tell_me_more

Yet again your absolute hatred and derision towards the SJFA shines through like a beacon. The moment the West Juniors move enmasse the pyramid is strengthened and therefore meets your requirements to be put back on the table. That is the scenario I think will happen even though the vote is split at the moment, we have the scenario of what is happening in the East and how it has panned out leaving a total chaotic set up for teams of a similar level, with teams desperate to jump in at the highest level possible it is a shambles, the West teams know that and should avoid it at all costs. A massive input of new teams means restructuring needs looked at and a Lowland League West is the solution. Fits in with population densities number of teams etc etc And yes the SOS and EOS are minor leagues as are the Junior Leagues what else are they if they are not minor leagues? That is reality not derision.

(and may not be allowed anyway) This is one of the problems in my opinion , no leadership from the SFA if it is for the betterment of Scottish Football the EOS SOS suck it up and get on with it, the SFA have got to be the decision makers here not some minor league or its clubs that are just safeguarding their own position. Going by population there should be a lowland league west, the West Premier is the obvious candidate to slot into that position with most of the clubs able to achieve entry level within a very short space of time. This argument about the juniors missed the boat doesn't wash, by using that you are restricting the pyramid and displaying the same sort of burying your heads in the sand behaviour that the SJFA are being accused of.

How can you compare? The celebrations went on at New Cumnock for three days plus there was mass community involvement beforehand.

A poster on here a while back said its only parents that go to their games, better off slotting in at the foot of the west juniors.

'Football is a simple game made complicated by people who should know better.' This obviously applies to pyramid systems as well, the garbage spouted on here about potential set ups has reached landfill proportions.

Not strictly accurate question one was : Should Junior Clubs join the CURRENT pyramid? Which in the West means going through SOS or EOS leagues. and not Should Junior clubs join the pyramid? A club, in the west particuarly, could well answer no to joining the current pyramid but be all for joining a revised pyramid with a west feeder ( my own preference Super Premier Div at level 6) . The questionnaire was poorly worded in my opinion and should either not have contained the word current or should have had an additional choice. Or am I missing something? Was an assumption to be made that it would be revised?

I believe that date was extended.

Should be plenty happening over the next few months to keep this 100,000 + views thread rolling along for a bit yet. We will find out soon enough what, if anything, is going to happen with the Juniors regarding the pyramid.

1/ They obviously have enough replies in to know where it's heading but not to publish results, anyway I would imagine there's procedures to go through and notify the clubs before PnB. 2/ No comment subjective. 3/ As stated before I don't think the clubs will be at polar opposites once a proper west region level 6 (presumably) is sorted for the West Premier. 4/ The West premier teams are stronger sticking together and fighting their case collectively and from that I believe the juniors will move into the pyramid collectively, the last thing we need is a dogs dinner west feeder league full of wannabees boys clubs etc etc who are not there on merit. Surely you see the reasoning for at least giving the regional meetings and possible EGM a fair crack first of all as it has the potential to bring about the best pyramid structure fairest to all.

All the replies have not been received so how can they publish results? The majority are in favour so far. Clubs at the top in the West are obviously not enthused by it as it stands with access through the SOS EOS however ask them if they are interested in entering en masse and I think you will have a different outcome. Just my opinion. Your agenda seems more anti junior and pyramid at any cost rather than going through the proper procedure of consulting all the clubs and coming up with a system that is fit for the future and fair to all.

From a very good source discussions at regional witha view to an EGM looks like its in the pipeline.

So looks like regional discussions and an EGM for the JUniors to discuss the pyramid and the best and fairest way forward for all clubs, far better than the ham fisted efforts proposed by some on here. If I had a crystal ball I reckon : Juniors entering en masse season 19/20 West premier coming in at level 6 Bit of a dogs dinner in the East that will need to be worked around for the betterment of the game going forward, somethings got to give. Obviously lots of details up for discussion.

Think you will find most of them have voted proposal in at Level 6 causing minimum disruption to league set ups, opportunity to get licensed, entry into BIG cup for those that do, retain junior cup and all the other riches that lie at the end of the pyramid pathway. Still be a bit of an anomaly being on the same level as the SOS. Will the same happen in the EAst? What about the EOS will it be swallowed up by the East Junior set up pointless having two in same area? Will Clydebank be going nowhere as they will already have achieved their dream of being back senior football when "the juniors" evolve into the pyramid?

Aye right round to Stranraer and the Solway coast to play teams with poor supports and next to zero travelling support and probably end up the season plus 100 goal difference. Doesn't make much sense does it? Try selling that to your supporters when you are currently playing in a competitive reasonably well supported league. Only one option for the WOS teams , West Superleague Premier becomes the feeder league.

The standard in the SOS is more on a par with Ayrshire Amatuer than top league Junior. It is not going to happen. Isobel Goudie has said over and over again that the SOS is just not a pathway for Ayrshire Juniors he is 100% correct on this.

Equally I would argue that West Super premier are not going to accept the scenario I quoted in my previous post . You are a big advocate of the pyramid yet the system you are supportive of is a ham hearted attempt that is supportive of a few teams with supposed "ambition" I can't get my head round that, if its to be done do it properly the SFA need to show some proper leadership and management and put the system in place that is all inclusive and fair to all, obviously being a junior fan I would shout for them to be included at a level I think merits their ability if thats to be debated so be it. Nothing more to say on this for the time being all the best.

Totally disagree thats another hamfisted half hearted attempt, so a team from league 2 or further down the Junior league volunteers for the new league and in theory jumps two / three leagues, this team is subsequently relegated and goes into the top west Superleague what a shambolic attempt that would be at developing a pyramid. If the Juniors are to be involved at least give them their place West and East Superleague go in at Tier 5 problem solved, paperwork exercise minimum disruption no brainer.

Total speculation on your part,

I'm sure Junior Clubs remaining would have no objections with the relegated teams going straight into the bottom league, they never won promotion to begin with so are in a false position so why should they be relegated into the top junior leagues that they were never promoted from? The draft from BSc or whoever is embarassing with the errors, and I don't mean grammatical. For the pyramid to have any form of credibility whatsoever the whole junior set up would have to be integrated. The wos premier league is far superior to the sos so again levels would need reviewed carefully, for a supposed better more professional set up its been a bit of a dogs breakfast so far.

I only answer sensible questions Hamish when i have time ;-) , as for being isolated do you not know that there are probably more Junior Clubs in Scotland than Senior so they are hardly isolated.

The traditions of playing in local cups and leagues under the junior format has been built up over many years is one of the things that makes it unique and these do mean quite a bit to junior supporters that have followed their team for years, ( Like it lump it or laugh it, thats the way it is.). So you are giving up your local tournaments and national tournament that does generate quite a bit of interest, e.g Glenafton had ten times the amount of supporters at last years final than they did at Livingston. Can you justify your increased funding and better grant opportunites claim? Participating in the big Scottish, fair enough but the cash that it pays out just now would be massively diluted if you throw in say 100 + Junior teams. The first few rounds would be wiped out for payouts. More and more clubs and organisations are after grant funding than ever, there's less to go round than ever, charities / charitable organisations or groups working together are more likely to get funding than individual teams as there is more community benefit, ( See the Cumnock model) that would not change radically just because you are licensed although it would contribute. More professional approach to the game, no going to debate that one. There should be an opportunity for the best of the juniors to progress if they wish via playoffs, I'm still no convinced it would benefit the whole set up moving.

So if you were in their position (SFA) and were trying to sell the pyramid system to long established junior clubs in Ayrshire / Glasgow area how would you go about it? Outline the benefits that they are currently missing out on and why it would be better for the juniors to abandon their traditions and set up.