Spanish Armada Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 17 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said: As you say, only signing under 30s to sell them on - as has been mentioned up the thread - could only be the plan if we were signing guys on multiple year deals. As we aren't, I can't see how that is the plan. Development fees for guys you've signed and only had for a year or two are hardly going to be a big earner. It's a bit of a cliche but you need some experienced leaders in the team. That doesn't mean they need to be over an arbitrary age, in this case 30, but you do need them. Part of the failure of the Wotherspoon/King era was a lack of leadership on the park. The senior pros were Russell, Conroy and Fitzpatrick (who was injured for most of it if I remember correctly) which was not what was required and I think the younger guys at the time suffered as a result. I like the mix of our squad as it is, with maybe one addition. We have an experienced option in nets if needed and have good leadership in the back 4. Up front, Carrick and Gallagher have good experience at a higher level. It's just the midfield where I think we might need someone else. Good quality, senior midfielders who can run a game aren't exactly cheap though. We’ve got experienced players there,Hutts Crighton Fordyce Gall carrick and even max Currie has played a decent amount of games for Stranraer plus you’ve got the quality of O’Reilly and Robert to come in we’ve got a decent young squad and are maybe one or two players away from a really strong team! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr November Posted July 22, 2020 Share Posted July 22, 2020 11 minutes ago, Diamonds are Forever said: As you say, only signing under 30s to sell them on - as has been mentioned up the thread - could only be the plan if we were signing guys on multiple year deals. As we aren't, I can't see how that is the plan. Development fees for guys you've signed and only had for a year or two are hardly going to be a big earner. It's a bit of a cliche but you need some experienced leaders in the team. That doesn't mean they need to be over an arbitrary age, in this case 30, but you do need them. Part of the failure of the Wotherspoon/King era was a lack of leadership on the park. The senior pros were Russell, Conroy and Fitzpatrick (who was injured for most of it if I remember correctly) which was not what was required and I think the younger guys at the time suffered as a result. I like the mix of our squad as it is, with maybe one addition. We have an experienced option in nets if needed and have good leadership in the back 4. Up front, Carrick and Gallagher have good experience at a higher level. It's just the midfield where I think we might need someone else. Good quality, senior midfielders who can run a game aren't exactly cheap though. I agree with all of this. It’s really important to have a good balance in the squad and as you say, I think we’re probably an experienced midfielder away from that. I would imagine the manager will be well aware of that given we’ve let Millar and Wedderburn go, though I think we probably need to bring in a slightly different type of player we definitely do need to replace that experience. Only signing players under 30 comes across as a bit too Football Manager but in our case I think it’s probably justified at the moment, providing we’re still bringing the odd experienced player to compliment the younger players. While we clearly struggled under the Wotherspoon era due to a lack of experience and leadership, we also struggled under Stevie Findlay for the opposite reasons. He signed a lot of experienced League One players in Robertson, Millar, Page, McIntosh etc and while they were all decent enough players (Page excluded) with good experience at this level, we really lacked pace and excitement that season. Trying to find a balance between the two is our best way of being successful. While we have some full-time players, Falkirk and Thistle will still have comfortably bigger budgets than us and we won’t be able to sign up the best squad on paper. We still have a decent core with the majority of last seasons defence and attack still there and while we have that experienced core I’d rather see the club gamble on a few players like Thomas Robert than sign up average League One players to pad out the squad. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodwin Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 Any views on the preferred formation given the squad so far. 3-5-2 maybe give that we've 4 out-and-out defenders (hopefully Kerr will be allowed to play there) plus McCann, McDonald, Thomson and Reilly offering different options for the wide berth. I hope we've still to get some talent in the midfield as that area looks incomplete 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyDD Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 10 hours ago, Chapelhall chap said: Well well Andy I would never have known that until tonight. For my suffering 40+ years of season ticket I forgive you. Does look like very good news in both ways. Haha, appreciated! I've been going to enough home games to have made it worth my while the last few seasons so it's about time to be fair. The lack of a summer holiday this year has helped anawl it has to be said, in terms of disposable income in the summer months. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr November Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 3 hours ago, goodwin said: Any views on the preferred formation given the squad so far. 3-5-2 maybe give that we've 4 out-and-out defenders (hopefully Kerr will be allowed to play there) plus McCann, McDonald, Thomson and Reilly offering different options for the wide berth. I hope we've still to get some talent in the midfield as that area looks incomplete I'd be open to trying a back three again in the closed door or league cup games as we do have good options in defence but we looked much better once we settled on a back four last season. Crighton, Fordyce and Kerr are all good players but they're all players who seem more comfortable on their right foot which doesn't really lend itself a back three. It's good to have these options though, as we saw even in the last game of the season we kept a clean sheet and looked decent defensively with a back four of Fordyce - Crighton - Kerr - MacDonald. Given we tried playing Kerr in midfield a couple of times last season and the end of season highlights video he tweeted described him as a centre back/midfielder, I think we're more likely to see Kerr and McKay in midfield together based on the current squad. As you say though, we definitely still need at least one more midfielder. Hearts game aside, I remember Kerr being pretty poor in the 0-0 home game against Stranraer when we started in midfield but to be fair the whole team struggled that day so it's hard to judge how he would do there long-term. He was really coming onto a game towards the end of last season though so hopefully he continues to improve with experience. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShineOnYouCrazyDiamonds Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 With a few centre backs in the squad a back 3 might make sense but I'd expect a 343 more likely than a 352 given that we've also got a fair few wide players (O'Reilly, Thomson, Robert, even Carrick or Roy might be used there) as well as our full backs. No point in trying to work out our formation before the squad is even complete as we will definitely be bringing in more midfielders, but I think Murray generally prefers a back 4 and only used a back 3 when it seemed like the only option due to a lack of wide players last season or no decent centre back to play next to Crighton the season before. I think McCann and MacDonald play better in a back 4 as well, rather than as wing backs with limited support out wide. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondDownSouth Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 4-2-3-1? Back four, two to protect back four plus set up attacks, two wingers & a no.10, and a striker. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stevo1968 Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, DiamondDownSouth said: 4-2-3-1? Back four, two to protect back four plus set up attacks, two wingers & a no.10, and a striker. I’d say we’ll end up going with this or 4-1-3-2 Edited July 23, 2020 by Stevo1968 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cb_diamond Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 29 minutes ago, Stevo1968 said: I’d say we’ll end up going with this or 4-1-3-2 I really hope it will be this but think the other permutation is more likely given Murray's approach at times. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
goodwin Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 2 hours ago, DiamondDownSouth said: 4-2-3-1? Back four, two to protect back four plus set up attacks, two wingers & a no.10, and a striker. That seems likley 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShineOnYouCrazyDiamonds Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 4-2-3-1? Back four, two to protect back four plus set up attacks, two wingers & a no.10, and a striker.The 442 of today. I'd expect this is the formation most managers/DoF have in mind when building a squad these days and I wouldn't be surprised if we were to use it this season. Carrick as no. 10 with Robert and O'Reilly/Thomson on the wings and Gallagher up top? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G_H Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 (edited) This is roughly what I would field based on the current squad, having not seen half the squad play and based on a bunch of assumptions. Not too sure about Robert's position as I think he played on the wing vs Chelsea U21s. Theres clearly a gap in CM and more likely Robert goes to a wing and Thomson ends up on the bench. I'm sure Murray would continue to see something in McKay that I don't as well GK - Hutton/Currie (Depending on form) DR - MacDonald DC - Fordyce DC - Crighton DL - McCann DM - Kerr RW - O'Reilly CM - Robert LW - Thomson CF - Carrick CF - Gallagher S1 Hutton/Currie S2 McKay S3 Mbayo S4 Roy S5+ Random Edited July 23, 2020 by G_H 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DiamondDownSouth Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 57 minutes ago, G_H said: This is roughly what I would field based on the current squad, having not seen half the squad play and based on a bunch of assumptions. Not too sure about Robert's position as I think he played on the wing vs Chelsea U21s. Theres clearly a gap in CM and more likely Robert goes to a wing and Thomson ends up on the bench. I'm sure Murray would continue to see something in McKay that I don't as well GK - Hutton/Currie (Depending on form) DR - MacDonald DC - Fordyce DC - Crighton DL - McCann DM - Kerr RW - O'Reilly CM - Robert LW - Thomson CF - Carrick CF - Gallagher S1 Hutton/Currie S2 McKay S3 Mbayo S4 Roy S5+ Random That was precisely what I was thinking except for Kerr & McKay, two of O'Reilly/Robert/Thomson on the wings and Carrick playing behind Gallagher in the no.10 role. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShineOnYouCrazyDiamonds Posted July 23, 2020 Share Posted July 23, 2020 That was precisely what I was thinking except for Kerr & McKay, two of O'Reilly/Robert/Thomson on the wings and Carrick playing behind Gallagher in the no.10 role.Exactly how I'd do it with the current squad but I would expect (and hope) for midfield arrivals and another striker to maybe mix things up. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyDD Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 It's obviously difficult to say when we haven't seen anything of some of the squad, but the defensive record does make you think we are unlikely to see much change there. It would be hard to justify, but if Mbayo has been brought in as a starter we could well end up with 3 at the back; Fordyce left of a 3 with Crighton and Mbayo. That would allow us to play 3-5-2, 3-4-1-2, 3-4-2-1 etc. As many have mentioned already, you'd still expect a few more additions who could change the options again. Importantly, though, it does look like we will have options and adaptability could be crucial. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ShineOnYouCrazyDiamonds Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 Might be nothing in it, but our 20 man squad is using numbers up to 25 as it stands with 12, 13, 16, 18 and 21 vacant. 13 unlikely to be used meaning there are four vacant numbers to be filled, suggesting there are still four vacant spaces in the squad to be filled. I'd expect three midfielders and a forward if this is the case. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spanish Armada Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 My team with what we’ve signed so far I think we’re a No10 and another striker away Hutton mcdonald Fordyce Crighton Mcann Kerr. McKay No 10 carrick. Gallagher. Robert 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rio 2 Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 On 23/07/2020 at 07:59, goodwin said: Any views on the preferred formation given the squad so far. 3-5-2 maybe give that we've 4 out-and-out defenders (hopefully Kerr will be allowed to play there) plus McCann, McDonald, Thomson and Reilly offering different options for the wide berth. I hope we've still to get some talent in the midfield as that area looks incomplete Formations are not important. Results are priority. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Passionate Posted July 24, 2020 Share Posted July 24, 2020 31 minutes ago, Rio 2 said: Formations are not important. Results are priority. Recruitment was crucial, SM stated that all players signed must be able to play consistently top end of the league.. To be honest the jury's out on all signings so far they are completely unproven at this level, Midfield is a major concern, if the plan is to play Kerr there, why.... He played there a couple of games and struggled with the basics of that position and was replaced by Wedderburn, Kerr is a good improving centre half, that's where he should play..... Rumours of a couple of West Ham youth players coming up will they have enough quality and gamecraft to drag us out this league.... Falkirk and Partick are beginning to show there hand now 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aufc Posted July 25, 2020 Share Posted July 25, 2020 Id honestly watch a bunch of young lads trying to play quick attacking football rather than sign some league one jobber purely because it means we are more “experienced0 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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