Huistrinho

and for years we, as supporters, have said "this is crap, here, take my money". It's difficult to apportion blame fully to clubs for resting on their laurels when we're arguably just as complicit in allowing the status quo to continue. If nothing else, this summer has highlighted this point. I remember reading a story about Alex Ferguson's time in charge of St Mirren where he drove round the streets trying to encourage more people to come to the games. What are clubs actively doing these days to try and get more punters through the doors? (a genuine question, not an implied accusation).

This forum is generally full of great discussion, but let's knock the first bolded point on its head as it keeps reapearing: many, many Rangers fans have been saying D3 from the moment Rangers went bust (all the polls reflect this), and a large number want to do it for the right reasons. Don't get me wrong, I'll readily admit our support has plenty disgusting, bigoted, arrogant, glory hunting c***s who don't have the interests of Scottish football at heart, but if you want to categorise the whole Rangers support by sampling from RangersMedia (not particularly you, but this thread generally) then you're just as foolish as most of the muppets who seem to post there. On the second point, sporting integrity cannot have a price, at any cost. Everybody knows that league reconstruction is necessary for our game to prosper - it wouldn't even be on the table as a bargaining chip if this weren't the case. We're beginning to realise what fan power can accomplish, and there's no reason we can't keep applying it to achieve the reforms we'd like to see in the long run, assuming when this is over that we can stop squabbling long enough to get organised. This is especially the case if the old model based on TV money collapses. The SPL is a dead horse whatever happens in the next few weeks, there's no way we can continue with 3 governing bodies whatever the outcome, and now is not the time to give in to blackmail.

Perfect is the right word. Another very impressive statement from Clyde FC. Clear, articulate, well reasoned, and asking for heads to roll. I'd now like to see every other SFL club come out and say "ditto".

The RST did so on Sunday. Here's the relevant section in amongst the rest of it.

Fondly?

I'd clearly never wear it, but I'll be dammed if Spartans don't have a badge that screams "awesome".

There's still little clarity over what it means if clubs vote yes to (i) and no to (ii). It would appear to imply that this is equivalent to saying yes to D3, but it's far from clear.

Leggo has clearly never studied logic...

You might be better posting in the existing thread. I have to take issue with the "we have been punished more severely than others" line I keep hearing - it's driving me mental. Let me list all the punishments: We've been docked (a meaningless) 10 points - rules that Rangers voted in post Motherwell's administration. We had a couple of fines, unpaid, which are pretty irrelevant as we owe the taxman £140 million. That's it. Then we went bust and got ourselves liquidated. Everything since -- 3 years out of europe, not having a league to play in -- is because as a newco we don't yet qualify. These aren't punishments. Almost nobody on this board (that i've seen) thinks the attempt at parachuting Rangers into division one is being done exclusively for the benefit of Rangers. Everybody knows that the SPL's fingerprints are all over it. And while perhaps you and I want to see Rangers go to division 3 for the right reasons, it's undeniable that many of our fellow "supporters" would love nothing more than for the SPL to crumble around us. Scotland does indeed need healthy competitive football, but we haven't had it for years. Fighting for proper governance is the only way forward.

Great idea. I agree with the other poster that it might be a good idea to start a separate thread for compiling suggestions, I have a few... I applaud you for the effort in putting this together!

Interesting choice of metaphor

Stolen from Reddit...

Despite what many are reporting/spinning, nobody within Rangers (i.e., Green, Murray, McCoist) has said they want to play in division 3 or that they'll be happy playing in division 3. They've said things that sound a little like it (e.g., "Some of our fans wish to play in division 3 and I can see their point", "It would definitely be easier to rebuild from Division 3", "We'll play in whichever league the SFL deem fit"), but at no point has anyone actually said "Yes, division 3 is where we want to be" (clearly, because it's not true). Disclaimer: not actual quotes - pulling them from my error-prone mind, happy to be proved wrong.

I think there's a reason that no decision over Club 12 has been made yet. An outright 'no' might see Rangers shoehorned back into the SPL either straightaway or after a 1 year hiatus (i.e., an 11 team SPL for this season).

The problem is that this is really the only option that might have a significant impact. There's no way to effectively get at the SFL, SPL, SFA directly as far as I can tell - it has to come through the member clubs. Without the support of the clubs, these organisations fall; without paying support, the clubs fall. This crisis is all about money. Therefore the solution necessarily must originate from withholding it. Make no mistake, if season book sales weren't at stake this would have been done and dusted weeks ago. I doubt very much that the participants of this thread are representative of the footballing public at large, so the question is: if Rangers end up in SFL 1, are enough people willing to take action? Do you risk seeing your own club go under for the betterment of the Scottish game? I honestly doubt it, and I think the authorities are banking on this being the case.

Surely a yes to i) and a no to ii) is an implicit approval of Div 3 participation? I think Alex Thomson is getting worked up over nothing here.

Besides the tongue in cheek replacement of Regan by Presley, I'm not really sure what was contentious about what I said Edit: chief-exec mixups.

It's at times like these I wish the Guardian's Football Weekly team had a passionate interest in Scottish football; there's a real lack of debate on show. Traynor shouldn't be allowed on radio without Cosgrove or English being present to challenge his "bilge". On another note, Presley for SFA chief?

Which clubs would, in their right mind, join SPL 2? They'd instantly become pariahs of the game given the mood surrounding Scottish football at the moment. The SFA need to let the chips fall where they may and work towards rebuilding the game in a fair and just manner from any fallout that ensues. Regan's comments tonight astound me. Doncaster's "without fear of favour" line from a few months ago should have him fall on his sword also. The question is, who do we replace them with? Yet more of the same? The chance for Scottish football to rebalance, and a move towards being a strongly contested competition excites me. Reinstatement of the status-quo at any cost does not. How do we turn this burgeoning fans' movement to getting change at the highest levels of the game? Direct election of a portion of the SFA from supporters' groups? A fans' organisation to push for the changes everybody clearly wants but nobody is willing to provide? The heads of the governing bodies are constantly talking a good game about reform but never delivering it. However, without a customer base there'd be no SPL, no SFA. It's time we took steps to make our voices heard and change the game for the better. If it lowers the standard of players we can attract, if only BBC Alba will show the games on telly, then so be it. The game has been rotten at the core for far too long. I think this is the point where I cry "Freedom" and ride into battle.

Quite astonishing and rotten to the core.

He is. I'm disappointed he's talking about "difficulties" rather than calling out Sky threatening to pull out as one of the biggest factors here.

With the SFL board meeting tomorrow ahead of next Thursday's vote, and given Green's statement - do we think there's any chance of them showing some leadership by declaring the vote to be about D3 entry only and ruling out D1 consideration entirely? I'm sure they must have had some feedback from the SFL clubs at yesterday's meeting already, and might be keen to make easier the decision for its member clubs.

To be fair, RM is IMO not representative of the Rangers supporting public. However, the reasoning behind the view is irrelevant. The key fact remains that the overwhelming majority of the scottish footballing public want to see Rangers apply to D3 and compete for a place with other applicants. Not to deliver this would be a mistake.

The Rangers Fans' Fighting Fund poll of the club's season ticket holders reported yesterday that 76% prefer the option applying to division 3.