Aberdeen vs rangers

[54_and_counting]

2 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

Not if you're a Rangers defender.

It seems a Rangers player hasn't tugged a shirt in the box since at least October last year.

So both clubs have given away a penalty each this season by tugging a shirt in the box

Unless ive missed aberdeen losing more than one penalty for the same incident 

[gannonball]

4 minutes ago, Hoose Rice said:

To be fair it was a penalty.

Yeah I think the argument Robson was trying to put across was that there was a block going on as well but not sure which one takes precedent myself. Shit like this constantly happens though in football when it really should more given how cynical it is. That isn't unique to Scottish football though but tbh I struggle to sympathise if someone as pulled a shirt as  they know what they are doing. IFAB should really be putting out new guidelines ASAP for VAR.

[stressball]

Aberdeen vs Rangers and sortmeout wants to make it about Celtic fans…

And himself. 

[54_and_counting]

Just now, Dons_1988 said:

There’s just no way of having a serious conversation about this on the internet. 

Anything I say on the matter will be dismissed as sour grapes, and rangers fans will comfort themselves that there was a shirt pull and therefore what’s the problem. 

I don’t believe that referees are acting in a partisan fashion or without integrity, but I do feel that the environment of Scottish football influences the way decisions are made. The statistics back it up. They are truly insane when it comes to rangers and penalties. 

If everything wasn’t so tribal then it might facilitate a serious discussion but it won’t happen. 

Just out of curiosity, why mention Rangers and penalties 

Rangers hsve had 4 more penalties than motherwell, now apart from the OF game id have a guess that Rangers have dominated posession and attacking play in every other game this season, motherwell id say haven't 

Yet they along with St Mirren have had 3 penalties 

[54_and_counting]

Just now, gannonball said:

Yeah I think the argument Robson was trying to put across was that there was a block going on as well but not sure which one takes precedent myself. Shit like this constantly happens though in football when it really should more given how cynical it is. That isn't unique to Scottish football though but tbh I struggle to sympathise if someone as pulled a shirt as  they know what they are doing. IFAB should really be putting out new guidelines ASAP for VAR.

If the shirt pull proceeds the block (it looked so) then the first foul is the shirt pull, same as in the hearts game 

Also define the difference between a "block" and an accidental collision in a box full of players, 

Unless the player doing the blocking looks right at the defender and moves in his way, it would be extremely difficult for a ref to say 'he meant to walk in front of him" when it could simply be the player was moving into a different position

We all know the blocks are likely worked on in training, but they are done well enough to not make them look meant

[gannonball]

2 minutes ago, stressball said:

Aberdeen vs Rangers and sortmeout wants to make it about Celtic fans…

And himself. 

Using the morally bankrupt Celtic board to back his judgement was a personal favourite of mine tbh.

[VincentGuerin]

9 minutes ago, Dons_1988 said:

There’s just no way of having a serious conversation about this on the internet. 

Anything I say on the matter will be dismissed as sour grapes, and rangers fans will comfort themselves that there was a shirt pull and therefore what’s the problem. 

I don’t believe that referees are acting in a partisan fashion or without integrity, but I do feel that the environment of Scottish football influences the way decisions are made. The statistics back it up. They are truly insane when it comes to rangers and penalties. 

If everything wasn’t so tribal then it might facilitate a serious discussion but it won’t happen. 

I honestly think it can be over-analysed.

It's basically as simple as we joke about. I reckon plenty of them are just masons.

People like to think that kind of thing is on the decline, but, without going all tinfoil-hat, I think a lot of the notion that that kind of thing has left fitba these days is put about by people who would like us all to think that kind of thing has left fitba these days.

It's hard to find another credible explanation for why Rangers are treated so well by referees. In a way that is hard to find other examples of around the world.

Edited November 26, 2023 by VincentGuerin

[54_and_counting]

Just now, VincentGuerin said:

I honestly think it can be over-analysed.

It's basically as simple as we joke about. I reckon plenty of them are just masons.

People like to think that kind of thing is on the decline, but, without going all tin-hat, I think a lot of the notion that that kind of thing has left fitba these days is put about by people who would like us all to think that kind of thing has left fitba these days.

It's hard to find another credible explanation for why Rangers are treated so well by referees. In a way that is hard to find other examples of around the world.

Btw celtic have had more penalties than rangers and rangers had a goal chopped off at 0-0 in the OF game

Thats some way of treating us well

[VincentGuerin]

4 minutes ago, 54_and_counting said:

Just out of curiosity, why mention Rangers and penalties 

Rangers hsve had 4 more penalties than motherwell, now apart from the OF game id have a guess that Rangers have dominated posession and attacking play in every other game this season, motherwell id say haven't 

Yet they along with St Mirren have had 3 penalties 

It's not about pure numbers. It's about when Rangers get penalties and what they get them for.

Twice recently we've seen them get penalties for rarely-penalised offences when a goal down with a minute to go.

Rangers win a lot of games comfortably. Your most biased 100% Rangers Man ref would have no reason to drum up penalties when 4-0 up at home to Livi. But when Rangers need a bit of help, they get it.

And the penalties against stats are remarkable.

[gannonball]

Just now, 54_and_counting said:

If the shirt pull proceeds the block (it looked so) then the first foul is the shirt pull, same as in the hearts game 

Also define the difference between a "block" and an accidental collision in a box full of players, 

Unless the player doing the blocking looks right at the defender and moves in his way, it would be extremely difficult for a ref to say 'he meant to walk in front of him" when it could simply be the player was moving into a different position

We all know the blocks are likely worked on in training, but they are done well enough to not make them look meant

Yeah I do agree blocks are very subjective where as shirt pulls generally aren't. With VAR now I have no idea why anyone pulls a shirt even though I believe it still doesn't get punished enough it's just a stupid risk especially when statistically corners are rarely scored from these days.

[Dons_1988]

1 minute ago, VincentGuerin said:

I honestly think it can be over-analysed.

It's basically as simple as we joke about. I reckon plenty of them are just masons.

People like to think that kind of thing is on the decline, but, without going all tin-hat, I think a lot of the notion that that kind of thing has left fitba these days is put about by people who would like us all to think that kind of thing has left fitba these days.

It's hard to find another credible explanation for why Rangers are treated so well by referees. In a way that is hard to find other examples of around the world.

Nah I don’t believe it’s conscious decision making, that might be naive but I just don’t think that happens. 

But OF culture is so embedded in Scottish football I think the subconscious decision making is heavily influenced. I think OF fans find it difficult to see because they just see it as normal. It’s why you end up battering your head against a wall when 50/50 splits in cup finals come up etc 

[Dons_1988]

1 minute ago, 54_and_counting said:

Btw celtic have had more penalties than rangers and rangers had a goal chopped off at 0-0 in the OF game

Thats some way of treating us well

But but but Celtic! 

[54_and_counting]

Just now, gannonball said:

Yeah I do agree blocks are very subjective where as shirt pulls generally aren't. With VAR now I have no idea why anyone pulls a shirt even though I believe it still doesn't get punished enough it's just a stupid risk especially when statistically corners are rarely scored from these days.

For decades now fans have moaned about defenders getting away with murder at corners, now VAR  changes that fans arent happy lol

[54_and_counting]

Just now, Dons_1988 said:

But but but Celtic! 

No buts about it, everyonr goes on about what Rangers get ehile avoiding a team that gets similar

Fine if we believe both the OF get away with shit, but to say we are treated well without acknowledging the other team treated well smacks of bias

[VincentGuerin]

Just now, Dons_1988 said:

Nah I don’t believe it’s conscious decision making, that might be naive but I just don’t think that happens. 

But OF culture is so embedded in Scottish football I think the subconscious decision making is heavily influenced. I think OF fans find it difficult to see because they just see it as normal. It’s why you end up battering your head against a wall when 50/50 splits in cup finals come up etc 

I think you have to look at it from a broad view.

Is there a reasonable chance that sub-conscious work like that could lead to a team playing under VAR for over a year or league games and not giving away a single penalty? I don't really think so.

You're looking for an explanation for why Rangers get things other teams don't get, especially when in a tight spot, and why they are seemingly impossible to award a penalty against. I think over-complicating it is needless. They get treated better because the folk making the calls want them to win. I don't see a more reasonable explanation for what we see week after week, year after year.

[54_and_counting]

3 minutes ago, VincentGuerin said:

It's not about pure numbers. It's about when Rangers get penalties and what they get them for.

Twice recently we've seen them get penalties for rarely-penalised offences when a goal down with a minute to go.

Rangers win a lot of games comfortably. Your most biased 100% Rangers Man ref would have no reason to drum up penalties when 4-0 up at home to Livi. But when Rangers need a bit of help, they get it.

And the penalties against stats are remarkable.

So when aberdeen beat rangers at ibrox and we had a man sent off

Or when Killie beat us on opening day

Or when celtic beat us at ibrox

Tell me about all the helping hands we got in they games

Maybe, just maybe, fans should look at the 2 helping hand penalties we got and blame the defender for blatantly pulling a shirt in injury time of a game they are winning

Genuine question for you, was goldson scoring today if his shirt wasn't held? 

[fasda2]

1 minute ago, 54_and_counting said:

No buts about it, everyonr goes on about what Rangers get ehile avoiding a team that gets similar

Fine if we believe both the OF get away with shit, but to say we are treated well without acknowledging the other team treated well smacks of bias

Tell me you don't know what "two cheeks of the same arse" means without telling me you don"t know what "two cheeks of the same arse" means

[VincentGuerin]

1 minute ago, 54_and_counting said:

No buts about it, everyonr goes on about what Rangers get ehile avoiding a team that gets similar

Fine if we believe both the OF get away with shit, but to say we are treated well without acknowledging the other team treated well smacks of bias

It doesn't smack of bias. You just think bias is not accepting that with the OF you have to be even-handed.

There'll be different views and the Scottish fitba community is a broad and ununified church, but I think you'll find most people agree Rangers ultimately get the best of it from refs. Even compared to Celtic.

[54_and_counting]

Just now, fasda2 said:

Tell me you don't know what "two cheeks of the same arse" means without telling me you don"t know what "two cheeks of the same arse" means

And tell me when in the posts i quoted "two cheeks of the same arse" was mentioned 

[54_and_counting]

Just now, VincentGuerin said:

It doesn't smack of bias. You just think bias is not accepting that with the OF you have to be even-handed.

There'll be different views and the Scottish fitba community is a broad and ununified church, but I think you'll find most people agree Rangers ultimately get the best of it from refs. Even compared to Celtic.

So if we get the best of it from refs, why have we had less penalties and had a goal chopped off at home to them in the last OF game that likely cost us a point at worst (it was the correct decision btw)