DublinMagyar Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 So we've basically got to the conclusion that we currently import chicken and other meats from all over the place. So if anything we might see more demand for local produce post Brexit. Sounds good to me.We ONLY import foodstuffs of Animal Origin if those foodstuffs meet EU Regs. A FTA with USA will not result in Scottish/.uk food laws staying as they are now, hence Chlorinated chicken ! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamieThomas Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 5 minutes ago, Detournement said: I don't see how you can consider less democratic accountability over military action a good thing? I can certainly sardonically point out that it'd be the exact fucking same as it is now. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Just now, JamieThomas said: I can certainly sardonically point out that it'd be the exact fucking same as it is now. I'm not sure it would.The EU parliament and 27 member states have recognised the coup in Venezuela. I doubt all 27 national parliaments would have made the same decision. If military action in Syria was decided at a European level would Ed Milliband have been able to effectively block direct intervention? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Bob Mahelp Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Westminster have already proven that they'll toss Scottish government legislation aside at the drop of a hat, and there's f*ck all that Scotland can do about it. Anyone that thinks that ANY Scottish legislation as it stands at the moment is safe after the Tories push through their poisonous right-wing Brexit is either f*cking deluded, or an arse-licking Uncle McTom who detests the principle of Scottish self-determination in any shape or form. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, strichener said: The indication that they wished to leave was clear. It gets rather repetitive that just because the politicians cannot work out a suitable arrangement that the electorate have somehow been to blame for this. In the same way as if we had voted remain, would this have meant that each remain voter was happy with a European army, greater federalisation, ECB intervention in sovereign economies or were they in favour of reform of the current Eu in the way Cameron "negotiated" or some other option. Both sides had a choice to make and each person chose for their own reasons (how many, like yourself, used it as a proxy to try and obtain independence?) but the choice was binary and the result clear. I agree with you, it's becoming rather repetitive. So let me ask you, hand on heart what is it that you seek from Brexit ? Freedom from whatever it is that haunts many British Nationalists about the EU, illusory or otherwise ? Or freedom for the UK to finally become Baldrick to America's Blackadder as we jointly intervene in sovereign economies and undertake illegal military adventures whilst arming despotic b*****ds to the hilt, as long as they are 'our' b*****ds ? I'm almost 63 and I've watched the UK descend into a grubby, greedy, grasping, immoral and corrupt little island. The EU has many, many faults, but it is my firm belief that retaining membership is the best option for the UK, Scotland and my grandaughters' future. Edited February 5, 2019 by O'Kelly Isley III 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beefybake Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 (edited) 1 hour ago, strichener said: The indication that they wished to leave was clear. It gets rather repetitive that just because the politicians cannot work out a suitable arrangement that the electorate have somehow been to blame for this. In the same way as if we had voted remain, would this have meant that each remain voter was happy with a European army, greater federalisation, ECB intervention in sovereign economies or were they in favour of reform of the current Eu in the way Cameron "negotiated" or some other option. Both sides had a choice to make and each person chose for their own reasons (how many, like yourself, used it as a proxy to try and obtain independence?) but the choice was binary and the result clear. For me, clear now inhabits the same world as ... "What is important is....." and "I am totally/completely/absolutely clear that etc.... ". Ie politician speak. The referendum was a device adopted by a Prime Minister of a Conservative government to once and for all ( he thought ) put to bed a problem within the Conservative party. The referendum had zero to do with the best interests of any or all of Scotland, England, Northern Ireland or Wales. I have always considered the whole affair to be illegitimate. Edited February 5, 2019 by beefybake 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted February 5, 2019 Author Share Posted February 5, 2019 So we've basically got to the conclusion that we currently import chicken and other meats from all over the place. So if anything we might see more demand for local produce post Brexit.Sounds good to me.You've just made a c**t of yourself again.....Hth 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Lambies Doos Posted February 5, 2019 Author Share Posted February 5, 2019 Did anyone ever cogently explain why the EUROPEAN ARMY is so awful/terrifying/isidious btw?Hitler and all that.. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kirkyblue2 Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 1 hour ago, JamieThomas said: Did anyone ever cogently explain why the EUROPEAN ARMY is so awful/terrifying/isidious btw? Maybe if they brought back national service it would be. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Granny Danger Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Just saw May in NI, backpedaling like f**k! Now the ERG saying changes to the backstop is not enough, it must be removed. Fun and games ahead. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
O'Kelly Isley III Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 If you think that the UK It removes control of the military from national parliaments which have considerably more democratic accountability than EU institutions. It also means the EU can deploy soldiers from one member to combat civil unrest in another. If you think that the UK military is democratically accountable to Parliament then you want to get a copy of 'The History Thieves' by Ian Cobain.And whilst I'm not at all convinced that Europe IS headed in this direction (another straight banana job), a collegiate decision-making process would maybe have avoided the carnage in Iraq, not to mention the death of Labour as a party of morality. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Detournement Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 It's undeniable that the UK parliament halted a planned invasion of Syria in 2014. If the EU gained the power to authorise military action there would be nothing stopping them passing a bill like the one which has allowed US Presidents to wage war anywhere they want since 2001 or enshrine some responsibility to protect bullshit. Once that happens there would be very little accountability. You mention Iraq but I get the impression that the USA is very keen to ensure that nothing like the opposition to the Iraq War from France and others will ever happen again. In the last decade American war policy has been consistently supported by European leaders with hardly a dissenting voice. The entire continent appears to have been Poodle-ised. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshbairn Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 1 minute ago, Detournement said: It's undeniable that the UK parliament halted a planned invasion of Syria in 2014 Cameron allowed a vote, which he assumed would lose, while not losing loyal ally status with the Yanks. Obama saw it as a good idea and did the same, against huge pressure. If Cameron or Obama had wanted to attack Syria they would have done so and Parliament and Congress would have been unable to stop it. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zidane's child Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 48 minutes ago, Granny Danger said: Fun and games ahead. More like Groundhog Day Granny! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 1 hour ago, John Lambies Doos said: 2 hours ago, JamieThomas said: Did anyone ever cogently explain why the EUROPEAN ARMY is so awful/terrifying/isidious btw? Hitler and all that.. I thought he was dead. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chapelhall chap Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 (edited) 3 hours ago, Colkitto said: Watched May speech there in N.Ireland. Bonkers stuff... No hard border, no Cu or SM, renegotiating backstop, but not Withdrawal Agreement. Think that's what she said anyway. Totally confusing and full of contradictions. The 3 questions she allowed from the press didn't shed any light either.. She acknowledged that Northern Ireland had voted to remain and that some saw this departure as having "unwanted" impact. I think that is the first time she has diverged from the "We voted to join as a country, and we will leave as a country"-- the answer she gives to Ian Blackford etc in Westminster, I cant remember her ever acknowledging this about scotland in any other comments but I stopped listening to her many months ago . She also said the GFA demands the consent of the people of NI to any change in it's Constitutional status-surely losing your EU Constitutional status is being effected in that Remain province? ( or one of the four nations in our family of nations) She also appears to say there has to be an insurance policy so the Bin the backstop guys will be just as likely to vote down any minor change next week. She could have given that drivel of a speech at any time since becoming PM. Edited February 5, 2019 by Chapelhall chap 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fullerene Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 6 hours ago, DA Baracus said: It's a weird fetish that the Empire-ists have where they want everyone to think that England is massively important on a world stage and that everyone needs them, and thinking that any of that shit really matters. I recall being in Angola when David Bowie died. As a Portuguese speaking country, the main news channel was Brazilian. It devoted a lot of time to his death. I thought why would they devote so much time to David Bowie - surely Brazil has something equivalent. Similarly, I encounter foreigners talking about the Beatles, the Rolling Stones, William Shakespeare, Charles Dickens and James Bond films. You would think this might count as exceptionalism. Yet the Brexiteers show no interest in any of this. They are more interested in great battles and world conquest. In the past, militarily, the UK had one big advantage - a giant moat. Once some fool invented the airplane, that changed everything. For the future, there are no colonies to be created and I doubt there will be any great battles and territory to gain. I guess the Brexiteers haven't realised that the world has moved on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Arlene Foster just been on Radio 4 saying that the intransigence of the EU and the Irish Republic in negotiations over the backstop is unacceptable."IT'S UNACCEPTABLE SO IT IS."© Jim MacDonald. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Are you suggesting that if there was a demand to stay in the UK, the majority of people would have voted Lib Dem? Put the keyboard away, you're drunk. [emoji38]Because everyone voted in the General Election solely on the basis of Brexit.[emoji48] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DeeTillEhDeh Posted February 5, 2019 Share Posted February 5, 2019 Or we could have remained and shaped the EU with our loud, strong, voice that holds such sway over the EU. Do we know where that would have led us? How did you vote regarding the Maastricht or Lisbon treaties? The absolute shambles in negotiating an exit and the subsequent Westminster shenanigans can be laid squarely at the feet of the politicians. This in no way detracts from the referendum result - the electorate made their position clear.Which of the Heinz 57 varieties of Leave did they vote for?Many Leave campaigners promised that there would be a Norway or Switzerland style deal only for it to never be an option from the outset.It's been hard Brexit or No Brexit from the start just to appease the wankers in the ERG. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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