1971 Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 ISIS aren't like Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda was a terrorist group. ISIS, as the name suggests, are an Islamic State I give up. Your mum is an Islamic State. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotgun Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 ISIS aren't like Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda was a terrorist group. ISIS, as the name suggests, are an Islamic State Time to call it a night, I think mate. This is just getting silly now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 It's the Iraqi government but at the moment they are occupied by a caliphate. Don't be so simplistic and accepting of ISIS. So as a citizen of Mosul, how long would the caliphate have to stay in total power of you as a citizen before you could legitimately refer to it as the state? Or would you need UN approval? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WullieBroonIsGod Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 We should tweet Richard Osman from pointless to ask him. He's on the ball with these kind of things. Imagine a Falkirk Pointless Special "countries beginning with a vowel" Mr Bairn "ISIS" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoda Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Mr. Bairn isn't wrong per se, it's just that he clearly doesn't know what he's posting about. Which comes as a surprise to absolutely no one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotgun Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 We should tweet Richard Osman from pointless to ask him. He's on the ball with these kind of things. Imagine a Falkirk Pointless Special "countries beginning with a vowel" Mr Bairn "ISIS" I've used up my quota of greenies today. I'll send you a manly hug instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr. Brightside Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 ISIS aren't like Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda was a terrorist group. ISIS, as the name suggests, are an Islamic State Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 The point is, these nations are acting legitimately to assist an ally Irans support for Hezb'allah is legitimate? Russias decision to bomb anyone opposed to Assad is legitimate? Carte blanch for neoconservativism there. is clearly going to hinder efforts to defeat ISIS . Isis are a group of Sunni extreamists in a Sunni majority country. So supporting a Shia minority regime is he best way to rally support against them is it? Surely a functioning government and army in the host nation is only going to be beneficial to operations. Said no one other than hardline Nazis in May 1945 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zen Archer (Raconteur) Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thundermonkey Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 So as a citizen of Mosul, how long would the caliphate have to stay in total power of you as a citizen before you could legitimately refer to it as the state? Or would you need UN approval? In 2015 I don't think we should ever recognise an organisation that murders it's way into power as a state. Especially as it's hell bend on resurrecting an ideal that first appeared and failed over 1000 years ago. You are aware that it is currently slaughtering it's 'citizens' on a daily basis? If you are happy to doff your cap to these murderers and legitimise them so be it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 ISIS aren't like Al Qaeda. Al Qaeda was a terrorist group. ISIS, as the name suggests, are an Islamic State I have to own up to coming back from the pub and jumping head first into this debate, which in hindsight was unwise. Mr Bairn is indeed an idiot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fife Saint Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Glad we've got that point agreed lads. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heedthebaa Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 Suspect suitcases being left all around East Lothian tonight, polis everywhere. There heeeerrrreeee Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pandarilla Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I have a touch of sympathy with Mr Bairn, although he's explained his point stupidly (and i can't decide if that's intentional). In the fact that ISIS are actively controlling huge swathes of land where previous states existed they are surely distinguishable from the ira or al qaeda. Those organisations were your more traditional terrorist organisations. Would people accept that this is a different threat? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Grass Is Greener. Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I have to own up to coming back from the pub and jumping head first into this debate, which in hindsight was unwise. Mr Bairn is indeed an idiot. Were you solo pubbing tonight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shotgun Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I have to own up to coming back from the pub and jumping head first into this debate, which in hindsight was unwise. Mr Bairn is indeed an idiot. If I was wearing a hat, I would doff it to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turkmenbashi Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 The point is, these nations are acting legitimately to assist an ally and are proving to be an effective force against what hopefully everyone can agree is the biggest threat. Refusing to cooperate with them on the basis of unrelated political differences is clearly going to hinder efforts to defeat ISIS. Not sure what your issue is with the next bit. Surely a functioning government and army in the host nation is only going to be beneficial to operations. The idea that a Shia minority regime, especially one as brutal and sectarian as the Assad regime, is the solution in a Sunni majority country is ridiculous. No Sunni, even those opposed to ISIS, would accept it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1971 Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 I have a touch of sympathy with Mr Bairn, although he's explained his point stupidly (and i can't decide if that's intentional). In the fact that ISIS are actively controlling huge swathes of land where previous states existed they are surely distinguishable from the ira or al qaeda. Those organisations were your more traditional terrorist organisations. Would people accept that this is a different threat? Currently controlling land doesn't make them a state. It may make them a different type of terrorist organisation (although many other terrorist organisation have controlled and continue to control territory), but it doesn't make them anything like a state. It also doesn't mean that "previous" states no longer exist. They do. Absolute state of Mr Bairn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted November 15, 2015 Share Posted November 15, 2015 The idea that a Shia minority regime, especially one as brutal and sectarian as the Assad regime, is the solution in a Sunni majority country is ridiculous. No Sunni, even those opposed to ISIS, would accept it. They lived with it for the last 50 years. The last independent opinion poll had the Assad regime's popularity at around 50%. Do you think a Sunni regime with Alawite, Christian, Druze and Kurd minorities would do better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dorlomin Posted November 16, 2015 Share Posted November 16, 2015 They lived with it for the last 50 years. Like the Irish lived with London rule for a couple of centuries or Scotland did for that matter. Do you think a Sunni regime with Alawite, Christian, Druze and Kurd minorities would do better? It that not for the Syrian people to decide? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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