Diamonds are Forever

Great example of how impossible it is for referees. He basically said the law says the referee got it right, but I don't like the law so the referee got it wrong. Absurd.

This is the irony of us being short of midfielders at the moment, it's by far and away our strongest area of the pitch in terms of squad depth, we have 3 genuinely good back-up players in there, yet that's the area we're struggling for players. If we'd had 4 players unavailable in the defence rather than midfield then a couple of us would probably have had to dust our boots off yesterday.. It's a testament to the quality of the squad in that position that we were still very competitive yesterday. It doesn't sound like any of the injuries will be long term, so I'm actually really excited about the options we have in there once everyone is available.

McCabe's had 55 games in charge and none of them have been 0-0 draws, we are the least 0-0 draw type team I've ever watched. Some of our scorelines from last season were bonkers. I definitely agree that it will be harder this season as more competent defences will be able to limit our chances, but equally if we score first teams will have to come out and press more and we are well suited to keeping possession to kill a game. I don't think we'll be challenging for the play-offs, but the style of play will allow us to be competitive with basically the same team that finished 3rd in League 1.

No, but Ian Murray got a move for achieving less. It's certainly not beyond the realms of possibility that a club not much higher up than ourselves looks to take him and asks him the question.

Any move basically means retiring from playing, not only for him but also Fordyce assuming he went with him. That's a massive call to make aged 31/32 when you're still able to hold your own in the Championship, particularly Fordyce if you're retiring to become an assistant manager. It's a hard balance between learning your trade for a few years but also realising that management is a very fickle business and you often need to strike while your reputation is high because one poor run of form or relegation and the moment could pass. I don't think that will happen with him but you'd have to factor it in.

4 players in the same position unavailable once McMaster goes off, how many midfielders do you expect us to sign? Including the 3 on the park that's 7 central midfielders, you don't think having 4 extra players in one position is enough? And if we applied that to every position we'd have a squad of 50 players. There isn't a team in the country (except maybe the Old Firm) who could lose their 4 best central midfielders and not have to play some kind of inexperienced youngster in there.

So would I, but I genuinely can't see it happening. People have been saying it will for years and it hasn't shown any signs of happening. It survived the Global crash in 2008/2009 completely unscathed and then Covid, I can't see what would cause a sudden burst and the whole thing to collapse if those barely made a dent. A huge chunk of the 2 billion transfer fees is just money getting 'recycled' from one Premier League club to another like the Rice deal or Caicedo, so if you look at the Premier League as an entity that money isn't being 'spent' in the sense that it's not leaving the league, it's just getting moved around like Monopoly money. The overall transfer figure is irrelevant for that reason, a better figure is how much is being spent on players from outwith the league to give an idea of how much is being lost, and that would need set against what is now coming into the league, which with the Saudi money is more significant than it ever has been. The Saudi money will also provide a safety net for clubs, if they need a bit of extra cash they can flog a Jordan Henderson type for a ridiculous fee and cover losses, that option has never existed before. If it wasn't for FFP then some of these clubs wouldn't care about losing money anyway. Man City and Newcastle's owners couldn't care less so any financial hit from the outside will have limited impact. The impact of the Saudi league will be really interesting to see, I think they'll keep chucking money at it (most of which will go to English clubs to get their best players) but I'm not convinced at all that longer term it's going to be any kind of threat to the Premier League in terms of viewers or taking revenue away.

I wasn't criticising people making wrong predictions, I'm not going to pretend I thought we'd start this well! It was more a comment on what seemed like needless negativity from a few fans when results on the pitch hadn't given any reason to be.

That too, but there definitely were people saying how we were in danger of getting off to a slow start if we didn't sign players early enough. There were some comparisons to last season and people saying we couldn't afford another slow start (even though we started very well last year). I remember replying them.

It's such basic stuff. The first goal Shinnie lets their best player stroll forward totally unchallenged and get a shot off. The 2nd goal Devlin charges out his position and leaves said best player to easily score. The 3rd goal the defender makes a ridiculous challenge in the box. On a basic level it's individual incompetence but having watched the game those mistakes were partly due to the structure of Aberdeen allowing far too much space, particularly to Sadiq, meaning players were isolated. Aberdeen should have been able to beat Hacken over 2 legs and won't get a better chance to reach Europa League group stages. They were let down by poor organisation and stupid mistakes.

First time I've seen him for years and genuinely can't believe how slow and heavy legged he looks. Mind you it's not helped when there are such massive gaps in the midfield to expose him.

Aberdeen are so easy to play through. They look quite threatening when going forward but Haecken are passing straight through a non-existent midfield and getting in on goal whenever they go forward. They are also doing a totally half-hearted press which is leaving massive gaps. Just look very poorly organised all round.

Pathetic attempt to stop that shot by Shinnie. Looks like he has lead in his boots.

No, the thread has been virtually everyone in agreement that we could do with more players. I've not seen a single post from any fan claiming the squad is perfect as it is. All fans have been pointing out is that we don't have unlimited money and that signing good players isn't very easy. We've played 8 games so far, won 6, drawn one in normal time to a Premier League side and then narrowly lost one where we could easily have got something, this is all despite fans like yourself (apologies if it wasn't specifically you, but there were quite a few) telling us how our lack of signings was going to lead to a slow start. I think most people, like Ammo's post above says, are now just at the point of trusting that the manager and the club know far better what they are doing than any of us, so to just leave them to it and enjoy the season. If we get relegated due to having to play youngsters every week then I'll criticise McCabe and the club accordingly, but getting worked up over something that hasn't happened (and so far looks unlikely to) is pointless.

Assuming Telfer isn't fit I think we'll play O'Connor in that position. Against Bonnyrigg when we played 3-5-2 he was playing more centrally and dropping deep at times into that position. I don't think it suits his game but there's not many alternatives. He'll not provide the creativity that Frizzell would but will provide the same energy and could be a threat getting up to support Gal. I wouldn't be messing around with different formations, partly because I generally hate 3 at the back, but mainly because we have a settled defence and going away to the league favourites isn't when I'd be trialing stuff in that area.

I agree that tickets should be increasing slightly as the cost of running a club is increasing, but I think fans annoyance is more that Utd's pricing is much higher (relatively speaking) than others. It is 25% more expensive for me to watch Dundee Utd v Airdrie than it is for me to watch Airdrie v Dundee Utd. Dundee Utd already blow us out the water in terms of support which gives a huge financial advantage, so the extra cost just seems excessive. The supply and demand argument can't be used either given there will be thousands of empty seats. Like I said above, if Dundee Utd can still get the same crowds charging this then good luck to them, they are doing what's best for them. But I get why fans aren't happy paying it.

Of course, and it's up to individuals what they are happy to pay, like everything else the market will decide what is an acceptable price for clubs to charge. In isolation it's only 3 of 4 quid over what I'd pay elsewhere so it's not really a case of being able to afford it. My concern is just that if these prices become normalised at this level by Dundee Utd still getting the same home and away supports that they'd normally recieve then the prices will spread across to all the other clubs at this level in the next couple of seasons. And if clubs don't put the prices up they'll fall behind those that do. I certainly don't feel like I'm making any grand gesture or protest by not going, and I understand others will have different limits on what they think is too much. I can't make every away game anyway so it was an easy one to miss when deciding what ones to pick and choose.

It's not the fans' fault, but we do have a role to play in the pricing by deciding whether we will accept it or not. If away supports at Tannadice this season continue to be healthy then prices will remain the same, and rise again in a year or two. It will also soon drive up prices for the rest of the league as other clubs realise they can get away with the same, and that cycle will repeat indefinitely until clubs see attendances drop. You are right that in the short term clubs will have a 'pay it or don't attitude', but that can only be sustained so long if attendances take a hit and they are losing money. It's up to people to decide what they are willing to pay and it's entirely up to them, I wouldn't judge them either way. For me I refuse to pay that much so won't go. Although my resolve may be tested come the title decider in late February...

Hartley saw something in a few players which resulted in Hartlepool's relegation to the National League last season. His abysmal recruitment at Falkirk is legendary, and his signings for Cove last season and so far this season look dreadful too. I think at this stage the last thing a player would want is an endorsement from Hartley. Was never really sure about Paterson, he was full of energy and commitment which does fit the profile of what we'd be looking for, but was never sure of his actual ability. Context is important that season because we had Quitongo start the season at left back who was dreadful, and we then had people filling in at left back until Paterson arrived. Any reasonably competent left back was going to look decent given what went before. In a higher league I'd have a few doubts. However he is young and I liked his attitude so he is the type of signing I'd be happy with (not that I think it's realistic).

GMS is exactly the type of player I'd be avoiding - he hasn't played a game since early October last year, and only played 5 games before that last season. We play a very high energy type of football which relies on the wide players putting a huge shift in, he's never been the most reliable fitness wise or particularly great at the defensive side, and he's 33 in a couple of days so that's hardly going to improve now. He'd be asking for high wages by our standards and it would be a complete lottery what performances (and how many) we got in return. That's the case to some extent with all signings obviously, but the risk far outweighs the reward with a signing like that in my opinion. I think we've more than enough experience in the squad and would rather any money was put towards younger, hungrier players than throwing money at older guys who don't fit the profile of a player who'd fit into our team.

I'm not sure the need we have for 'experience', the team isn't as young or lacking in experience as some make out. On Saturday our midfield was particularly young, but that is with McCabe and Telfer unavailable. Rae is young but is a far better goalie than many of the more experienced goalies we've had. The average age of our back line (which is the area I'd say experience is most important) is 30 and they've played well over 1200 senior games between the 4 of them. McCabe, Telfer and Frizzell are also hugely experienced, as are Gal and Todorov. I don't really see where it is that we are lacking in that regard. It's really just in wider areas that we are relying on younger guys (which is normal) and then squad players, which again is normal. I just think we need 2 or 3 more players purely for the quality they'd bring if we get injuries. I don't particularly care if they are 18 or 35, provided they bring what the manager wants. As someone mentioned earlier, signing an experienced player means they are probably on the way down, which there will be a reason for. You just have to watch 'experienced centre back' Kirk Broadfoot getting torn inside out by Callum Smith a couple of weeks back against Raith and then give 2 penalties away in 2 games to see that actual footballing/athletic ability trumps having played at a higher level most of the time.

Great 3 points. Inverness look poor to me and therefore a home game against them is a game we needed to be picking up all 3 points because most others will too. To win when not playing well and having to grind out a win is very encouraging too. On a side note, Frizz really needs to watch himself. I make that 5 bookings in 7 matches he's had, he's already missed 1 Cup game through suspension and will now miss another, and we're still in August. We can't afford to be missing players through stupidity, which picking up a needless 2nd yellow is. I don't know if this is him trying to impose himself as a captain or something but picking up numerous yellow cards and missing games isn't helping anyone. Red cards killed us last year, we can't get dragged down that road again.

Really well put. The way big clubs operate now isn't really to do with developing players for their first team, it's a business - develop younger players, stick them out on loan to get their value up and sell them on at a profit. If they turn out to be exceptional and make the first team that's a bonus. Just had a quick look and Palace have about 60 players listed on their website just in their Under 18s and Under 21s alone, who will all be full-time. You might get 1 or 2 breaking through but generally they'll all be moved on. As you say, I think the thing that will really help him is having played Senior football and very important games. I don't know what level he will be technically in comparison to the players down there, but that will definitely give him an edge that they don't yet have.

Smith seems to have risen in value over the last few weeks because there are a few clubs short of players, and that's given people an inflated idea of his ability. He's had various unremarkable loan spells in the lower leagues, and then played 15 games for a Championship side that got relegated - he scored 5 goals, 3 of which were penalties. All goals count the same I know, but we have various penalty takers so those can be discounted if you are looking for what he'd bring to us. 2 goals in half a season is hardly anything to get excited about. Given our lack of options in that position I'm sure he'd be a decent option to have, but would have questions over how he'd fit into our team, how much he actually contributes beyond falling over and winning fouls, and whether he'd be worth what we'd have to pay.

I think that's to be expected, the likes of Frizz and McGill do not want to be tied on a 2 year deal should we be relegated. There's a lot of demand from fans to get guys signed up in multiple year deals but the reality is a lot of players don't want that - even if Frizz spent half this season injured he'd still easily get a Championship side next season given his last 2 seasons so there is no benefit in him asking for a 2nd year and risking having to play in League 1 next year, same with Rae, Ballantyne, McGill and probably a few others. That's why I'm not really in the 'I'd bite your hand off for 8th' camp. If we had guys on multiple year deals I would, but we don't. That doesn't mean I'm expecting higher or that I think we should finish higher, but realistically this is our best chance of a higher finish we'll have for the foreseeable future. Goes without saying that it's preferable to relegation, but what does an 8th placed finish really mean? It would very likely mean our better players moving on and potentially McCabe too, and then having to start again. I don't really have any expectations because it's such an unpredictable league, I'm just taking it as it comes, but I'm definitely not of the opinion that we should be desperate for 8th as I don't think that's enough to hold on to our better players, or potentially the manager.