Coronavirus (COVID-19)

[Left Back]

10 minutes ago, Ron Aldo said:

Opening places of worship before everything else is a great idea.

If your business is failing or you've lost your job or your mental health is in tatters, you can just go and say a wee prayer and everything will be all right.

^^^ Devi Sridhar found.

[Jambomo]

10 minutes ago, virginton said:

If knowing something 'for sure' was the benchmark to take action then there'd be next to no pre-emptive decisions made at all. Only Covid psychosis has produced this desire for 100% certainty at all times. 

It’s not a need to be 100% sure, but it’s still far too early to have enough data to be at a point we can be sure enough. It’s not even been a month since we started vaccinations. 

Regardless of what you think, there is a scientific process to follow and they will be following it.

Edited February 10, 2021 by Jambomo

[Gordon EF]

2 minutes ago, Left Back said:

Nothing to do with rationality.  Facts are objective.  they state definites that can be proven.  A truth is what someone believes to be true and is therefore subjective.  If you believe something to be true then it becomes your truth.   Conversely one person can interpret one set of facts one way and another can interpret them another.  It doesn't mean either interpretation is the truth

The subtleties between facts and truth is argued in a court of law on a daily basis by rational people.

If you change the definition of truth, then yeah.

[Wee Bully]

The real distinction is between people who want (insert whatever thing they want most) to be opened up first, regardless of the consequences and the adults who recognise it's best to have a logical set of priorities even if that means they have to wait longer for the things they want most.
It's similar to the tedious "I'm a {profession A} and I think {profession A} should be given priority for the vaccine" you hear over, and over, and over again every time idiot members of the public are allowed on to TV.

I know. Cards on the table time - I’m religious, but I absolutely think that opening the Churches up should be pretty far down the priority list / one of the last hinge to happen.

Being Church of Scotland, services are online and I don’t feel a lot of difference other than social interaction. Also, given the normal age demographic, it is as high risk as you can get.

I’d go so far as to say I hope Elixir gets to Poland before I get to church (provided that is months after I can get to the football or the pub).

[Ron Aldo]

^^^ Devi Sridhar found.

You know how it is. We just have to make our own sunshine.

[Burnieman]

12 minutes ago, Wee Bully said:

Burnieman - he wants GP’s to work 7 days a week without break,

Where did I say that? don't be a dick.

[Monkey Tennis]

41 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

Pretty much all wars are fought due to some religious wanks intolerance

That's absolute nonsense, even before we consider the punctuation.

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, Gordon EF said:

The real distinction is between people who want (insert whatever thing they want most) to be opened up first, regardless of the consequences and the adults who recognise it's best to have a logical set of priorities even if that means they have to wait longer for the things they want most.

It's similar to the tedious "I'm a {profession A} and I think {profession A} should be given priority for the vaccine" you hear over, and over, and over again every time idiot members of the public are allowed on to TV.

These are all subjective though and of course there's arguments within arguments to be had (or should that be debates) ?

Take the holiday's as an example, so Yes, it may be prudent to stop foreign travel for the time being, however if the English are allowing this and the Scotland / England border remains open, then this is not only crazy, it's also completely pointless.

We could also quite conceivably have a situation like last year where it was fine to go to a disease ridden Bournemouth Beach and mix with lots of folk with little to no restrictions, however it wasn't permitted to go to various overseas destinations who had less disease than ourselves and were actively promoting / adhering to social distancing / mask wearing and indeed testing.

The bottom line is that if something doesn't make any sense, then it's very difficult to justify it to an already angry and disillusioned population.....

[Gordon EF]

6 minutes ago, Wee Bully said:

I know. Cards on the table time - I’m religious, but I absolutely think that opening the Churches up should be pretty far down the priority list / one of the last hinge to happen.

Being Church of Scotland, services are online and I don’t feel a lot of difference other than social interaction. Also, given the normal age demographic, it is as high risk as you can get.

I’d go so far as to say I hope Elixir gets to Poland before I get to church (provided that is months after I can get to the football or the pub).

Yeah, in terms of the risks presented and the impact of not having them football and churches should be at the same time. Of course I'd selfishly love to get back to going to the football but that absolutely can't be put ahead of folks livelihoods if things have to be opened up in stages.

[superbigal]

23 hours ago, superbigal said:

 

Todays summary   Dundee becomes the 3rd of our 4 major cities to drop below the 100 cases per 100K marker. Glasgow earmarked for the year 2023 to hit these levels.  In fact Aberdeen, Edinburgh & Dundee combined have only 624 cases which is bang on 10% of Scotland's total of 6,213.

Daily infections have now dropped for 34 days in a row since the peak on 4th January. The total drop being 62.33%. Total cases are 6,213 and the positive test rate is now at 5.7%.  The daily drop has slowed to around 2% from over 3.5%. I suspect this will continue. The same seems to have happened in wales who are close to our levels.  Whereas it is falling quicker from higher levels in England. I suspect this "slowing" down will be all the ammo Scotgov needs to kick more cans down the road again on Tuesday.

Home nations first: England  222.7 to 212.6 4.53% daily drop.  Wales 123.3 to 121.2 1.70% daily drop. Northern Ireland  177.3 to 170.5 3.84% daily drop.

Bit of a change in Europe among the major nations. Top hitters now Czech rep 470,   the Portugal 437 Which is dropping quickly, Spain 422, then a big drop to France 208, Sweden 204.   The UK overall now below 200.

Scotland peaked at 301.9 for figures 29th Dec to 4th Jan    

Yesterdays figure 31st Jan to 6th Feb Jan was 115.9

Todays figure for 1st Feb to 7th Feb is 113.7   A  drop of 1.90% on the day. Infections have dropped every day (now 34 days in a row) since the aforementioned peak.  Total drop is now 62.34%

Council progress in last 24 hours as follows.

Click cases by neighbourhood to see the spread on the geographical map. 

https://public.tableau.com/profile/phs.covid.19#!/vizhome/COVID-19DailyDashboard_15960160643010/Overview

Falkirk   229.3 to 230.6   7.9% Positivity.

Clackmannanshire 223.1 to  219.2   7.0% Positivity

North Lanarkshire  186.0 to 181.0   Continues to leave Falkirk and Clacks behind in it's wake

West Dunbartonshire   165.3 to 168.7 

Glasgow City 168.8 to 164.9  

Renfrewshire 163.0 to 155.2

East Ayrshire 154.1 to 151.6   

Stirling  155.0 to 150.7

South Lanarkshire  151.0 to 148.5  

East Renfrewshire  139.2 to 137.1  

North Ayrshire 129.9 to 126.2

East Dunbartonshire  128.9 to 126.1

Angus 118.8 to 124.8

West Lothian   112.0 to 113.1

Western Isles    112.3 to 112.3

South Ayrshire 110.1 to 109.2

Inverclyde 106.7 to 105.4

Argyll & Bute  103.6 to 104.8

Midlothian 89.8 to 100.6   Unsatisfactory return to Plus 100 club courtesy of Penicuik.     

Dundee City 116.5 to 99.1   The mover and shaker of the day down near 15% and below the 100 barrier

East Lothian 98.9 to 97.1 

Moray 84.5 to 81.4  

Dumfries & Galloway 84.0 to 81.3  

City Of Edinburgh  68.6 to 67.1 Only 352 cases

Perth & Kinross    67.1 to 65.2

Highlands 61.9 to 64.0      

Fife   64.4 to 60.5  Great daily drop at this low rate of over 6%

Aberdeenshire 54.7 to 56.3

Aberdeen City 57.3 to 54.2  Only 124 Cases and great daily drop well over 5%

Scottish  Borders  55.4 to 50.2  

Shetland Islands  4.4 to 8.7   Dam Dave the crofter infected his Wife

Orkney Island  4.5 to 4.5

 

Edited February 10, 2021 by superbigal

[Gordon EF]

5 minutes ago, WATTOO said:

These are all subjective though and of course there's arguments within arguments to be had (or should that be debates) ?

Take the holiday's as an example, so Yes, it may be prudent to stop foreign travel for the time being, however if the English are allowing this and the Scotland / England border remains open, then this is not only crazy, it's also completely pointless.

We could also quite conceivably have a situation like last year where it was fine to go to a disease ridden Bournemouth Beach and mix with lots of folk with little to no restrictions, however it wasn't permitted to go to various overseas destinations who had less disease than ourselves and were actively promoting / adhering to social distancing / mask wearing and indeed testing.

The bottom line is that if something doesn't make any sense, then it's very difficult to justify it to an already angry and disillusioned population.....

I agree with you 100%. The exact timings and orderings of things are very difficult decisions when you get down to that level of detail.

[Burnieman]

1 minute ago, superbigal said:

Todays summary   Dundee becomes the 3rd of our 4 major cities to drop below the 100 cases per 100K marker. Glasgow earmarked for 2023  when it gets back to Level 4.  In fact Aberdeen, edinburgh & Dundee combined have only 624 cases which is bang on 10% of Scotland's total of 6,213.

Daily infections have now dropped for 34 days in a row since the peak on 4th January. The total drop being 62.33%. Total cases are 6,213 and the positive test rate is now at 5.7%.  The daily drop has slowed to around 2% from over 3.5%. I suspect this will continue. The same seems to have happened in wales who are close to our levels.  Whereas it is falling quicker from higher levels in England. I suspect this "slowing" down will be all the ammo Scotgov needs to kick more cans down the road again on Tuesday.

Home nations first: England  222.7 to 212.6 4.53% daily drop.  Wales 123.3 to 121.2 1.70% daily drop. Northern Ireland  177.3 to 170.5 3.84% daily drop.

Bit of a change in Europe among the major nations. Top hitters now Czech rep 470,   the Portugal 437 Which is dropping quickly, Spain 422, then a big drop to France 208, Sweden 204.   The UK overall now below 200.

Scotland peaked at 301.9 for figures 29th Dec to 4th Jan    

Yesterdays figure 31st Jan to 6th Feb Jan was 115.9

Todays figure for 1st Feb to 7th Feb is 113.7   A  drop of 1.90% on the day. Infections have dropped every day (now 34 days in a row) since the aforementioned peak.  Total drop is now 62.34%

Council progress in last 24 hours as follows.

Click cases by neighbourhood to see the spread on the geographical map. 

https://public.tableau.com/profile/phs.covid.19#!/vizhome/COVID-19DailyDashboard_15960160643010/Overview

Falkirk   229.3 to 230.6   7.9% Positivity.

Clackmannanshire 223.1 to  219.2   7.0% Positivity

North Lanarkshire  186.0 to 181.0   Continues to leave Falkirk and Clacks behind in it's wake

West Dunbartonshire   165.3 to 168.7 

Glasgow City 168.8 to 164.9  

Renfrewshire 163.0 to 155.2

East Ayrshire 154.1 to 151.6   

Stirling  155.0 to 150.7

South Lanarkshire  151.0 to 148.5  

East Renfrewshire  139.2 to 137.1  

North Ayrshire 129.9 to 126.2

East Dunbartonshire  128.9 to 126.1

Angus 118.8 to 124.8

West Lothian   112.0 to 113.1

Western Isles    112.3 to 112.3

South Ayrshire 110.1 to 109.2

Inverclyde 106.7 to 105.4

Argyll & Bute  103.6 to 104.8

Midlothian 89.8 to 100.6   Unsatisfactory return to Plus 100 club courtesy of Penicuik.     

Dundee City 116.5 to 99.1   The mover and shaker of the day down near 15% and below the 100 barrier

 

East Lothian 98.9 to 97.1 

Moray 84.5 to 81.4  

Dumfries & Galloway 84.0 to 81.3  

City Of Edinburgh  68.6 to 67.1 Only 352 cases

Perth & Kinross    67.1 to 65.2

Highlands 61.9 to 64.0      

Fife   64.4 to 60.5  Great daily drop at this low rate of over 6%

Aberdeenshire 54.7 to 56.3

Aberdeen City 57.3 to 54.2  Only 124 Cases and great daily drop well over 5%

Scottish  Borders  55.4 to 50.2  

Shetland Islands  4.4 to 8.7   Dam Dave the crofter infected his Wife

Orkney Island  4.5 to 4.5

 

We've not made much progress in February at all as far as new infections are concerned, and our 7 day rate is stuck between 110/120 per 100k

[Elixir]

22 minutes ago, Wee Bully said:

What’s really interesting through this entire debate is the way “the most important thing to open up” is the one we are most interested in ourselves, if it needs to be phased.

Me - I want the pubs open. If that means Elixiar can’t fly, so be it.
Elixir - He wants to fly, as without it, he won’t get his hole. If that means Leitch can’t go to church, so be it
Burnieman - he wants GP’s to work 7 days a week without break, because “there’s a pandemic on. I have no idea what that means other than negative results, but so be it.

Sadly caused by the lack of a roadmap.

I suspect we will see one pretty soon, if numbers drop the way they are. The reason we don’t have one yet isn’t that it doesn’t exist, but because they want to get numbers as low as possible before we all relax and open up. If they say that in March, things will open up, then people start now.

Living rent free in your cardboard box I see. 

[The Moonster]

Just now, Monkey Tennis said:

That's absolute nonsense, even before we consider the punctuation.

When I typed that comment I thought "some pedantic arsehole is going to take that comment literally and ignore the overall point I'm making". I reckon if I had three guesses at who that would've been I'd have said you, you or you. 

 

 

[Monkey Tennis]

1 minute ago, The Moonster said:

When I typed that comment I thought "some pedantic arsehole is going to take that comment literally and ignore the overall point I'm making". I reckon if I had three guesses at who that would've been I'd have said you, you or you. 

 

 

The overall point you were making was based on an utterly spurious assertion.

Nice abuse when called out on it though.

[Inanimate Carbon Rod]

2 hours ago, Michael W said:

Not really sure why it's such a surprise people might like to leave the UK (namely Scotland for most on this forum) for a holiday. For starters, the weather is not renowned here and is it really shocking people want escapism when they've been shut inside their own homes through winter? Of course it isn't - it's been an utterly miserable experience. 

If we're not allowed that, nothing short of what we used to call normal here is acceptable. Last year's dumbed-down experience won't cut the mustard, particularly now that we actually have a bloody vaccine. It is ridiculous the amount of backsliding we've had to listen to recently of "greater normality" given we are actually now in a better position to exit this nightmare than we were last April. You wouldn't think this was the case listening to the likes of Leitch. 

I accept cases, hospitalisations and deaths are still high and so we're not just going to open tomorrow, but continuous improvement is being seen and the vaccination programme is moving forward well. Now would be a great time for that adult conversation we were promised last year - if you won't let us travel, then what can we do domestically? 

For me and the mrs working in the public sector find it quite hard to get a break holidaying in Scotland, its kinda the only thing we’re hoping for because of the stress etc. But that said ive never seen anyone calling for international travel to be brought back in the next couple of months, everyone knows its a wee while away but to suggest the entire year despite effective vaccines, airport testing and developing treatments including whats being touted as an absolute cure treatment then I genuinely cannot see why it can’t open up in the middle distant future??

2 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

https://news.stv.tv/scotland/scotland-set-for-return-to-levels-system-as-lockdown-eases?top

Leitch saying a few things of note here:

- Likely to go back to tiers as we begin to roll back restrictions

- 100 cases per 100k nationally is "too high" to begin looking at opening anything up

- Schools the priority along with "places of worship" where we will take a national approach

Places of worship opening up before the likes of gyms and small businesses is an absolute disgrace and would absolutely result in me not  voting snp in may. 

2 hours ago, G51 said:

It's not Leitch's decision, it's the Scottish Governments.

Religion is clearly more important than non-essential businesses. Religion dictates how a lot of people live their lives. Just because those of us who aren't religious do not necessarily appreciate that doesn't make it less important.

Religion has imo done more harm to the world than good. Even through the pandemic in certain places religious belief has been one of the main drivers in bringing down trust in vaccines and treatment etc. Arguably mainstream abrahamic religions havent here but its a factor in many places.  

[The Moonster]

1 minute ago, Monkey Tennis said:

The overall point you were making was based on an utterly spurious assertion.

Nice abuse when called out on it though.

Was there any need for the punctuation jibe? Nah, you were being a cock. So stick the victim complex up your farter.

[Monkey Tennis]

1 minute ago, The Moonster said:

Was there any need for the punctuation jibe? Nah, you were being a cock. So stick the victim complex up your farter.

Good Lord.

Do settle down you shouty little twerp.

[NotThePars]

3 hours ago, Marshmallo said:

"haha rent free seethe into my veins" from old lads on here because people are frustrated at their lives being impacted by restrictions is one of the worst bits yet on This Thread.

Auld lads that treat political parties like a fitba team which makes sense on this forum I suppose

9 minutes ago, The Moonster said:

When I typed that comment I thought "some pedantic arsehole is going to take that comment literally and ignore the overall point I'm making". I reckon if I had three guesses at who that would've been I'd have said you, you or you. 

 

 

He's right tho

[superbigal]

Leitch knows getting below 100 cases per 100k nationally is now becoming more difficult. In particular areas I suspect nigh on impossible. We can debate all day why numbers on the West Coast generally are twice as high as the East Coast.
Is it fair to the East to keep them in lockdown ?
Flip side if the East return to levels. Is that fair to the West if the reason they are much higher is in no way down to bad behaviour ?