George Parr Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Hopefully Ian remains committed to taking us forward for another season. Whilst there would undoubtedly be a great deal of interest in a managerial vacancy at the Rock, I can't help but think we'd be lucky to pull the rabbit out of the hat twice in terms of keeping us competitive in this division. Get a new assistant in and let's plough on. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimistic Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Could the club entice Murray to stay by improving his budget greatly, in the hope of not just being best part time team, but aim seriously for the play offs? Murray has done a cracking job, although a strange season it's been with probably our target achieved. I'd hope he'd stay with the hope of improving our league status, and his reputation, I hope Murray and the club can achieve their ambitions together. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frank Quitely Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Hopefully Ian remains committed to taking us forward for another season. Whilst there would undoubtedly be a great deal of interest in a managerial vacancy at the Rock, I can't help but think we'd be lucky to pull the rabbit out of the hat twice in terms of keeping us competitive in this division. Get a new assistant in and let's plough on. The problem with that could be that we repeat some of the mistakes of last season and leap into re-signing a big chunk of an existing squad which for its survival in the Championship relied very heavily on loan signings, Rogers, Kane and Findlay in particular. IMO we need a root and branch team reboot, especially in midfield, and I'd love to know the Manager's thoughts on that. Re the Assistant Manager role, rather worryingly Ian Murray seemed to suggest that Mark Spalding looks well placed to inherit it. No harm to the guy but the Board should insist that we at least have some sort of contest, especially given how the Bezeulin appointment bombed. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Parr Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 The biggest focus for team repairs has to be the defence. As a minimum this summer we need a new goalkeeper (as ever) and a new centre back. Re-signing all the current players wouldn't change that position. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnny graham Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 We are coming up.to the end of the season soon with a last home game against raith rovers which has no great significance to either side. A crowd of 700 might be optimistic. Time for Gilbert and the boys to think out of the box. Albion rovers had a successful day when supporters were asked to pay what they could afford. This more than doubled the attendance. If that is a step to far for our esteemed board how about half price admission with under 16s getting free admittance. Dumbarton need to reach out and attract more support . If the punters don't come to the stadium something has to be done to raise the profile of DFC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
optimistic Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 I'd keep the majority of players but we need a midfielder like turner when he's out, a big man up front to compliment Campbell/Fleming. Another decent centre half alongside graham if not findlay. A left back if not Wilson, Taggart has been fairly consistent out of all the pre season signings, Campbell is improving now he knows his injury has totally healed and strong. But if we are to move forward, wholesale changes will need made 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThirdrockfromtheSon Posted April 12, 2015 Share Posted April 12, 2015 Interesting points BSF and I don't disagree with a lot of it but I think for that to happen Murray would need to have long term ambitions at this club and I don't see that being the case. He's made it no secret from the off that he hopes to do well here and move into full time. He's done very well here and there is a part of me that feels the time is right for him to move on and if he ended up at St Mirren it wouldn't surprise me. We have an interesting summer ahead anyway, no matter who's in charge. I'm not so sure taking on the St.Mirren job is a good move, particularly if they're (more than likely) about to be relegated. Gilmour wants everything done on the cheap (Lennon, Craig, Teale) and wants to sell the club. There isn't a lot of money going to be ploughed into the Saints any time soon. Potential buyers have come and gone for them, so I don't think the Manager's job is one of milk and honey at New St.mirren Park, somehow. He can do better than that, and might be better waiting for the first Managerial casualty in the Premiership next year IMHO. If he goes, it will be with my gratitude for what he's done for us. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Does anyone know if there is tickets left for match v Rangers? Abroad atm so can't find out? They go on public sale today. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 None of us have any idea what Murray's thinking is as far as moving on. I thought he'd leave last season and was proved wrong. I think we'll be unlikely to hold on to him with the merry-go-round begins birling soon but again I may be wrong. I happen to think it was more the way our midfield was deployed this season that led to some of the problems rather than the personnel. Some players can't play 3-5-1-1 or 4-3-2-1, or 4-2-3-1 or whatever it is this week. Hearts set up 3-5-2 yesterday and abandoned it midway through the first half because it wasn't working. Hibs played the same system to great effect. The problem with playing three at the back and five in midfield is that you invite the superior full time team to attack you down the flanks. Your 'wing backs' then have to try and race back and cover the full back position.The players have tried their best to play the system, and ironically whilst it failed against the bigger teams, we got some decent results (if not performances) using it against the diddies. Personally, I'd rather see a return to last season's attacking style and hang the consequences, we already have the players for that - rather than scouring the lower leagues for guys who may or may not be able to play 5 in midfield or who may or may not gel together. That and acting as a safety net for the likes of Van Zanten, Mair and Wilson. Murray has done a good job this season in keeping us up but often there is more than one way of doing things. Prunty was sacrificed for the system and left too soon IMHO. His goal tally at Airdrie probably wouldn't have been as high in the higher division (and yes a few of them have been penalties) but I'd rather have seen a team with him and Fleming or Megginson up front playing 4-4-2 and having a go than some of the dismal stuff we have witnessed. However, I have no doubt that Ian Murray knows a tad more than me about fitba' and tactics so maybe there was only one way of skinning this particular feline. Perhaps if we were to give young McCallum a chance next season and play someone up with him that would be a start? If there are better part time players (or loan deals) out there then fine lets get them in and we can thank our current guys for their efforts. A 'root and branch reeboot' is fine when there is the budget, means and players to do that. A more cautious approach might be a better option though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 None of us have any idea what Murray's thinking is as far as moving on. I thought he'd leave last season and was proved wrong. I think we'll be unlikely to hold on to him with the merry-go-round begins birling soon but again I may be wrong. I happen to think it was more the way our midfield was deployed this season that led to some of the problems rather than the personnel. Some players can't play 3-5-1-1 or 4-3-2-1, or 4-2-3-1 or whatever it is this week. Hearts set up 3-5-2 yesterday and abandoned it midway through the first half because it wasn't working. Hibs played the same system to great effect. The problem with playing three at the back and five in midfield is that you invite the superior full time team to attack you down the flanks. Your 'wing backs' then have to try and race back and cover the full back position.The players have tried their best to play the system, and ironically whilst it failed against the bigger teams, we got some decent results (if not performances) using it against the diddies. Personally, I'd rather see a return to last season's attacking style and hang the consequences, we already have the players for that - rather than scouring the lower leagues for guys who may or may not be able to play 5 in midfield or who may or may not gel together. That and acting as a safety net for the likes of Van Zanten, Mair and Wilson. Murray has done a good job this season in keeping us up but often there is more than one way of doing things. Prunty was sacrificed for the system and left too soon IMHO. His goal tally at Airdrie probably wouldn't have been as high in the higher division (and yes a few of them have been penalties) but I'd rather have seen a team with him and Fleming or Megginson (or Campbell) up front playing 4-4-2 and having a go than some of the dismal stuff we have witnessed. However, I have no doubt that Ian Murray knows a tad more than me about fitba' and tactics so maybe there was only one way of skinning this particular feline. Perhaps if we were to give young McCallum a chance next season and play someone up with him that would be a start? If there are better part time players (or loan deals) out there then fine lets get them in and we can thank our current guys for their efforts. A 'root and branch reeboot' is fine when there is the budget, means and players to do that. A more cautious approach might be a better option though. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sonsanorak Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 (edited) Lets not forget the rise in season ticket prices that we were hit with last close season. I would guess that the additional income from that went towards the playing staff and manager. At the time I felt a bit disappointed that the extra cost to me wasnt directly linked to better players signing. Personally, if we applied the argument made justifying last years rise theres no requirement for another rise this year; the same number of big teams and Cat A games will remain. The notion of full time football should be discarded. I think at some point Murrays ambitions may out grow DFC, thats fine. We should not risk our clubs finances or future for any individual. If Murrays remit was to keep us in the league then he's/we've succeeded. Aye the means hasnt been particularly pretty but its still job done. Edited April 13, 2015 by sonsanorak 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BallochSonsFan Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 We need Rangers to go up via the play-offs this season. Another year of Rangers in the Championship means another 2 bumper crowds for our rivals. That gives clubs the money to pay increased wages - wages that we're likely going to be unable to offer. 5000 fans at Cowden, Alloa or Raith twice a year gives those clubs a nice financial boost. Another year of Hibs, St Mirren plus 1 other premier league side isn't going to have the same level of crowds as another year of Rangers would. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bring Back Paddy Flannery Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 We are coming up.to the end of the season soon with a last home game against raith rovers which has no great significance to either side. A crowd of 700 might be optimistic. Time for Gilbert and the boys to think out of the box. Albion rovers had a successful day when supporters were asked to pay what they could afford. This more than doubled the attendance. If that is a step to far for our esteemed board how about half price admission with under 16s getting free admittance. Dumbarton need to reach out and attract more support . If the punters don't come to the stadium something has to be done to raise the profile of DFC. This^ Would be nice to see us try something different to entice a decent sized crowd. What that is I'm not sure, perhaps a 'pay what you can' type deal which seems to have been successful with others. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Having thought again on the manager's situation, I think you can rule out St Mirren. Can't see them paying out five figures in compensation for the remaining year on Murray's contract. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Howlin' Wilf Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 This^ Would be nice to see us try something different to entice a decent sized crowd. What that is I'm not sure, perhaps a 'pay what you can' type deal which seems to have been successful with others. It's a nice thought but Albion Rovers had a 125% increase in their crowd when they did it. We have 500 season ticket places and a home capacity of fewer than 900. Can anyone see a possible flaw? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
George Parr Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 It's a nice thought but Albion Rovers had a 125% increase in their crowd when they did it. We have 500 season ticket places and a home capacity of fewer than 900. Can anyone see a possible flaw? Nope. Presumably AR had something to play for when they did it. We could offer free entry for the Raith match and still not see the home end full. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thommo90 Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 The problem with playing three at the back and five in midfield is that you invite the superior full time team to attack you down the flanks. Your 'wing backs' then have to try and race back and cover the full back position.The players have tried their best to play the system, and ironically whilst it failed against the bigger teams, we got some decent results (if not performances) using it against the diddies though. We haven't had any decent results playing 5 at the back / wing back set up, don't think we even picked up a single point playing this. Only game would be Livi away the first time, but we were down 1-0 and then changed to 442 and won 2-1. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 Could the club entice Murray to stay by improving his budget greatly, in the hope of not just being best part time team, but aim seriously for the play offs? Murray has done a cracking job, although a strange season it's been with probably our target achieved. I'd hope he'd stay with the hope of improving our league status, and his reputation, I hope Murray and the club can achieve their ambitions together. Increasing the budget requires more money and unless me or you win the lottery it's hard to see where we're getting that much more money from that we would make a serious challenge for 4th. Having thought again on the manager's situation, I think you can rule out St Mirren. Can't see them paying out five figures in compensation for the remaining year on Murray's contract. Maybe, although if Murray's the man they want will they really let ~£10K get in the way? I honestly don't think compensation will be a stumbling block for anyone who wants to take Murray. If we were to start haggling over compensation the likely outcome is that Murray resigns and takes the job anyway leaving us with hee-haw. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Moonster Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 I'm not so sure taking on the St.Mirren job is a good move, particularly if they're (more than likely) about to be relegated. Gilmour wants everything done on the cheap (Lennon, Craig, Teale) and wants to sell the club. There isn't a lot of money going to be ploughed into the Saints any time soon. Potential buyers have come and gone for them, so I don't think the Manager's job is one of milk and honey at New St.mirren Park, somehow. He can do better than that, and might be better waiting for the first Managerial casualty in the Premiership next year IMHO. If he goes, it will be with my gratitude for what he's done for us. I understand where you're coming from but Murray hasn't had a massive budget to work with here either. He wants to be in full-time management, St. Mirren will likely be the 2nd/3rd biggest club in the league next year and will have a bigger budget than most in this league. I do agree that he could do a job at a club in the Premiership but the reality is that those jobs have come and gone and he's not been interviewed for any of them. Whilst he might be better waiting for the first managerial casualty, that doesn't suit us very well. If he has intentions of applying for jobs throughout the season then I'd rather he left in the summer and we let the new manager in to build his team. I admit I could be well off the mark here but St Mirren just seems to make sense to me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted April 13, 2015 Share Posted April 13, 2015 I think we need park speculation about possible scenarios and concentrate on what we already know, and for me that is the plain fact that the team needs strengthening across virtually all positions. I keep repeating, had it not been for some crucial loan deals, we would not be planning for another season in the Championship. Some argue about tactics and formations, fair enough, but there has to be a recognition that minus the likes of Rogers, Findlay, Kane our squad is way too lightweight and in several cases not good enough to compete at this level. And much as I'd like to, I don't see any youth players ready to make the step up. I don't mean any disrespect but that's my take on it. Saturday was painful to watch at times as yet again a team passed it's way thro us almost at will. Conversely, when we have possession there is virtually no movement off the ball for the guy looking to make a pass and Andy Graham apart we must be the quietest team in the league. Harrying and tackling opponents has become an afterthought. We simply won't get away with that two seasons in a row, and I think the summer activity should reflect that. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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