DoingThe42

It's quite interesting to see these things from a wider context. The Pro-B Team lobby like to point out that they do it in other countries, but that doesn't mean it's popular there. I speak German and one of the things I do is follow a couple of Austrian P&B-like sites just for reading practice and to keep up with the football there. One of the forums has a long-running thread just like the 'How do you solve a problem like...' thread. These issues affect all the smaller leagues. Anyway, a common view on that thread and others like it is that the B-Teams in Austria are counter productive. Austrian B-Teams can play all the way up to the second tier, but a lot of fans point out that this means the big clubs' best young players spend the season playing against utter shite in the second tier rather than getting opportunities in the top flight, which they are locked out of by being in the B-Team. And the existence of the B-Team makes them keep a bigger squad. So, it doesn't feed into the first team as planned. So, what's the point? B-Teams are one of these things that can sound sensible as a concept. But they really make no sense for us in Scotland and they'd be a disaster for our lower league system.

f**k those people f**k them. It's all about me.

One of the things that put me off getting a season ticket last season was the prospect of hardly any Saturday 3pms. I think we ended up with maybe 5 or 6 at home? Same thing for this season. I've been wavering for a few years of maybe jumping back in to the Hearts home and away all the time world, but when you look at how the season will pan out, it's a big commitment knowing that a lot of games will be moved for tv or PPV or us or opponents playing in Europe. I get there's a balance to be struck with tv money etc, but I just can't be arsed with traipsing along to Tynecastle on loads of Sundays or Saturday lunchtimes. I genuinely just enjoy it less.

I've finished on exactly 77 games for this season as well. Just the 238 goals for me though, so I've been sold short! 20 new grounds for me this year. It's been a great season, but I'm ready for a few weeks off. Raring to go for the League Cup groups.

Wow. They discriminate against other folk too, so that's ok.

The referee for the CL final may lose the gig as a consequence of speaking at a political event in Poland to promote a party whose slogan is "We stand against Jews, gays, abortion, taxation, and the European Union." https://www.theguardian.com/football/2023/jun/01/champions-league-final-referee-spoke-at-event-with-far-right-leader Sounds like quite a nasty chap. As an aside, Manchester City are owned by the rulers of a country where homosexuality remains illegal and abortion is criminalised in almost all cases.

I've been a season ticket holder since I was at school. I know fine well what it is to watch my team home and away year-in, year-out. It does your position no favour to try and falsely paint me as some kind of footballing travelling salesman. You tried the Barclays fanboi swing and it missed. Upon learning that I watch Scottish football at all levels all the time, you've adjusted your position to 'not a real fan can't be listened to', and, again, you've missed. Maybe, just maybe, your view isn't the only legitimate view a Scottish football fan can have.

We're just not going to agree, and I don't really mind that because there is pretty much no chance the leagues will get bigger, so its a moot point. I've got to say, I'm very impressed by your framing of people who enjoy watching lots of games at different levels as borderline gloryhunting. Football is a competition. It's supposed to be competitive. Generally I'll go to watch the teams I support. More often Clyde these days, but occasionally Hearts. But I'll also go to interesting games in other leagues or involving other teams because I like football and I like watching matches that matter. I don't see what's unusual about that. As long as I'm finished work on time (you can see I'm very busy), I'll probably go to Carnoustie tonight to see a cup semi. The SPFL this season was amazing. Apart from Celtic obviously winning the Premiership from early doors, the only other issue that was really settled relatively early was Dunfermline winning League One. Everything else went to the wire. I find it really strange that people would look at that and think we need to change it to remove some pressure.

Haha! Calm down! For the record, I have barely watched an English (top flight) game in years, haven't seen a Champions League game in about a decade, and have just finished visiting all 42 SPFL clubs for a game in a single season, one where my other football viewing apart from the SPFL has been the WosFL top three flights, the SWPL, the Scottish Youth Cup, and the English National League. I go to 70+ games a season in Scotland right through the system. Fair weather, indeed. How many do you go to? I grew up watching Hearts and Clyde, but watch Clyde more these days. So, frankly my friend, you can shove your Barclays fanboi pish up your arse. I think you maybe just need to accept that some people see things differently. You may find the idea of watching your team finish above Raith very exciting, but I don't think this will be replicated in the public at large. Does your average Killie supporter, for example, get up and go to Tannadice on a Saturday in March to see a game between 10th and 7th with nothing competitive riding on it? Do they wake up thinking about the prize money and jump in the car? I doubt it. But if it's a big game to get into the top 6 and have a shot at Europe, or if it's a relegation battle, then they may well. I don't think this is a difficult point to make. And for all the talk of developing players, it's just guesswork. And, yet again, how come Denmark and Switzerland can do it in their wee leagues of 12?

I don't think fans will wake up in the morning excited by going to the game to see if their side can win an extra place's worth of prize money, no. I can't say that ever crosses my mind when going to a game. It's quite a depressing thought. Making the top six, a shot at Europe, a promotion play-off? That gets folk going to games. The chance to blood players is fine, but is that worth sacrificing exciting football for? People will have their own views, but I don't see why. As I mentioned, Switzerland and Belgium produce players who do well at World Cups and Euros despite having small leagues. Why can't we? Where does this idea come from that we can only blood young players by having a big league? Hibs developed a rake of them in our small league in the 2000s. That's up to the clubs. Your point about the bigger leagues is comparing apples with oranges. The big leagues attract a crowd and always will because they have large populations and they have glamour. There will never be a shortage of people who are keen to go to watch the Bundesliga or a Premier League match. You surely can't really think it's comparable with our football in that regard? Those leagues have quality and they have glamour. So, they can have a club like Fulham selling out every week to be mid table as they are seeing some of the best teams and players in the world. We don't have quality and we don't have glamour. Why would you want to remove excitement as well?

Because the outcome of a lot of them wouldn't matter. I don't get your point. If it's a Wednesday night in May and there's a meaningful game between Motherwell and St Mirren on at Fir Park, I might go along. I don't live far away. I went to that very fixture years back when it was a relegation six-pointer. If it's 11th-place Motherwell against 8th-place St Mirren and nothing riding on it, I'm not paying to get in. Surely it's quite a simple idea. I've talked about this with a few of my mates this season and there's a split, but do people really think our game will suddenly be much better to watch it we just make the league bigger and vary the fixtures? Based on what? What makes that better?

It's only tedious in terms of the Old Firm and everyone else. The rest of the league is competitive on every level, all the way through the divisions. Would it be less tedious if the top flight had 18 teams in it with the Old Firm still miles ahead and most teams with little to play for from about February onwards? I don't see why. Would people really be thrilled by the prospect of watching their team play a couple of months worth of meaningless matches (at thirty quid a pop!) because they were playing more teams? I just don't see that.

But what does improving the quality look like? Where can we reasonably expect Scottish football to be, given the huge financial disparities between big leagues and small leagues now, and the crushing presence of the Old Firm? Then we need to weight up whether the level of improvement we can expect is worth the removal of lots of excitement from the season. I've been watching all the SPFL leagues this season and they've all been exciting with a big choice of meaningful games to go to every week. If we're going to remove that, there needs to be a really good reason to remove it. And is it a given that bigger leagues would improve our young players? Switzerland and Denmark have small leagues, but produce players no bother and go to big tournaments regularly and do quite well in them. Why do we need a big league to do it? I'd certainly go to fewer games per season if there was less to play for. I'm not paying to watch an exhibition.

Happened before, as outlined above. I think it's actually a real shame. The Conference League was needed and is a good tournament. But another tournament where we get an Italy v England final is not what European fitba needed. I'd exclude the top five leagues from the Conference League. Their presence their skews the competition. Italian winner last year. Italian or English winner this year. Probably Villa next year. That's not really what this competition should be. They've got the other two for that.

Cheers for that. I definitely will do. It's like trying to get into a boozer in my youth, though. Need to get a fake ID that says I'm 44 or something.

I can only see one winner here. 4-0 Hearts. And then we'll pick things up a bit after half-time. * PUT THEM TO THE SWORD! * Opinion may be incorrect.

Hello. Did a quick search and couldn't find a thread on this, so thought I'd ask in this section. Does anybody on here play walking football or know much about any clubs? I had to stop playing normal football through injury, but I think walking football might be just about manageable for me and I'd like to give it a try. I'm only 38 and it seems like quite a few of the clubs are for those over 50. Anyone know of a club that would welcome a whippersnapper like me? I live in South Lanarkshire. I was pretty mince at normal football and reckon I would be at this too, but I'd like to score a goal again. So, does anyone play or have any experience?

Who's the English-speaking pundit? It's doing my nut in. The voice is familiar, but I can't place it.

EK Thistle 1-5 Vale of Clyde, WoSFL Third Division, 20/05/2023: Vale of Clyde are crowned champions with a very one-sided victory at the Showpark. It was 3-0 at half-time, but could already have been six or seven. The result was kind to Thistle, if anything. The visitors looked streets ahead and it could have been anything at all. Two really good goals, some good saves, two or three off the bar. Incredibly, this was my first ever trip to the Showpark. I grew up about fifteen minutes away. It's pretty drab by the standards I've seen around the country this season, but it was friendly enough and an enjoyable day. The Village is the only passable part of East Kilbride as well, so not bad to get a walk about.

Disappointed to see Annan joining the Burger Van Club. I don't go to the fitba to have a fucking burger, get a pie stall in the away end, please.

The combo of the third goal and the burning car outside beautifully summed up Clyde's season. Harsh to lose by two last night, but it's just not been good enough.

Interested to see how Iraq do. Been keeping an eye on them recently and quite enjoyed the Gulf Cup.

East Fife were really good in the first half, and played the ball quickly with good movement. Clyde looked slow and clueless in comparison. I've seen EF play like that before, and my concern was that Clyde would struggle with them if their forward players were playing well. That said, Clyde made it very easy for them. A tactical disaster. But I thought the second half things had really stabilised, even before the red card. Clyde weren't brilliant, and they never are, but I think the game was more or less even from half-time till the red card. No idea what East Fife were complaining about. Shepherd had to go, and he'd been chucking his arms about a bit before that as well. Really daft. But also, I think EF reacted to going down to ten as poorly as I've seen from any side in a long time. They didn't handle it at all and a better side would have taken a few goals off them. So, onto Annan. Just glad that after a shiteshow of a season Clyde still have a shot at this. More of the second half from last night and less of the first and Clyde can win it. I've seen both sides, and neither have any real reason to fear each other. Annan, for all they pumped a very hot and cold Dumbarton (so did Albion Rovers), are far from Brazil 1970. If you'd said a few months ago that Clyde would be going into the play-off final with two defeats in eight (if we count last night as a 90 minute defeat) and having knocked out League Two's second best teams over the second half of the season (I believe), I'd have taken it. One more step to go.

Was thinking this myself. They finished on 39 points and -1GD. It's a record that would have been seventh three times in the last decade and never previously bottom. There are four joint-biggest away wins in League Two this season, and three of them are Rovers away wins, including 5-1 at the eventual runners-up. It's a mad season. I've not seen Rovers play since earlier in the season, but I thought they looked a decent enough side, and fans of other clubs in L2 I've spoken to have generally said the same. I suppose this is a sign that the pyramid is working when none of the L2 sides are absolutely fucking awful. Looking forward to the play-off, find myself hoping Rovers stay up.

Firstly, this is something I’ve always wanted to do since reading David Bennie’s A Season in Hell book as a kid. He went to all the grounds in the SFL back in 1996-97 and we had the book in the house when I was a boy. It had always struck me as something that would be fun to do. There was a slight concern that it would become a chore and that I’d crawl to the end of it, fed up with fixtures I had to attend and lacking motivation. But that never happened. Even allowing for Queens Park making me do a trip to Hampden to make the 42 into the 43! The only game I struggled to get out of bed for all season was Airdrie v Clyde back in September. And that was because I’d just been on the bevvy for three days in Riga watching Hearts and had only had one proper nights’ sleep in about four. The variety was good, and the further I got in and the more familiar I was with what was going on in each league, the more genuinely interesting pretty much each game I went to became. People often look for bigger leagues or major reconstruction, but I think the current format has made It really interesting. I’ve constantly been at games where teams have had things to play for. That's been the case right up to the end due to the small league sizes and the fact that in the lower leagues each division has a maximum of five teams who won’t end up promoted, relegated, or in a play-off at the end of the season. I’ve not been to a single pointless game. Teams' seasons can turn around very quickly, and the fact that a few results good or bad can be the difference between a promotion and relegation battle is great fun. It’s been a great season. People complain sometimes about the quality of football. I’ve got two issues with that. Firstly, I don’t really care about technical quality. If I did, I’d just watch La Liga. I want to see meaningful games that are competitive and played in front of crowds that care. And the SPFL provides that in spades, other than at the top of the Premiership. The Championship is excellent. Pretty much every game all season has been a big game. It’s ridiculous. But then League One has had its own dramas, and League Two has been exciting and has provided a really good relegation battle, as well as proper competition for the play-offs. Secondly, I don’t think any of the leagues have been as bad as some people make out. I think the impact of the introduction of the pyramid can be seen in that none of the League Two teams at the bottom end are utterly fucking awful as has been the case in the past. Obviously, they’re shite, they’re at the bottom of our fourth tier, but they’re not uncompetitively shite or embarrassing. The standard at that point has been dragged up and that should be acknowledged. It is absolutely crucial that B-teams are never allowed into the SPFL. They would completely disrupt the eco-system and have no place there whatsoever. Sadly, I feel that may be a ticking timebomb. The main thing that’s been confirmed is that there are loads of great places to watch a game in the SPFL. I love places like Annan, Peterhead, Stenhousemuir with their wee social clubs and friendly staff. If you’re into floodlights and magnificent big terraces, you’ve got Queen of the South. St Mirren v Motherwell and Dundee United v Aberdeen showed that the Premiership away from the Old Firm can provide full houses, good atmospheres, and exciting games. It’s hard to pick one high or one low etc. I had a great time at Forfar, Elgin, Stranraer, Dundee… Loads of them. Livingston is a shite place to watch a game, but I still had a good day out with my mates. Aberdeen charge thirty quid for a terrible view in a crumbling stand and didn’t even offer Pie of the Month in the away end! But, again, it was fun to go to the fitba with friends. Edinburgh is probably the only utterly irredeemably shite venue in the SPFL. Awful. Generally, I’ve moved away from being a regular Premiership watcher. It’s hugely expensive, the fitba is not concomitantly better than the lower leagues, and the grounds are generally less enjoyable to visit. Is your average Premiership visit 12 quid better than a League Two game? Not for me. From next season I’ll be watching Clyde more than Hearts, I’d imagine, but doing this has underlined that on any Saturday there are going to be at least ten games I’d be happy to go to. There’s loads out there, and don’t let arseholes like the Sportsound gang put you off looking beyond the stuff the media fixates on. Average prices per division are below. It should be noted that these prices include games from a range of competitions. Cups, Europe, and some discounts, like going to see Hibs against St Johnstone which was a tenner to get into. So, it's the average cost of visiting the Premiership grounds, for example, rather than actually watching the Premiership I finished on 2.95 goals a game (raging to miss my 3-per-game target). Hearts and Clyde were the two teams I saw most, followed by Partick Thistle, which surprised me. But I saw them four times. I saw both Dundee and St Mirren play on the opening weekend of the league season then never saw either of them again. I saw surprisingly successful away teams, given that the final tally was 20 home wins, 16 away wins, and 6 draws. Average prices of visiting grounds in the: Premiership: £25.33 Championship: £19.10 League One: £16 League Two: £13.80 Excellent pies were had at Arbroath and Livingston. Glad Peterhead have found their microwave and they gave me a hot one after my frozen solid pie experience there in 2018. Angriest fans were either St Mirren or Forfar. Best overall day out including a great train trip, good pubs, good pies, and a smashing ground is probably Arbroath. I never got a fucking sniff with all those half-time draws.