of facilities for fans (it doesn't). I drive to Westhill from Dyce and back every day. The Craibstone roundabout is an accident waiting to happen during both rush hours and the Westhill roundabout is the same: hence the reason there have been so many accidents at both in the 3 months the AWPR has been fully open. I don't use the AWPR in the mornings, because the Westhill roundabout backs up all the way to the dual carriageway when it's busy and getting onto the roundabout is something akin to Russian Roulette with cars. I cut through Kirkhill Forest in the mornings. At night I blast right through to the Goval turnoff rather than the Craibstone roundabout because folk seem to think all 3 lanes are for the airport, the city and the A96 West. The shuttle bus will have no option but to use the Craibstone roundabout because that's where the park & ride is. If there are even 500 vehicles trying to get onto that Westhill roundabout after the game the first bus will take at least an hour to get to Dyce and back. Guarantee it. Unless they are going to build some new roads then I do not see how there will be free flowing traffic, I'm afraid. Unless they start looking at it now. Which they are not.

Look at the 'comprehensive' plan. There is no plan for anyone further South than College Street although there seems to be a conglomeration between College Street, Guild Street and Shiprow...presumably in recognition of fans going into the City Centre

That's what I said. And what facilities? If the first 7 buses take 72 people each that will leave 378 more than the capacity of the stadium bar just from the Dyce fans. (1,228 - (72 X 7=504) = 778 - Stadium Bar 400 = 378. If you mean the facilities in Westhill (which are extremely, extremely limited), do you think fans will walk 1.5-2.5 miles for a pint then 1.5-2.5 miles back and hope they didn't miss their bus in the meantime? By the way, according to AFC's own 'comprehensive' estimates, there will be around 2,000 vehicles leaving the stadium after the game. If you have ever used the roundabout/AWPR on-ramps between 4:30pm and 5:30pm on a weekday with, maybe a couple of hundred vehicles, then you should have a nightmarish vision of the carnage with 2,000 in that area. Way, way back somewhere in this thread (or somewhere) I suggested pop-up bars a la the Christmas pop-up outside Union Square so folk can hang around without blowing a mental gasket. I doubt Plod would allow it but now would be a good time to start running through the contingencies, don't you think?

I may be a cynical old fart but the “comprehensive” bus plan has a glaring error that hasn’t been addressed AFAIK. For example, the bus plan states buses will run from 2.5 hours before the game and there will be 7 buses running back & forth from Dyce Park & Ride bringing 1,282 fans to the game(s). Great! Except… After the game all 1,282 fans will be wanting to go back to Dyce Park & Ride. Unless they can find 7 buses that hold 183 people each or around 18 buses rather than 7 there’s going to be hundreds hanging around outside the stadium (unless there are these mythical pubs & restaurants) for at least an hour, some of them much longer. This applies across the bus plan btw. Expectation is for far more fans than there will be seats after the game...