RobM

There's nothing to be afraid of but it doesn't really offer anything particularly exciting or Junior clubs would be all over it. There is the big question you have to ask. Why is that? Arniston have had many problems of late, not related to the set-up they play in. Glenrothes manage fine in the Junior leagues with what they pull in financially, they wouldn't pull in any more for a game against Edusport, Hawick, Whitehill, Selkirk, I could name more. I've been to EoS games where it's basically a public park, there isn't a gate to pay at.

To go back to the original question junior football would in all likelihood still thrive in its current form even if it lost a few more clubs like Kelty.

They would be, 'Junior clubs would be leaving what is largely a healthy set-up, one that isn't broken. Hawick v Stirling Uni it was, the LL is currently a home to them as the senior set-up also is to Edusport and BSC Glasgow. Perhaps it isn't disingenuous to ask why established clubs are loathe to take the plunge and move into a unified set-up? That is certainly the case currently, take up has been minimal. Again we get back to the point that the Junior leagues are largely healthy and there would be a risk inherent in leaving them. I'm sure if Bonnyrigg Rose had any real desire to play Whitehill Welfare then they would've moved over. Why hasn't this happened? I'd argue that Musselburgh have had a better time of it in recent years than Preston, we tend to get more in in the junior game than they did in the LL when they were in there. I did look at your proposal, it's a variation on something I've seen 100 times before.

Kelty will cruise it over the season. 8 games and their goal difference is already 50+, it'll be well into the sixties after they've played Tweedmouth this weekend. Heavily skewed set-up with teams at the lower level who wouldn't win their local amateur leagues playing teams (2 anyway) who are leagues above them. If that isn't farcical I don't know what is. I hugely respect those who keep Tweedmouth running that said, it can't be easy when they are getting hammered regularly but well done to them for trying to build a club in a town with an SPFL team and other teams in the English pyramid.

Tagging Kelty into the EoS is already a farce. They've racked up a 13-0 win already haven't they? I wouldn't want to bet that they don't better that. EoS is a dead rubber this season.

With the exception of Whitehill there there aren't many supporting any of these clubs. I go to Lowland League games occasionally and I'd say that largely the junior set-up is better supported than the LL in the main, I counted the crowd at Hawick v Stirling Uni. last season and reckoned there were 32 paying spectators. No disrespect to those supporters because they are the ones actively supporting their club but I think that in the main you're going to have a job convincing junior clubs that leaving what is a healthy set-up based around the area their clubs play in is worth it to play in a league where take up is that low. Why would Auchinleck abandon the junior game to go into the current LL set-up? People touting the pyramid need to understand that it has to offer something to the clubs it wants to attract. It is a bit half-arsed at the moment.

I think that what you have to ask is what a pyramid system could offer the Junior set up as it is at the moment. The Lowland League doesn't appear to be attracting any additional supporters into the game. I'd agree that the route in is a good idea, East Stirling are struggling to push themselves back into the leagues but let's not kid ourselves on that it's a healthy set-up. BSC Glasgow, based in Alloa, come on, it's a farce. You have to offer something alluring to the Junior set-up before it becomes worthwhile, that hasn't happened yet. I'm still watching good, competitive football at Olivebank while this argument goes on.

It's not inevitable, the junior set-up is healthy and stands well on its own. Well supported clubs at the top, good to excellent players for our level of football at the top level and a decent enough set-up. I love the Junior game, I'd suggest that the senior game has to up the standards it offers before it becomes in any way alluring. Maybe Kelty are getting in under the wire and there will be big changes in the game but the Junior game isn't holding players back, the drive for a pyramid is kind of ignoring the fact that people playing in and watching junior football enjoy the community aspect of it.

I think you've nailed it better than most here Mantis. Junior football is nailed into Scottish football culture and people are brought up in it and identify with their local teams often more than any senior team they follow over and above. The other thing here is that the players should be considered, we're often talking about players that might not have the ability that would carve themselves out a professional career but want to play at the level they're able to without spending their entire Saturday travelling say from Dundee to Dalbeattie to get an evenly matched game. Junior football has served both fans and players well over the years and until the SFA comes up with a plan that isn't half baked and takes account of the wishes of clubs and players then they aren't offering anything to teams that do, It might be that some clubs fancy their chances and make the jump and good luck to them, it might be that under a well-though out structure all these teams and players will find their level and get a game that suits their working/family/social lives. Until somebody can demonstrate that they've achieved that though the Junior culture is going to hold strong because it isn't broken, it's providing all that already and anybody who's looking to change that is going to have to offer better. That hasn't really happened yet. In East Lothian we've got Musselburgh, relegated this season but still strong, we've got Tranent going from strength to strength, Haddington and Dunbar who are both currently on an upward trajectory and all four of them playing in the same division next year. For people who care I find it hard to believe that you've got a league that could be more exciting for supporters, throw in other local games for us in Musselburgh against Dalkeith and Arniston and a couple of trips up to Downfield and Kirrie and we;ve got a great season ahead for those of us who regularly attend. Aye, there might be teams who've maybe outgrown our set-up but Junior football itself isn't at fault and it isn't dying, if those teams feel they want to leave and see how far they can go I'd wish them good luck but I wouldn't want to see the destruction of what we currently have because what we currently have still suits many of our clubs and players.