Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Jacksgranda]

5 hours ago, tamthebam said:

Friends in North Macedonia are also saying "what a country". The Prime Minister, Deputy Prime Minister, Health Minister and Education Minister are having to self isolate after attending a meeting with the Mayor of Kumanovo who has tested positive for Covid-19.

It's also the Orthodox Easter and the PM has apparently said he can't stop people going to church (although Orthodox countries like Greece and Russia seem to have managed it). The faithful go in for all that icon kissing stuff which isn't the best idea at present.. still maybe the disease only affects the godless and Protestants 

If we catch it it won't be from kissing icons, that's for sure...

[PauloPerth]

That's China stuck on an extra 1290 deaths onto their total which were not previously reported.

Seem to recall a few hundred pages back folk being fairly vehement in defending the figures from China when some were suggesting they weren't accurate.

When you look at how hopeless we've been in Scotland and the UK in reporting and tallying deaths, you worry for what's really happening in some very poor countries where monitoring and reporting will likely be far less accurate. We already know that the virus has been detected and caused deaths in many African countries, and in India, Indonesia, the Phillipines, South America..  the actual numbers could be several times higher than what is believed.

It'll probably be years before true figures emerge.

[ayrmad]

15 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

That's China stuck on an extra 1290 deaths onto their total which were not previously reported.

Seem to recall a few hundred pages back folk being fairly vehement in defending the figures from China when some were suggesting they weren't accurate.

When you look at how hopeless we've been in Scotland and the UK in reporting and tallying deaths, you worry for what's really happening in some very poor countries where monitoring and reporting will likely be far less accurate. We already know that the virus has been detected and caused deaths in many African countries, and in India, Indonesia, the Phillipines, South America..  the actual numbers could be several times higher than what is believed.

It'll probably be years before true figures emerge.

Can't say I've noticed a huge under reporting up here, the numbers certainly don't stack up down south but you've not been listening to the Scottish briefing properly if you think we're being played big style up here. 

[sparky88]

13 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

That's China stuck on an extra 1290 deaths onto their total which were not previously reported.

Seem to recall a few hundred pages back folk being fairly vehement in defending the figures from China when some were suggesting they weren't accurate.

When you look at how hopeless we've been in Scotland and the UK in reporting and tallying deaths, you worry for what's really happening in some very poor countries where monitoring and reporting will likely be far less accurate. We already know that the virus has been detected and caused deaths in many African countries, and in India, Indonesia, the Phillipines, South America..  the actual numbers could be several times higher than what is believed.

It'll probably be years before true figures emerge.

I'm not sure it's a case of Scotland and UK being hopeless at recording deaths.

A death in a hospital will be recorded straight away. A death elsewhere will rely on someone registering it. That lag will exist in whatever country's death figures you look at. 

As with nearly every statistic the media get hold of, the problem is their interpretation of what they are seeing.  

[Hillonearth]

14 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

That's China stuck on an extra 1290 deaths onto their total which were not previously reported.

Seem to recall a few hundred pages back folk being fairly vehement in defending the figures from China when some were suggesting they weren't accurate.

When you look at how hopeless we've been in Scotland and the UK in reporting and tallying deaths, you worry for what's really happening in some very poor countries where monitoring and reporting will likely be far less accurate. We already know that the virus has been detected and caused deaths in many African countries, and in India, Indonesia, the Phillipines, South America..  the actual numbers could be several times higher than what is believed.

It'll probably be years before true figures emerge.

Not to exculpate Western governments - especially ours and that of the US - but had China been that bit more transparent initially about their true casualty figures and the actual level of transmission of the virus a lot of lives might have been saved worldwide...it took it hitting an open transparent society like Italy before there was any sense of just how bad things could get.

Even worse, what's emanated from China in the last month or so has been frankly unbelievable...it seems to be a characteristic that they're so used to being believed at home that they either are under the impression they'll get the same level of credence abroad or simply don't care if they do or not.

So we've had claims of new infections/deaths down to zero countrywide, then the only new cases being pesky foreigners who probably started it anyway, and meanwhile in Wuhan they're ordering thousands upon thousands of funeral urns for absolutely no reason. No reason at all.

Stop fucking eating bats.

[hk blues]

18 hours ago, Todd_is_God said:

Japan is an interesting contrast to Spain / Italy.

It locked down very early and had very low cases / deaths per day for a prolongued period as a result. It could be that by limiting initial exposure, and then not completely eradicating the virus, their strategy merely delayed the inevitable rather than prevented it, as would be asymptomatic carriers were not exposed to the virus until much later.

Spain, on the other hand, clearly did not limit exposure early on, and therefore should, in theory, have a much higher percentage of the population already exposed and immune to the virus, which will limit its future ability to spread.

That, of course, assumes that people are indeed immune to the virus after initial infection, at least for some period.

Japan hasn't locked down yet, not in the sense we know lockdowns.  And even that dilluted lockdown came only on 9 April.

[bendan]

50 minutes ago, PauloPerth said:

That's China stuck on an extra 1290 deaths onto their total which were not previously reported.

Seem to recall a few hundred pages back folk being fairly vehement in defending the figures from China when some were suggesting they weren't accurate.

When you look at how hopeless we've been in Scotland and the UK in reporting and tallying deaths, you worry for what's really happening in some very poor countries where monitoring and reporting will likely be far less accurate. We already know that the virus has been detected and caused deaths in many African countries, and in India, Indonesia, the Phillipines, South America..  the actual numbers could be several times higher than what is believed.

It'll probably be years before true figures emerge.

I've been on this thread since early on, and I don't remember anyone trying to say the Chinese figures were accurate. The consensus was that they were bollocks and shouldn't be used for any anlaysis of what would happen elsewhere. The discussion there has been on here is whether this was deliberate, or  due to the difficulty of getting accurate figures. Even now, with far better testing available than China had back then, we have absolutely no clue how many people have been infected, and we've only a vague idea of how many died. 

[Jacksgranda]

4 minutes ago, bendan said:

I've been on this thread since early on, and I don't remember anyone trying to say the Chinese figures were accurate. The consensus was that they were bollocks and shouldn't be used for any anlaysis of what would happen elsewhere. The discussion there has been on here is whether this was deliberate, or  due to the difficulty of getting accurate figures. Even now, with far better testing available than China had back then, we have absolutely no clue how many people have been infected, and we've only a vague idea of how many died. 

A bit like here, then.

[bendan]

2 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

A bit like here, then.

I'm in Scotland. When I said 'we' I was meaning Scotland/UK/Europe, so that was actually my point. 

[Jacksgranda]

2 minutes ago, bendan said:

I'm in Scotland. When I said 'we' I was meaning Scotland/UK/Europe, so that was actually my point. 

I thought you were talking about China, that's how it reads to me, but I agree, we (UK) haven't a notion how many have been infected, and our deaths are certainly undermeasured.

Edited April 17, 2020 by Jacksgranda

[jagfox]

Woman who I knew from walking the dog passed away. She must have been on a ventilator for 2-3 weeks. Had emphysema apparently  but only in her late forties. 

[bendan]

6 minutes ago, Jacksgranda said:

I thought you were talking about China, that's how it reads to me, but I agree, we (UK) haven't a notion how many have been infected, and our deaths are certainly undermeasured.

Yes, it wasn't very clear, but I completely agree with you.

[Guest]

9 hours ago, Gaz said:

Because the Brexit-voting farmers are finding out that Good Old Honest Brits don't want to do shite work for shite pay.

The real reason is that the owners make more profit due to the Romanians being fully trained and efficient at the job. They are also accepting of the said poor wages and conditions so yet another win for the owners.

[ayrmad]

1 minute ago, jagfox99 said:

Woman who I knew from walking the dog passed away. She must have been on a ventilator for 2-3 weeks. Had emphysema apparently  but only in her late forties. 

I've been told that the QE in Glasgow is full of middle aged men struggling, not exactly the auld yins and folk at deaths door already. 

[dirty dingus]

[Marshmallo]

This is the new "poppy day".

[Tight minge]

Not to exculpate Western governments - especially ours and that of the US - but had China been that bit more transparent initially about their true casualty figures and the actual level of transmission of the virus a lot of lives might have been saved worldwide...it took it hitting an open transparent society like Italy before there was any sense of just how bad things could get.
Even worse, what's emanated from China in the last month or so has been frankly unbelievable...it seems to be a characteristic that they're so used to being believed at home that they either are under the impression they'll get the same level of credence abroad or simply don't care if they do or not.
So we've had claims of new infections/deaths down to zero countrywide, then the only new cases being pesky foreigners who probably started it anyway, and meanwhile in Wuhan they're ordering thousands upon thousands of funeral urns for absolutely no reason. No reason at all.
Stop fucking eating bats.

Don’t think it can excuse any western government in any way. There was plenty of data outside China that suggested this was a highly contagious virus long before it got to Italy. If anything, it was ‘out of sight, out of mind’ until it hit Italy. It was also only known that this could be a serious issue from the 2nd January (iirc), which was wholly ignored by nearly everyone.

The rest, its no surprise; its China. Absolutely none of that should be a surprise. Mianzi and the government there ensures the mess.

Long and short. Chinas’ government and politicians are just the start of a long chain of governments and politicians that have made a mess of this.

This will take decades before it can really be picked through.

Although I am sure that this will come back to haunt China in the coming years, time will tell.

[bendan]

9 minutes ago, ayrmad said:

I've been told that the QE in Glasgow is full of middle aged men struggling, not exactly the auld yins and folk at deaths door already. 

We've heard anecdotes like this from all over - Italy, London, Madrid and Scotland, and yet whenever official stats are released, the deaths are overwhelmingly of people who are over 65 and/or sick.

The Scottish stats show just over 10% of deaths being in the under 65s, and AFAIK most of them are said to have had underlying health issues. I suppose one possibility is that the wards 'full of middle aged men' see most of them recover, whereas the elderly might not.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52214177

 

[jagfox]

2 minutes ago, Marshmallo said:

This is the new "poppy day".

A-popp-calypse Now

[Hillonearth]

3 minutes ago, bendan said:

We've heard anecdotes like this from all over - Italy, London, Madrid and Scotland, and yet whenever official stats are released, the deaths are overwhelmingly of people who are over 65 and/or sick.

The Scottish stats show just over 10% of deaths being in the under 65s, and AFAIK most of them are said to have had underlying health issues. I suppose one possibility is that the wards 'full of middle aged men' see most of them recover, whereas the elderly might not.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-52214177

 

We're Scottish.

Middle-aged IS old for many of us.